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re: Top 8 NBA Teams Since 1980 and play them against each other - who is best?
Posted on 6/6/17 at 6:56 pm to rocket31
Posted on 6/6/17 at 6:56 pm to rocket31
Stats like ELO are relative and when you consider that the Warriors are playing in the most top heavy and weakest eras as far as balance and parody and the 96 Bulls was an expansion year with 5 franchises less than 7 years of age you have to take that number with a grain of salt.
This post was edited on 6/6/17 at 6:58 pm
2
Posted on 6/6/17 at 7:00 pm to Madking
i can agree with that, which is why focusing only on the post season is important too
bulls lost 3 playoff games total in 1996. currently, GSW has lost 0
bulls lost 3 playoff games total in 1996. currently, GSW has lost 0
Posted on 6/6/17 at 7:16 pm to rocket31
True and I believe the 01 Lakers lost 1 game the entire playoffs. Plus the older teams played 5 first round games in their playoff format the new format is 7 games which needs to be changed and the finals format was different and the rest days were different throuout so there are a lot of subtle differences that have to be accounted for that's why championships are so important. They show that no matter the era that particular team met all challenges and conquered all hurdles regardless of differences.
This post was edited on 6/6/17 at 7:22 pm
Posted on 6/6/17 at 8:28 pm to ThePTExperience1969
quote:
The objective is to win and dominate not how many minutes one plays which is completely irrelevant to how good a team is.
quote:The Bulls had the 17th SOS. Regardless that's why SRS is a good metric since it adjust MOV for SOS. So that adjustment still puts the Warriors at 11.35 compared to the 10.80 for the Bulls.
I'm not saying it isn't arguable if the Warriors win this title, but we have to account for the fact they played a very weak schedule(22nd best in the league) compared to the 97 Bulls
quote:But it provides context regarding their quality, expecially when teams like the 2013-2014 Spurs and this year's Warriors limit their minutes of their best players yet still dominate. Then when they shorten their benches in the playoffs they really shine.
The objective is to win and dominate not how many minutes one plays which is completely irrelevant to how good a team is.
For example, the 97 Bulls had the SRS of 10.80 so a 7.6 MOV through the first 2 games of the finals is Impressive yet expected given the quality of completion.
On the other hand, the Warriors had an SRS of 11.35 so their 18.9 MOV in the playoffs is insane. And this likely to he partially due to the differences in playing time in the playoffs compared to the regular season.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 8:39 pm to buckeye_vol
Didn't Jordan score 63 points on the mid 80's Celtics in the playoffs, with no help?
Posted on 6/6/17 at 8:43 pm to Madking
quote:How do you figure this?
Stats like ELO are relative and when you consider that the Warriors are playing in the most top heavy and weakest eras as far as balance and parody
The 80's had very little parody. In the 10 seasons from 79-80 to 88-89, the Lakers represented the West 8 times, and the Rockets represented the West the other 2 times. In that same time span, the east was represented by the Celtics 5 times, the 76ers 3 times, and the Pistons 2 times. So 20 conference champions were comprised of 5 teams total.
And for the quality of the bottom of the league, just look at the 85-86 season. 6 teams below .500 made the playoffs including the 30-52 Bulls. The bottom 8 seeds averaged 38.5 wins.
I don't think the NBA is a league that sets up for parody.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 8:47 pm to jprice4608
quote:Yes. They got swept and got beat by 18.5 points in the other 2 games.
Didn't Jordan score 63 points on the mid 80's Celtics in the playoffs, with no help?
Of course it was off that the Bulls with a 30-52 record were able to make the playoffs.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 8:59 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
Of course it was off that the Bulls with a 30-52 record were able to make the playoffs.
For context, Jordan missed nearly that whole season with a broken foot. The Bulls would have had a whole lot better record had he played the other 60+ games.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 9:40 pm to rocket31
Problem with comparing runs in the playoffs is that the golden state warriors haven't played a team worth a damn in these playoffs given the injuries to Spurs.
This is the first series they've played a healthy team with a pulse.
They are a great team, but people are drinking too much koolaid and ignoring context.
This is the first series they've played a healthy team with a pulse.
They are a great team, but people are drinking too much koolaid and ignoring context.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 9:59 pm to Geauxgurt
Steph Curry
Kevin Durant
Draymond Green
Andre Igudoula
Klay Thompson
They have all been on Team USA. Four have been on an All-NBA team in the last couple of seasons. Two have won MVP honors. Two have won All-NBA defense hornors.
I don't think you find that much elite depth on any other team.
Kevin Durant
Draymond Green
Andre Igudoula
Klay Thompson
They have all been on Team USA. Four have been on an All-NBA team in the last couple of seasons. Two have won MVP honors. Two have won All-NBA defense hornors.
I don't think you find that much elite depth on any other team.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 10:20 pm to Colonel Flagg
I'll take early 2000 Lakers all day. Especially the first year with Glen Rice. That 2000 finals Shaq was by far the best player ever. Averaged 38 PPG/16 RPG against a much bigger front court than what the Warriors would use. He started getting foot problems in 04 but from 98-03 he was better at his peak than even Jordan. Shaq's dominance however was only about 8 years to Jordan's 15 which why Jordan ranks higher overall.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 10:21 pm to VA LSU fan
You may disagree but the 2002 Lakers were the best of that bunch no question.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 10:26 pm to kciDAtaE
quote:
Depends on which officials are calling the game. 80's refs or today's.
