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re: The national media still thinks AD to Lakers.. I just dont get it
Posted on 2/25/19 at 11:28 am to brmark70816
Posted on 2/25/19 at 11:28 am to brmark70816
In my opinion, your comparisons are way off. You leave out the Kings and Grizzlies picks (both more valuable than any pick the Lakers can offer). Smart on a controlled contract is much more valuable than Ball and his father who does not want to be here. I would take Brown over Kuzma, but it is debatable. Tatum is much more valuable than Ingram and Ingram is due a contract earlier. I don't see how the Lakers deal matches up and am not sure I agree with you that no team can come close to matching that offer (which I would say is OK but not good).
This post was edited on 2/25/19 at 11:29 am
2
Posted on 2/25/19 at 11:40 am to NOSHAU
It's not supposed to be exact, it's an approximation. It is a ton of pieces. We might not value them, but other teams do. Ball is a great example. We know that the Suns really like him. Flip him there. Same with Ingram, Kuzma and Hart. My point is, its a lot of pieces that all have value. I would love Tatum and agree, he is better than any individual I would want from the Lakers. But he is still just one player. If you would honestly say that you prefer Tatum over both Ingram and Kuzma, then we are fundamentally not going to agree. I can flip Ingram and Kuzma for a bunch separately, more than Tatum. That is the crux of my argument..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 11:47 am to brmark70816
quote:
But he is still just one player. If you would honestly say that you prefer Tatum over both Ingram and Kuzma, then we are fundamentally not going to agree. I can flip Ingram and Kuzma for a bunch separately, more than Tatum. That is the crux of my argument..
Pretty much every NBA FO person asked about this has disagreed with your assessment. The vast majority of GM's would take Tatum over BI/Kuz.
Tatum's upside is sky high. Kuz's upside is a really good role player who costs you on D. Ingram can be great, but he has not shown he can play winning basketball. His shot is inconsistent and he only has 1 year until RFA.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 11:54 am to brmark70816
It is still going to come back to “what deal puts the best player on the court?”
Theoretically we could take every player from the Lakers trade, flip them for parts, etc, and have a ton of picks and players.
But if none of those picks or players are going to have the likely impact of Tatum, the deal is still worse than that of the Celtics deal because we are effectively trading a dollar bill for a random assortment of change.
Theoretically we could take every player from the Lakers trade, flip them for parts, etc, and have a ton of picks and players.
But if none of those picks or players are going to have the likely impact of Tatum, the deal is still worse than that of the Celtics deal because we are effectively trading a dollar bill for a random assortment of change.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 12:03 pm to brmark70816
quote:
y point is, its a lot of pieces that all have value. I would love Tatum and agree, he is better than any individual I would want from the Lakers. But he is still just one player. If you would honestly say that you prefer Tatum over both Ingram and Kuzma, then we are fundamentally not going to agree.
So if you had Tatum, would you trade him for Kuzma and Ingram?
Pretty sure no one with a brain would.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 12:04 pm to TeddyPadillac
Magic would, but he’s an idiot.
He also thought Lonzo would be better at point than Russell.
He also thought Lonzo would be better at point than Russell.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 12:34 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
So if you had Tatum, would you trade him for Kuzma and Ingram?
That is a tough question, cause I really don't like Kuzma or Ingram. But value wise, yes I think that is tremendous value. This isn't the 4 quarters for a dollar type of deal. If I had to gauge each value, on a scale to 10. Tatum would be a 7, with a ceiling of 8 (solid all star). Ingram and Kuzma would both be 6s, with a ceiling of 7 or 8. So, I'd give Tatum the edge over both, but they are still solid players and in the right cities/systems/situations I believe could be all star level guys. Just not here..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 1:31 pm to brmark70816
quote:Think about that though. If Ingram/Kuzma could be flipped for assets better than Tatum, don't you think the Lakers, who are desperate to get AD, would have done that in order to surpass Boston in order to get AD? That should tell you that it simply is not the case.
It's not supposed to be exact, it's an approximation. It is a ton of pieces. We might not value them, but other teams do. Ball is a great example. We know that the Suns really like him. Flip him there. Same with Ingram, Kuzma and Hart. My point is, its a lot of pieces that all have value. I would love Tatum and agree, he is better than any individual I would want from the Lakers. But he is still just one player. If you would honestly say that you prefer Tatum over both Ingram and Kuzma, then we are fundamentally not going to agree. I can flip Ingram and Kuzma for a bunch separately, more than Tatum. That is the crux of my argument..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 1:37 pm to NOSHAU
I don't believe that people in LA believe that. I have read a lot of forums, where Laker fans believe that Kuzma is better than Tatum and that Ingram is just raw, but has more potential than both. In the Lakers minds, NO turned down their deal out of spite. That is true to an extent. I think there are shades of truth to both sides. Kuzma and Ingram are not garbage players. But they are not the players that the National Media has pumped them up to be. Their stats are inflated, playing for a bad team. But we probably shouldn't make too big a deal of that, since we have the King of emptying stat padding on our team and that is how he built his legend..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 1:52 pm to brmark70816
quote:What the fans think doesn't matter. If the Lakers could beat Tatum with the assets they could get for Ingram and Kuzma, they would have done it.
