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Message
re: Offseason Dell Demps Job Watch - Day 28ish - And now my watch is ended
Posted on 4/21/16 at 8:20 pm to Paul Orndorff
Posted on 4/21/16 at 8:20 pm to Paul Orndorff
quote:
So it's his fault with the team that was decimated by injuries?
He brought in injury prone players and has a hand in the training staff, so yes. Also, the injury excuse only gets you so far. It may be the only crutch holding him up now.
1
Posted on 4/21/16 at 8:22 pm to Jester
This injury excuse has been going on for 5 years now.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 8:15 am to Macintosh
The more I think about it the more it seems like Joe has been playing the long con perfectly.
He's a notorious leaker so a lot of the smoke about him that we've seen over the past few years has probably come from his camp suggesting he wants the job. If he wants the job he probably didn't want JVG hired last year meaning he likely gave a hearty endorsement of Gentry. Now the team is stuck with Gentry ruling out Thibs/JVG as competition and meaning you need to hire a GM that probably has a previous significant connection to Gentry.
Who are you going to hire, your buddy Joe and his friend John Hammond who not only helped Joe turn Detroit into a champ but also worked on Gentry's coaching staffs for many years? Or the guy that's played a large role in player personnel decisions for the Warriors since 2009. Travis Schlenk started in May of 2009 as Director of Player Personnel for the Warriors and they drafted Steph that June. I'm not saying he's solely responsible for what's gone down with the Warriors, but he's been in the middle of it since the beginning of this current championship run. And I don't know why I'm depressing myself by looking up more stuff about Schlenk when we're going to hire Joe
, but Dumars/Hammond is still better than Loomis and Demps continuing down the current path.
He's a notorious leaker so a lot of the smoke about him that we've seen over the past few years has probably come from his camp suggesting he wants the job. If he wants the job he probably didn't want JVG hired last year meaning he likely gave a hearty endorsement of Gentry. Now the team is stuck with Gentry ruling out Thibs/JVG as competition and meaning you need to hire a GM that probably has a previous significant connection to Gentry.
Who are you going to hire, your buddy Joe and his friend John Hammond who not only helped Joe turn Detroit into a champ but also worked on Gentry's coaching staffs for many years? Or the guy that's played a large role in player personnel decisions for the Warriors since 2009. Travis Schlenk started in May of 2009 as Director of Player Personnel for the Warriors and they drafted Steph that June. I'm not saying he's solely responsible for what's gone down with the Warriors, but he's been in the middle of it since the beginning of this current championship run. And I don't know why I'm depressing myself by looking up more stuff about Schlenk when we're going to hire Joe
, but Dumars/Hammond is still better than Loomis and Demps continuing down the current path.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 9:40 am to TigerinATL
I've been on the Schlenk bandwagon for many years now. It's not happening. We don't have that kind of vision, and Schlenk would probably rather stay in GS as an assistant than take our job.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 10:06 am to TigerinATL
Take a deep breath 
Look at it this way, if Dumars was able to orchestrate half of what you put forth, that's more competence from a Pels exec than we've seen in years
Look at it this way, if Dumars was able to orchestrate half of what you put forth, that's more competence from a Pels exec than we've seen in years
Posted on 4/22/16 at 10:09 am to Fun Bunch
He'd rather be 6th on the pecking order than 1st. Doesn't sound like a guy you want in charge if that's the case, bunchie.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 10:18 am to Boomshockalocka
quote:
He'd rather be 6th on the pecking order than 1st. Doesn't sound like a guy you want in charge if that's the case, bunchie.
Well, he's not 6th. By all accounts he is pretty high up on the totem pole and makes a lot of the calls. He's a player.
Anyway, I think he would rather be with a great organization, with great owners, a great coach, great players, and wait and bide his time for the RIGHT job, with great ownership. We aren't that job. We have a disaster roster, an owner that is super old and probably not calling many shots, a football guy in charge of two franchises, etc etc.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 10:23 am to Fun Bunch
Lacob
Lacob
Meyers
West
Kerr
No way he's got more stroke than any of these guys.
