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Message
re: JJ Abrams wrote all 3 screenplays for the sequel trilogy, Johnson scrapped everything
Posted on 3/6/18 at 12:21 pm to Warfarer
Posted on 3/6/18 at 12:21 pm to Warfarer
quote:
And then the fact that the resistance is left flying off in the Falcon makes it worse because without fast forwarding 10 years, there is no way that they defeat the First Order anytime soon.
This was the first thing I thought as the movie went to the end credits. No matter what you thought of the direction of the film itself (horrible casino planet subplot, unnecessary additional characters, changing Luke's personality for most of the film, etc.), the film ended well off the road and in a ditch.
1
Posted on 3/6/18 at 12:47 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
i think what happened is they just asked some focus groups about TFA and the #1 compliant was too much like NH, so they said okay lets go in the other direction & just left it at that.
While I agree, it's like Disney said, "well, VII was a good start. Now, let's make this one as shitty as possible."
Posted on 3/6/18 at 12:50 pm to RedPants
quote:
Plus both of their most powerful people are now dead, and Kylo got completely embarrassed in front of his troops by a freaking Luke projection. The conflict is useless, the rest of the galaxy can just ignore the two kids fighting in the corner and work things out on their own.
Yep. The thing is rians theme was “kill the past” so it could be intentional to fit with the theme but there’s an entire third movie in the trilogy that seeming deals with irrelevant bands of outcasts fighting each other for control of a galaxy with absolutely no way to enforce control once they win. If it was a finale I guess it could have worked?
Posted on 3/6/18 at 12:55 pm to Adam Banks
quote:
The thing is rians theme was “kill the past” so it could be intentional to fit with the theme but there’s an entire third movie in the trilogy that seeming deals with irrelevant bands of outcasts fighting each other for control of a galaxy with absolutely no way to enforce control once they win. If it was a finale I guess it could have worked?
I don't see how they can work the final film without a significant jump in time.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:01 pm to DarthRebel
quote:
To put this in financial context. TLJ worldwide box office is $700 million less than TFA. Disney needs to pay attention.
If you piss off the parents and older crowd, you will not get a younger generation of SW fans. Kids these days do not need Star Wars and have many more options than what we had as kids.
This is such an excellent point. I'm 47, so I'm really that first generation of young kids that saw Star Wars in the theater in '77. Star Wars and Indiana Jones were the be all end all...and it was largely our fandom that drove the prequels at first. Partly because we, ourselves, had been waiting for years to get back to the story but by them many of us had kids of our own and had been telling them about our experiences with it. I still remember WANTING to love Phantom Menage and then finally having to admit it was s steaming pile of shite.
I enjoyed TFA even with it's issues and was looking forward to getting past the reboot phase with TLJ. what they allowed Rian Johnson to do with the franchise has completely killed my interest in the main line story at this point. I already hate the whole idea of a Solo movie so I'm not going to see that, and unless EpisodeIX gets tremendous reviews that suggest they went back and fixed all the frick ups from TLJ, I won;t watch it either.
My boys are now far more invested in the various super hero franchises and couldn't care less about Star Wars. For them, there is no nostalgic pull so these movies REALLY DO rise or fall on their own merits, and as long as they suck there are far better options for fantasy movies like these.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:08 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
I mean, didn’t they really? It’s been less than a week since Rey left Jakku. They lost their giant space station and seemingly their entire fleet. Am I really supposed to believe that no one else can field some sort of fleet to take the First Order? Really they seem nothing more than genocidal nuisances at this point. Both sides pretty much engaged in mutual destruction. I have no idea where this universe stands.
What makes it worse is that there was this really awesome thing called the extended universe that Disney decided to throw in the shitter that really fleshed things out.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:09 pm to Bankshot
quote:
the film ended well off the road and in a ditch.
I think that was kind of the point. Poe says , "We are the spark that will light the fire that will burn the First Order down." Even though there was only about a dozen Resistance fighters left at the end, 'the fire' will spread, uniting everyone that opposes the First Order across the galaxy. Or the First Order finds the Millennium Falcon, destroys it and ends the Resistance once and for all.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:14 pm to Red5LSU
quote:
I think that was kind of the point. Poe says , "We are the spark that will light the fire that will burn the First Order down." Even though there was only about a dozen Resistance fighters left at the end, 'the fire' will spread, uniting everyone that opposes the First Order across the galaxy. Or the First Order finds the Millennium Falcon, destroys it and ends the Resistance once and for all.
Right, but just like the resistance, what's really left of the First order to combat? They lost their death star and now at the end of TLJ they lose their entire fleet when their flagship exploded. There is a handful of troopers, Ren (who was just embarrassed in front of all his people) and Hux (who is the biggest child in the galaxy).
That's a hard thing to rally the galaxy to fight against.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:29 pm to Red5LSU
quote:
I think that was kind of the point. Poe says , "We are the spark that will light the fire that will burn the First Order down." Even though there was only about a dozen Resistance fighters left at the end, 'the fire' will spread, uniting everyone that opposes the First Order across the galaxy. Or the First Order finds the Millennium Falcon, destroys it and ends the Resistance once and for all.
But this doesn’t make sense within the context of the film. Who is going to spread the message? No one in the Millenium Falcon knows what happened to Luke. Kylo Ren may have killed him for all they know. I don’t think the First Order is going to talk. Plus they lost everything and are at best a crumbled North Korea.