So when they called way more fouls (in the 1980s) or when they swallowed the whistle (like they do today)?
Posted on 6/6/17 at 10:32 pm to buckeye_vol
The 80s had Phili Houston Boston Lakers Detriot off the top of my head who all won titles that's not even including MJ and the Bulls the Knicks the Cavs or Portland. Right now there are 2 teams capable and that's it, even if Cleveland lost one of its big 3 they'd still sleepwalk through the east that's how bad it is. There's no comparison between the competition in the two eras plus when you factor in the avg age of the league now compared to college graduates and actual men who played in that era, the worklike approach to the game the overall knowledge of the game and the sheer physicality of older men in general it adds to the difficulty. Throwing out the evolutionary advantages and comparing the competition relative to the era it's not close. We are witnessing the worst era since the 60s as far as overall competition and parody. And I agree the league isn't set up for parody but that can be fixed very easily though I'm not sure it will be with this spineless worm of a commissioner.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 10:47 pm to Madking
The 1983 Philadelphia 76ers arguably were the best team that decade: average strength of schedule, 8 pt MOV, SRS of 7.53, 12-1 that postseason, top five offense and defense that year, Billy Cunningham, Moses Malone(MVP), Julius Erving, Andrew Toney, Bobby Jones, Mo Cheeks, Iavaroni, Clint Richardson, etc. Truly a dominant team.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 11:00 pm to Madking
quote:Correct, and these 5 teams were the only teams to even make the finals.
The 80s had Phili Houston Boston Lakers Detriot off the top of my head who all won titles
In the past 10 years, the East has had 3 different teams in the finals (Heat, Celtics, and Cavs) while the West has had 5 teams (Lakers, Mavericks, Thunder, Spurs, and Warriors). Of course, the last 3 years it's been only 2 teams, but the 80's weren't much better.
Again, from 79- 98 the Lakers made 8 finals in 10 years, and played the Celtics 3 times, 76ers 3 times, and Pistons 2 times. The Rockets were the only other team from the west to make it and they played the Celtics 2 times.
So the 80's had 4 matchups in 10 years:
Lakers-Celtics (3 games)
Lakers-76ers (3 games)
Lakers-Pistons (2 games)
Rockets-Celtics (2 games)
That wasn't a lot of parody.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 11:04 pm to ThePTExperience1969
'83 Sixers...well, they finally won...but c'mon man. It's between the '86 Celtics and '87 Lakers.
This is settled history.
Bird was the league MVP for the third straight year. This is a feat that no other forward has accomplished in NBA history. Parish and McHale continued to be All Stars. Walton won the NBA’s Sixth Man Award. The Celtics posted a 67-15 record including a 40-1 record at home. It was a great season record-wise.
In the playoffs, the Celtics started out by sweeping Michael Jordan’s Bulls.
The Celtics then went on the play the 50-win Atlanta Hawks. The Hawks were led by Dominique Wilkins, Kevin Willis, and Doc Rivers. The Celtics won the series 4-1. In the clinching game, Bird had 36 points and 10 rebounds in that game.
On to the Eastern Conference Finals where the Celtics faced the 57-25 Milwaukee Bucks. 57-25! You would think a team with that type of season would be able to put up a strong series. Think again. The Celtics swept them too. In fact, the average margin of victory was 15 points.
3. The overall talent level of the top six players on this team was second to none. This team had five Hall of Famers with Bird, McHale, Parish, Walton, and DJ.
All 5 starters averaged more than 15 points a game in the playoffs.
There were games down the stretch that the Celtics would go with Parish, Walton, McHale, Bird (as a guard), and DJ.
Bird was 29 years old and at his peak...he received 73 of 78 NBA MVP votes that year and was named S.I.'s Sportsman of the year.
And people talk about the Spurs passing these past 10 years...look at the origin...the great team passing of the 1986 Celtics.
This post was edited on 6/6/17 at 11:05 pm
Posted on 6/6/17 at 11:09 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
The 1986 Celtics are a personal favorite of mine but after assessing the relevant evidence, I have to submit the 83 76ers as better: tougher SOS, better overall playoff record, Moses was MVP too, played at a faster pace that season relative to the Celts in 86 in the league, and only won two less games. The 83 Sixers honestly present a more impressive resume.
This post was edited on 6/6/17 at 11:11 pm
Posted on 6/6/17 at 11:15 pm to AlaTiger
There's no way in hell the Kobe/Shaq Lakers would beat that Bulls team. None.
Posted on 6/6/17 at 11:21 pm to Bench McElroy
quote:
How do you stop a team like the Shaq/Kobe Lakers when Derek Fisher is knocking down threes at a 75% clip?
Pippen, Jordan, and Ron Harper would've smothered Kobe and Fisher. Then it would come down to whether or not Shaq could outplay Jordan 4 times. My answer would be no.
This post was edited on 6/6/17 at 11:21 pm
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