Lacob
Meyers
West
Kerr
No way he's got more stroke than any of these guys.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 10:50 am to Boomshockalocka
I mean, maybe, but again, by all accounts he's a big part of the organization. Regardless, he's an assistant so I'm sure he wants a bigger job.
But my guess is he wants the best bigger job he can get, and is willing to wait around until a good one comes along. I just don't think we are even a good job at this point.
Its a monumental task to rebuild this shitshow, and you have to deal with Loomis who hasn't a clue about basketball, and an old owner that wants to win now instead of doing the right thing and tearing this bad boy down.
But my guess is he wants the best bigger job he can get, and is willing to wait around until a good one comes along. I just don't think we are even a good job at this point.
Its a monumental task to rebuild this shitshow, and you have to deal with Loomis who hasn't a clue about basketball, and an old owner that wants to win now instead of doing the right thing and tearing this bad boy down.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 11:03 am to corndeaux
quote:
Take a deep breath
It's not the direction I want to go in, but I've already reached the acceptance stage on Dumars as POBO. Honestly I've been wanting an experienced POBO since Demps was hired so I've never been anti-Dumars in that role. Loomis isn't a basketball guy first and he's too busy with the Saints at key times of the year to provide the kind of oversight and assistance you'd like your POBO to be able to give.
I don't dislike the Dumars/Hammond combination either. They have a very good draft record and Hammond having worked under both Dumars and Gentry for many years should make it very easy for them to all get on the same page, which might be our biggest problem as an organization.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 11:28 am to TigerinATL
quote:
easy for them to all get on the same page, which might be our biggest problem as an organization.
Yeah. Also the hope Dumars would have the ability to stand up to Benson/Loomis. Tell them there is no quick fix for $$ or good product. Most of Demps big moves the last few years look like "I'm trying to save my job" rather than "this is best for the franchise moving forward." They need a steady hand.
Honestly, if I were running the show, I'd be very interested in Danny Ferry more than any one else. Some stigma from Africa comments, but that seems to have been forgiven/forgotten. ATL experience (blah team, tepid local interest) was fairly impressive
Posted on 4/22/16 at 11:42 am to corndeaux
I'd be all aboard the Ferry express, but I do worry a bit about the backlash for firing an Af-Am GM and hiring Ferry. The SAS's of the world will put us on blast.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 1:53 pm to Fun Bunch
I have no evidence nor inside info, but I think Demps may be gone. Something about the silence is intriguing. And the Loomis/Payton connection with Dumars can't be discounted. Even if it's only for advice. Maybe smoke = fire.
My apologies to those who took ten seconds to read these musings
My apologies to those who took ten seconds to read these musings
Posted on 4/22/16 at 2:30 pm to TigerinATL
quote:Joe Dumars is a writer on House of Cards
The more I think about it the more it seems like Joe has been playing the long con perfectly.
He's a notorious leaker so a lot of the smoke about him that we've seen over the past few years has probably come from his camp suggesting he wants the job. If he wants the job he probably didn't want JVG hired last year meaning he likely gave a hearty endorsement of Gentry. Now the team is stuck with Gentry ruling out Thibs/JVG as competition and meaning you need to hire a GM that probably has a previous significant connection to Gentry.
Who are you going to hire, your buddy Joe and his friend John Hammond who not only helped Joe turn Detroit into a champ but also worked on Gentry's coaching staffs for many years? Or the guy that's played a large role in player personnel decisions for the Warriors since 2009. Travis Schlenk started in May of 2009 as Director of Player Personnel for the Warriors and they drafted Steph that June. I'm not saying he's solely responsible for what's gone down with the Warriors, but he's been in the middle of it since the beginning of this current championship run. And I don't know why I'm depressing myself by looking up more stuff about Schlenk when we're going to hire Joe , but Dumars/Hammond is still better than Loomis and Demps continuing down the current path.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 2:41 pm to eyeran
quote:
Joe Dumars is a writer on House of Cards
I don't think it's all that complex of a plot. The Gentry/Hammond connections are a fortunate accident that play in Dumars' favor. All he really has to do is leak his name at opportune times and not recommend anyone like JVG that also wants the Dumars would have. The hard part is being patient, but it's not like anyone else is blowing up Joe's phone.This post was edited on 4/22/16 at 2:42 pm
Posted on 4/22/16 at 3:55 pm to TigerinATL
Dumars is using the Hinkie "Process" to land the Pels GM job. Long game baby!