It’s just pointless. It really is if the Nazis and Soviets mutually destroyed all of their forces at Stalingrad. The rest of the world would be thinking “Well that really worked out in the end, didn’t it?” and then collectively rejoice.
This post was edited on 3/6/18 at 1:32 pm
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:32 pm to DarthRebel
quote:
If you piss off the parents and older crowd, you will not get a younger generation of SW fans. Kids these days do not need Star Wars and have many more options than what we had as kids.
Spot on. Kids go mostly because of the parents. They have so much other stupid shite they can do now that it’s impossible to make movies for this generation now. But that’s what they tried to do, make a SW movie for the new generation.
And it was complete and utter donkey shite
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:34 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
"Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams met to discuss all of this, although Episode VIII is still his very own work," Ridley explained of Abrams' involvement with The Last Jedi. "I believe Rian didn’t keep anything from the first draft of Episode VIII."
People are going to blame Rian Johnson for this but really the blame lies with Kathleen Kennedy and other Disney execs who allowed it to happen.
I think we should blame all three: Rian, Kennedy, and the other executives who didn't raise red flags when the story stopped making sense. If I were JJ Abrahms I would also feel pretty betrayed when I realized how badly Rian dead ended the plots they apparently developed collaboratively and JJ began in TFA.
Far too many things just don't make sense within TLJ and within the larger Star Wars story. It seemed pretty obvious that Rian didn't treat MH with respect but I am still surprised he extended that type of professional middle finger to JJ as well.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:35 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
While I agree, it's like Disney said, "well, VII was a good start. Now, let's make this one as shitty as possible."
More like Rian is a lazy piece of shite who wrote one draft for a major motion picture, passed it off to Kathleen Kennedy and she creamed her panties to it.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:46 pm to molsusports
quote:
I think we should blame all three: Rian, Kennedy, and the other executives who didn't raise red flags when the story stopped making sense
It’s really the Script Supervisor Ruth Atkinson which I also blame. She has a shockingly awful IMDB page, and the only decent film on there is Hot Fuzz, but that’s because Edgar Wright is so talented he doesn’t need a Script Supervisor. I doubt she improved a single thing in that script due to how ridiculously layered it is.
This post was edited on 3/6/18 at 1:50 pm
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:51 pm to OMLandshark
I'd be totally fine with it if Episode 9 started up with Luke waking up from some dream where he imagined Episode 8 as a possible future, and they went from there.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:52 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
TLJ has fundamental problems that have nothing to do with gender or race.
True. And I often see people emphasize these when they don't want to get dragged into a political discussion with a low likelihood of a good outcome.
quote:
the "SJW" angle on this movie is hilariously overblown.
Do you think you'd feel the same if the tables were turned? Let's say someone green lights a sequel to A Wrinkle in Time or the Hunger Games and then systematically demolishes the positive female role models that were beloved by so many young girls.
Wouldn't the women who grew up loving those characters have a pretty fair amount of justification if they were angry? Especially if you overlaid on top of that an affiliation between the new director and his boss for very right leaning politics and maybe inserted some random arse libertarian or pro gun propaganda into one of those sequels?
Because when you look at what Rian and Kennedy made you have to attribute their behavior to more than simple bad judgment. We should just want both fired for being bad at their jobs but we should also be pretty understanding of the fans of the franchise who were duped into buying tickets to a product that was embarrassingly bad.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:53 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
o put this in financial context. TLJ worldwide box office is $700 million less than TFA. Disney needs to pay attention.
If you piss off the parents and older crowd, you will not get a younger generation of SW fans. Kids these days do not need Star Wars and have many more options than what we had as kids.
This is such an excellent point. I'm 47, so I'm really that first generation of young kids that saw Star Wars in the theater in '77. Star Wars and Indiana Jones were the be all end all...and it was largely our fandom that drove the prequels at first
TLJ will soon be surpassed by Black Panther. I don't care how much of an event that film is, TLJ should've easily outsold it.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 1:58 pm to RLDSC FAN
Disney put someone in charge that was more worried about girl power and social issues instead of putting out a good star wars product. How she hasn't been fired is beyond me
Posted on 3/6/18 at 2:04 pm to OMLandshark
Easy fixes for jj:
Luke is alive... He Transported. Himself to a new higher plane and has learned how To pass back and forth btwn worlds. Although there is an unintended consequence to this as a new enemy has also transported himself back and becomes a new foe.
Kylo lied about Reys parents.
Rose died off screen.
Luke is alive... He Transported. Himself to a new higher plane and has learned how To pass back and forth btwn worlds. Although there is an unintended consequence to this as a new enemy has also transported himself back and becomes a new foe.
Kylo lied about Reys parents.
Rose died off screen.
Posted on 3/6/18 at 2:08 pm to Tiger Ryno
(no message)
This post was edited on 5/27/23 at 2:28 pm
Posted on 3/6/18 at 2:11 pm to Tiger Ryno
quote:
Easy fixes for jj:
Luke is alive... He Transported. Himself to a new higher plane and has learned how To pass back and forth btwn worlds. Although there is an unintended consequence to this as a new enemy has also transported himself back and becomes a new foe.
Kylo lied about Reys parents.
Rose died off screen.
Nah, all of those are cheap tricks. Even with how bad VIII is, there is plenty there for IX. It's salvageable. You just have to have someone willing to make a good, competent film and not a knock off the MCU.
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