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Started By
Message
re: Devonte Graham to Pelicans for first round 2022 lottery-protected pick 4yrs/47 million
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:40 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:40 am to SlowFlowPro
the draft part is done.
they still hold Lakers and bucks picks which we hope will be free spins at some point. If the pels picks are lottery than griff is gone
We can disagree on that if you like
they still hold Lakers and bucks picks which we hope will be free spins at some point. If the pels picks are lottery than griff is gone
We can disagree on that if you like
1
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:41 am to SlowFlowPro
Salary wise, Graham is the superior asset to a team
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:42 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
we just traded a superior asset (Zo) for less in return than what we spent to get his replacement (Graham) That was not a positive trade, no matter how you want to spin it
I feel like you aren’t taking the contract situations fully into play. The trade really boils down to:
Lonzo at 22 mil, lotto protected 1st
Graham at 11 mil, Tomas at 10 mil, Temple at unknown number, and a 2nd round pick
So in reality we traded a lotto protected 1st for a similar starter at a lower price, depth, more trade flexibility, and a second round pick.
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:43 am to cgrand
quote:
the draft part is done.
how convenient for your "argument"
any outsider looking at this team since the AD trade will see that we clearly have no plan, and even within specific time periods of team building, we have no plan within those areas, either.
it has become a major problem where we are making net-negative sets of deals to unwork the terribly negative deals in the past and now we are without assets to improve the team via trade (b/c, as I've argued for years, Free Agency is not an option for us). that's a MAJOR problem moving into year 3 of our "rebuild"
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:45 am to MrJimBeam
quote:
Salary wise, Graham is the superior asset to a team
that argument works in a vacuum
neither Ball nor Graham is likely a starter on a title team, so you want the superior asset with the bigger contract to make a later deal more likely. Graham's contract is better only if you look at our team and not to the future when we (hopefully) deal him
and this isn't a new argument. i've made it for years, the latest being the Adams extension. you need salary to receive salary. we don't need cap room, we need salaries and assets to trade
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:49 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
neither Ball nor Graham is likely a starter on a title team,
No but he helps push this team to be a playoff team with a better fit/more flexibility than Lonzo (who I think we all know would have been another AD situation) which is what the team needs to prove to ever have some semblence of pulling in free agents for the following season where we have better FA choices.
Again, we aren't done yet (Hopefully) so I'm still reserved on how I feel about next season. I think the main mistakes are in the past season and offseasons, not particularly this one so far. It will be a bust if we can't draw another good player here.
Posted on 8/3/21 at 8:53 am to MrJimBeam
quote:
Again, we aren't done yet (Hopefully)
like i said there are 2 options
if we're done, we're...done
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:08 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
and now we are without assets to improve the team via trade
We are? Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we have all of the below picks except the 2022 ones?
quote:
2022 - Own; LAL
2023 - Own or swap for LAL
2024 - Own or swap for MIL; LAL unless NOP defers and instead receives LAL's 2025 1st round pick
2025 - Own; LAL if NOP defers LAL's 2024 1st round pick; MIL
2026 - Own or swap for MIL
2027 - Own; MIL
2028 - Own
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:12 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:Graham at 11.75 mil is a better asset than Lonzo at 21 mil. Lonzo is not twice as impactful on the court. Sure, he may be a better overall player, but what he gives you on defense isn't worth double the AAV over Graham.
compared to Graham? yes. that's not a controversial statement outside of Pellies sunshine pumping
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:18 am to Mickey Goldmill
quote:Don't mind the melters, our most valuable picks/swaps start in 2024 and these fools are acting like we traded away valuable pieces when we're sending out lottery protected picks
We are? Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we have all of the below picks except the 2022 ones?
The value in our assets are that they are lottery tickets that may end up in the top 5 of a draft. If we're only trading away protected picks, then we limit the potential loss of value in the trade. Late picks aren't worth a ton, because you are very unlikely to even find a contributing rotational player outside of the lottery. You really don't get into "good" value in picks until you're picking in the top 5.
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:18 am to duyp
So the Hornets have lost Graham, they also lost Zeller, and they'll probably lose Monk. Aside form Roz and Ball, they have no guards on the roster. I'm not sure what they're plan is going forward
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:19 am to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
We are? Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we have all of the below picks except the 2022 ones?
but the 2022 lotto protected pick would have put us over the hump man.
don’t you see that?
“I’ve been saying this for years!”
LOL
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:19 am to SCLSUMuddogs
quote:
Aside form Roz and Ball, they have no guards on the roster.
unhappy Bouknight brah
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:20 am to SlowFlowPro
That's true, I always forget the rooks. Still though, there will be a lot of minutes to go around
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:21 am to BallHawk
quote:Barnes is the player I keep coming back to. He seems like a perfect fit on this roster. If the Kings really like Hart, we could work out a deal for him and save them some money after they signed Holmes.
Don't get so focused on the "name" and "position". I think that's the main problem with this board...truly only a handful of us watch more than just the Pels on a semi-regular basis so don't truly understand a guy's game.
Point is that it's far too early to have a true opinion on this off-season. Casting takes on every move made will drive you insane. Just wait it out and then look at the thing as a whole.
For example, I am willing to bet if we end up with Jonas Valanciunas, Harrison Barnes, Devonte Graham, Garrett Temple, Georges Niang, and bring back Willy many will call that a success.
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:27 am to cgrand
quote:I'd rather we trade our 1st round picks with good value deals, something we're not doing.
so you’d rather more first year players taken late or post lottery?
Graham is fine and so is his deal, point is fringe starters/6th man types do not go for 1st round picks in a S&T, see Lonzo for this.
It was discussed at the time of Adams deal when we acquired him, pretty sure by Zach Lowe, that the rumor was no team was going to give a 1st for Adams, and we gave a 1st for Adams then later had to give another 1st to get off of Adams(and Bled)
That's 3 1sts we've lost due to bad valuing of players and the picks.
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:32 am to NOSHAU
quote:
Barnes is the player I keep coming back to. He seems like a perfect fit on this roster.
I know we are approaching “beggars can’t be choosers” status, but Barnes isn’t the wing defender he’s been in the past. He’s been much much better playing the 4 for the Kings than the 3 the last couple of years.
I do like bumping up Ingram to the 2 and seeing if he can use his length to handle smaller players, rather than being bullied by stronger guys.
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:34 am to Baron
I'm fine with Barnes at the 4
I think he'd pair well with Zion in the PNR, too
Like, that would be a nice "second unit" when we stagger Zion. have Graham and Murphy out there with a Zion/Barnes PNR
I think he'd pair well with Zion in the PNR, too
Like, that would be a nice "second unit" when we stagger Zion. have Graham and Murphy out there with a Zion/Barnes PNR
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:34 am to shel311
quote:
That's 3 1sts we've lost due to bad valuing of players and the picks.
which just goes to show that we really don't have a cohesive plan for the development of the roster...
Posted on 8/3/21 at 9:35 am to shel311
quote:
That's 3 1sts we've lost due to bad valuing of players and the picks.
which I get the argument of "well these picks aren't likely to matter" but I also look at them as nice filler when/if ever we make a move for that 3rd star. They give GMs a sort of win to bring back to fans after losing a star "we got 5 first rounders!" So emptying some of that with little to show is annoying
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