Really though, unless the Pelicans make a surprise playoff run next year i'd be surprised if Dumars isn't the Pelicans GM at some point. Too much smoke
With that being said, I doubt Loomis ever gives up his basketball ops role. No reason for him to. Whatever Loomis has on the Benson's, has him locked into what seems like a lifetime contract. He seems untouchable for whatever reason. I'd be shocked if he'd voluntarily give up any of the power he's been handed.
Keeping both jobs might also act as a firewall for if he's ever on the hot seat at one of the gigs. Firing him from one team basically means replacing the head guy in both franchises, which i'm not sure they'd want to do. Especially if one side happens to be performing well at the time. You fire the guy in one organization, but let him continue to run the other? Doubtful. Awkward.
Giving Loomis both positions was such a horrible decision. Horrible. Even giving the job to another Saints guy with no bball experience wouldn't have been as bad. You CAN'T have one guy in charge of both teams.
Really though, unless the Pelicans make a surprise playoff run next year i'd be surprised if Dumars isn't the Pelicans GM at some point. Too much smoke
With that being said, I doubt Loomis ever gives up his basketball ops role. No reason for him to. Whatever Loomis has on the Benson's, has him locked into what seems like a lifetime contract. He seems untouchable for whatever reason. I'd be shocked if he'd voluntarily give up any of the power he's been handed.
Keeping both jobs might also act as a firewall for if he's ever on the hot seat at one of the gigs. Firing him from one team basically means replacing the head guy in both franchises, which i'm not sure they'd want to do. Especially if one side happens to be performing well at the time. You fire the guy in one organization, but let him continue to run the other? Doubtful. Awkward.
Giving Loomis both positions was such a horrible decision. Horrible. Even giving the job to another Saints guy with no bball experience wouldn't have been as bad. You CAN'T have one guy in charge of both teams.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 4:05 pm to eyeran
And part of that reason is because of what is going on right now.
We know they won't do a damn thing until after the NFL draft no matter what.
Other teams are making moves right the frick now.
We know they won't do a damn thing until after the NFL draft no matter what.
Other teams are making moves right the frick now.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 4:13 pm to Fun Bunch
Yup. Loomis has to finish assembling another mediocre Saints draft class before dealing with the other side of the building.
3 or 4 years ago Loomis would at least bother to do a postseason Pels presser. Doesn't even bother anymore.
3 or 4 years ago Loomis would at least bother to do a postseason Pels presser. Doesn't even bother anymore.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 4:28 pm to eyeran
Man, you guys just steady stay in denial, huh?
You really have talked yourselves into this "They are waiting until after the draft" narrative, haven't you?
What is going to have to happen for you all to realize Dell is staying and that this franchise is going to stay with the short sided moves for another offseason? If Dell is still here in June, are you gonna say, "They just aren't hiring Dumars yet, because he isn't good at free agency, but right after free agency, Demps is gone!"
I get that you guys want to hold onto hope, but Demps is gonna be here, and then prepare for more moves in June and July that are made to try and get the Pelicans into the playoffs in 2017.
Sorry to be the messenger. Not like you guys will believe me anyway. You will continue to hold out hope for what you want to happen. To each their own.
You really have talked yourselves into this "They are waiting until after the draft" narrative, haven't you?
What is going to have to happen for you all to realize Dell is staying and that this franchise is going to stay with the short sided moves for another offseason? If Dell is still here in June, are you gonna say, "They just aren't hiring Dumars yet, because he isn't good at free agency, but right after free agency, Demps is gone!"
I get that you guys want to hold onto hope, but Demps is gonna be here, and then prepare for more moves in June and July that are made to try and get the Pelicans into the playoffs in 2017.
Sorry to be the messenger. Not like you guys will believe me anyway. You will continue to hold out hope for what you want to happen. To each their own.
Posted on 4/22/16 at 4:59 pm to Crewz
My whole post was made under the assumption that Demps was coming back...
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