re: The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power S1, Episode 4 Thread | Amazon | Available Now

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I love getting summarizations that are dumbed down for the regular fan. Thank you for this.

I have a first US edition Silmarillian I bought for $1 at a library book sale and I struggled trying to read it. So now it’s just a cool book on my shelf.

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Tolkien created a truly magnificent universe, his attention to detail was impeccable.
He was a linguist first and foremost, so he created complete languages in detail as deep as real ones; and then went about fleshing out the peoples he imagined speaking them.

It's similar in a way to learning English, understanding that it is a prominent language (most, up to 90%) in scientific publications, and then extrapolating that those who speak English must then be the leaders in science,... which, given it's importance in all matters, would make the English speakers the most advanced and powerful society in the world. And then building your view of the world on that assertion.

In addition, being a devout Catholic, and also understanding that many non-Christian societies throughout history were good, he struggled with how to reconcile various mythologies with his own beliefs. Hence, the Valar are functionally Olympians (or Asgardians etc), but simultaneously intermediary Angels under the Creator/True God.
And his interpretation is, that as Men don't have the direct firsthand knowledge the Elves had, things become muddled in legends and myths, and Men don't see the full Pantheon- but were not wrong, only incomplete in their knowledge at times.

Hell, he even has an elegant solution to the Flat Earth vs modern understanding that the Earth is round. His answer is, it's been both... and he lays out exactly why and how it all happens. The man was brilliant.

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Sorry, but this is what passes as entertainment?


It's B movie script writing. Fanfic level at most.

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If Amazon would not have not pushed so hard to make Galadriel the main story and something she is not it could be a better story. The majority of criticism I have seen is her character and the writing for it from outside of the diehard lore sites.

Jeff Bezos was given one of the greatest opportunities ever to create a story with unlimited resources and decided to make a fantasy show about a female super hero in Middle Earth.

Again the show is not bad but far from great and like many have posted it is just not a great Tolkien story. Yes I will continue to watch as I do enjoy some of the characters and their story arcs but I have accepted it is a Tolkien knockoff and look past what my expectations for the show could have been.

Also it is free for me so that is a bonus

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Better writing would have shown Galadrial to be badass not in a "warrior" way but shown her being incredibly wise and intuitive and then dealing with a dangerous situation in a calm and methodical way. She would win over Numenorians, in a wise manner, offering some kind of olive branch and actually providing some sort of value instead of demanding to speak to the manager.

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Sounds lame.

Of course she does eventually do that.

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Galadriel seems childish, impudent and impulsive.

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And she has been alive for thousands of years at this point.

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Better writing would have shown Galadrial to be badass not in a "warrior" way but shown her being incredibly wise and intuitive and then dealing with a dangerous situation in a calm and methodical way.

She would win over Numenorians, in a wise manner,

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That would have been different writing, but what you're describing would just be swapping out one set of tropes for another. It would have made no sense after the previous 3 episodes of galadriel. Part of the point of her characterization, as blunt and annoying as it may be, is that she is crass, single-minded, devoted, and most definitely unwise.

She didn't convince the queen at all, which is the writing issue I see. Those flowers falling at the last second is lame.

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That would have been different writing, but what you're describing would just be swapping out one set of tropes for another. It would have made no sense after the previous 3 episodes of galadriel. Part of the point of her characterization, as blunt and annoying as it may be, is that she is crass, single-minded, devoted, and most definitely unwise.

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Right, I mean from the beginning of the show. Galadrial that actually fits with Tolkien would not be one looking to put herself in dangerous situations but rather she would be capable of handling a dangerous situation if it was unavoidable. The most badass act by female in actual Tolkien lore was Luthien who didnt physically fight...but used her other gifts to prevail.

If it is a must, just have Galadrial sail to Numenor with a purpose. Have her deal with a shipwreck or ambush in a cunning way. She should always come across as the wise adult in any room even when there are also other wise people in their own right in the room. Shes one of the oldest living beings in the world...she should not be acting like a 20 year old dude with bloodlust for vengeance.

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OMLandshark

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I just came by to give you kudos for letting those who seem to enjoy the show the ability to enjoy the show, while providing reference if prompted. Not a maturity I would've expected a month ago, but here we are.

I'm no scholar, but I've read the big three, and I'm really enjoying the show understanding it requires a willing suspension of disbelief. As much as they can, they seem to be trying to add color (no pun intended) to the blind spots that exist in the second age without affecting the scripture of it all and condensing a timeline.

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Think the orcs are done well. Weren't they supposed to be more like men back then?

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They were still a work-in-progress at this point in the Second Age, but in the Third Age Gandalf told the hobbits “They were elves once, taken by the dark powers, tortured and mutilated. A ruined and terrible form of life.”

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Non-readers who say that she is older in in RoP than in LOTR just do not seem to grasp how old she already IS in RoP.

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Well, I'm a reader. I already owned and had read The Silmarillion several times over a decade before PJ's films came out.

This isn't the portrayal of Galadriel I had anticipated, or would have went with if I was making this. That said, I do think too much is being made out of that;

People keep harping on "age", like it's the sole factor in maturity. For an Elf, it's not- once you hit adulthood, you don't physically change. You can literally be '20-something' for a thousand years.
People usually mature as they go through life stages; well, the Galadriel in this has yet to marry, yet to have a child. Yet to put roots down in Lothlorien.

Also, I don't think it's so much a youthful petulance, as it is a driven obsession with finding and eliminating Sauron, and finishing off the job of the First Age. Seems like the other Elves are satisfied Morgoth is gone, and now think everything is cool. She is the lone voice saying "no, we HAVE to get THAT motherfricker too. We need to do it now, while he's still down and relatively weak".
That's her interaction with the other Elves.

Her interaction with Men is more of a racial arrogance, Men are beneath Elves. That mindset could be an expected byproduct of her immortality and age... she told Halbrand that if she took the time to list the names of loved ones she has lost, he would die of old age before she was done. That statement, I think, is meant to underscore two things= first is that she has a LOT of motivation to find Sauron. Second is that Men appear as fleeting to her, individual Men don't last long enough to form any relationships etc.

I think another issue, is a decision the showrunners made to present the tale. Looks like they assumed the majority of fans only know the movies, and not the deeper lore of the writings. This seems correct, if you look at the pre-show articles about it, lots of wonderings about Gandalf, Aragorn, Hobbits etc.
But the fact is, there are only 2 characters who will "return", Elrond and Galadriel. The rest will all be new, and the kingdoms will be, too.

So they're using those 2, to tie in the rest of the story. Galadriel with Numenor, Elrond with Eregion and Khazad Dum. Whoever drew the Numenor angle would feel out of place.
I guess Elrond would be more awkward, because you'd almost assume his ties to the Numenorean bloodline might give him more credence and influence. Galadriel, to them, is just "arrogant Elf", while Elrond would be the brother of their first King, something that might defuse the anti-Elf sentiment.

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Maybe a different Ishtari?

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That's the consensus opinion.