I don't believe that people in LA believe that. I have read a lot of forums, where Laker fans believe that Kuzma is better than Tatum and that Ingram is just raw, but has more potential than both. In the Lakers minds, NO turned down their deal out of spite. That is true to an extent. I think there are shades of truth to both sides. Kuzma and Ingram are not garbage players. But they are not the players that the National Media has pumped them up to be. Their stats are inflated, playing for a bad team. But we probably shouldn't make too big a deal of that, since we have the King of emptying stat padding on our team and that is how he built his legend..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:20 pm to NOSHAU
It's not just the fans. I think the Laker's FO believes it as well. The reason we turned them down had nothing to do with the players offered. It was solely because the Pelicans thought they were being pushed to trade a player they didn't want to trade. They think the Lakers orchestrated that demand and they weren't going to cave. They are right. I'm glad the Pelicans did it, but that doesn't change the fact that it was a good package and those are good players..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:23 pm to brmark70816
quote:Of course it had to do with the package offered. If that package were great value and something the Pelicans felt no other team could top, they would have taken the deal. It simply was not good enough to forgo the additional bids that are bound to come in the summer.
It's not just the fans. I think the Laker's FO believes it as well. The reason we turned them down had nothing to do with the players offered.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:28 pm to NOSHAU
quote:
Of course it had to do with the package offered. If that package were great value and something the Pelicans felt no other team could top, they would have taken the deal. It simply was not good enough to forgo the additional bids that are bound to come in the summer.
I agree to a certain point. No doubt they wanted to see the other packages and it was a tight window. So they didn't want to be hurried. But they never seriously considered the Laker's offers. Now if they take a lower offer, they can just blame Demps. Ainge suckered the Pelicans. I'm sure he is dangling Tatum, Brown and those 4 first rounders (you don't think it's a coincidence that the Pelicans countered the Lakers by requesting 4 1sts). When it comes down to it, let's see what the Celtics really offer. Especially after Davis has another 5 months to poison the well..
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:34 pm to brmark70816
quote:
Ingram= Tatum
Not only is this incredibly wrong, I’d take Tatum by himself over the entire Lakers offer.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:35 pm to NOSHAU
quote:
Smart on a controlled contract is much more valuable than Ball
I really don't understand this boards love for Smart. He is going to make $13mil a year and he cannot shoot. 36% for his career, 30% from 3. In their playoff run last season he shot 33% and 22% from 3.
This board would turn on him by mid November watching him brick shot after shot.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:37 pm to brmark70816
If we didn’t want to make a trade before the deadline, it was the Lake Show’s responsibility to make a “Godfather offer” we would take. They explicitly refuses to do so.
Whether the offers drop in comparison to the deadline is kind of irrelevant compared to the fact that teams willing to bid are going to be there come June and that it wasn’t just going to be a two horse race between the Celtics and Lakers.
Since the Lakers can’t just pull out and say “OK, let the Celtics lowball you”, as the Knicks and Clippers are also still in play, the Lakers offer still remains as a floor to what we should expect in a trade.
Whether the offers drop in comparison to the deadline is kind of irrelevant compared to the fact that teams willing to bid are going to be there come June and that it wasn’t just going to be a two horse race between the Celtics and Lakers.
Since the Lakers can’t just pull out and say “OK, let the Celtics lowball you”, as the Knicks and Clippers are also still in play, the Lakers offer still remains as a floor to what we should expect in a trade.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:38 pm to 1ranter1
Still shoots better than Rondo and is under long term contract.
Smart is supposed to be a supporting piece next to Tatum and Jrue, not a centerpiece.
Smart is supposed to be a supporting piece next to Tatum and Jrue, not a centerpiece.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:43 pm to 1ranter1
On his own I don't love Smart, but I think Smart will do great things for Jrue. He'll take play creation and leadership pressure off of Jrue and he adds another high level perimeter defender. Smart + Jrue + Kenny Hustle should pretty much cement the identity of the team as one that actually tries hard on defense for a change.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:44 pm to teke184
quote:
Still shoots better than Rondo
What? Rondo is shooting 44% 41% from 3
Smart hasn’t had a single season shooting above 40%. Rondo hasn’t had a single season shooting below 40%.
Just to compare the starts of their careers, Rondo shot 49% his first 5 season. With 2 years above 50%.
Smart is a TERRIBLE shooter. Not bad, TERRIBLE.
Posted on 2/25/19 at 2:46 pm to 1ranter1
Meant Ball, said Rondo.
Ball is a goddamn horrid shot.
Ball is a goddamn horrid shot.
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