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re: Should basketball coaches be able to decline free throws?
Posted on 1/27/16 at 1:35 pm to CubsFanBudMan
Posted on 1/27/16 at 1:35 pm to CubsFanBudMan
If the foul happens in the flow of the game no, HackAShaqs should be declineable
Posted on 1/27/16 at 2:38 pm to CubsFanBudMan
quote:
Would it improve the end of basketball games if coaches were allowed to decline free throws, and inbound the ball instead?
Yes.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 2:44 pm to LNCHBOX
quote:Lotta goons on that bench with 0 fouls.
You can't ignore that it will add to your foul total. You keep saying it as if it's some small, insignificant thing, but it isn't.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 2:46 pm to Asphodel
quote:Not under the OP's idea. The team can decline free throws in this hypothetical. It's unrealistic and would make the ends of games far worse than they are now.
If you are lunging for the ball, then that's not an off-the-ball foul. On-ball fouls in the penalty are always free throws.
quote:Hacka occurs in probably less than 1% of all NBA games. It isn't some epidemic. There are four non-all-stars in the NBA who get hacked. That isn't worth changing a rule.
I assume we're talking about trying to eliminate the "hack-a" strategy from the game, and only talking about off-ball fouls.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 2:50 pm to Chucktown_Badger
quote:Wrong. With one minute left, it behooves the team who is ahead to keep the ball rather than shoot free throws. This creates a scenario far worse than what we currently have. The trailing team inevitably will keep fouling, and the only thing that will happen is a lot of inbound plays. What we have now is way better.
And keep in mind that when they do foul, the other coach could actually have his guy shoot the free throws. So then the strategy for the team that's down becomes, who can we foul that might actually take them?
Posted on 1/27/16 at 2:54 pm to Chucktown_Badger
quote:But it takes 40 before a team runs out of guys. Average team commits what?--20 in a game?
A foul puts a player in jeopardy of being disqualified,
If I'm down 8 with 1:00 left, I have my players foul asap. The other team just keeps inbounding because they want to run clock. It's terrible. The idea is unrealistic because of this inevitability.
quote:So your idea is good pending the players of the universe actually being good free throw shooters? Kind of like what we have now?
Not to mention the coach of the team who is up can choose to shoot them. It's weighing the risk/reward of either having to inbound the ball with no chance at any points vs. taking a shot for a point or two but them not being guaranteed.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 2:54 pm to Asphodel
quote:
Very rarely does a bad free throw shooter shoot free throws at end of game situations because his teammates don't pass him the ball when they know the other team is looking to foul.
Incorrect...the act of intentional fouling has now been extended to "jump on their back while boxing out" and "run through them when they are setting a screen". If Andre Drummond is on the floor in the last two minutes, he essentially has to stand in the corner to avoid being fouled and he never touches the ball.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 3:01 pm to brgfather129
Too lazy to read this thread. I know the purists have probably made their point and changing a basic tenet/historical tactic of the game seems crazy, but I have always felt that fouling to catch up cheapens the game and defeats the purpose of a good floor game/game control. FTs should be a reward, not a penalty IMO.
This post was edited on 1/27/16 at 3:02 pm
Posted on 1/27/16 at 3:03 pm to Bunk Moreland
Passing a rule that a player who fouls must sit at the scorer's table until the next dead ball completely solves this. It would change the game a smidge, but it completely solves this problem.
It isn't that big a problem, though.
It isn't that big a problem, though.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 7:02 pm to ballscaster
quote:
Wrong. With one minute left, it behooves the team who is ahead to keep the ball rather than shoot free throws. This creates a scenario far worse than what we currently have. The trailing team inevitably will keep fouling, and the only thing that will happen is a lot of inbound plays. What we have now is way better.
If I'm a coach who is up 2 with a minute left, and my guy who is an 85% free throw shooter gets fouled, there's a damn good chance I have him shoot those and try to stretch to a two possession lead, than risk having to inbound the ball with that slim a lead (remember, if team that's down doesn't foul, and I don't convert, they now have the ball down two...so coaches would not foul on purpose in this situation).
Also, as to your point about "a lot of goons on the bench with zero fouls", that also doesn't make sense...a foul resets the shot clock, so if your strategy is just "foul relentlessly with my bench guys", you will either have all your bench guys foul out without ever gaining possession, or those guys will get torched by the opposition before they can foul.
You have yet to post one thought in this thread where I go "that's actually a good point." Like I said earlier, the only real objection I can imagine would be that there would still be the same number of fouls, just that they'd be followed by inbounds passes. But, as was the point of this thread, the team who is getting fouled should get to weigh the risk/reward of trying to extend with FTs or inbound against pressure.
This post was edited on 1/27/16 at 7:16 pm
Posted on 1/27/16 at 7:23 pm to Master of Sinanju
quote:
Teams should have a designated ft shooter. Nothing worse than watching some 50%er clang it off the goal.
Must be a Rockets or Clippers fan
Posted on 1/27/16 at 9:06 pm to AjaxFury
quote:
There is no rule for intentional fouls in the nba!!
Yes there is. It's called the off the ball foul rule and it's been in place since the sixties, they just never call it. It only applies to the last two minutes of the game and you get foul shots and the ball, though I think they updated it to allow teams to pick the shooter from anyone now.
It just never gets called
Posted on 1/27/16 at 9:10 pm to extremetigerfanatic
quote:They call it all of the time. Go read the rule about it.
It's called the off the ball foul rule and it's been in place since the sixties, they just never call it
quote:It applies all game, but you only get a few throw + the ball in the last 2 minutes. I already posted that in this thread. It doesn't get called much in the last 2 minutes because people foul the ball handler because they know the rules.
. It only applies to the last two minutes of the game and you get foul shots and the ball, though I think they updated it to allow teams to pick the shooter from anyone now.
It just never gets called
Posted on 1/27/16 at 9:18 pm to PearlJam
I can't think of ever seeing it called. Like ever... In 25years of watching the nba.
Posted on 1/27/16 at 9:20 pm to extremetigerfanatic
quote:Before 2 minutes left it's just a two shot foul. Watch a clippers game and you will see it called. Under 2 minutes and people don't commit away from the play fouls because it makes no sense to do it.
I can't think of ever seeing it called. Like ever... In 25years of watching the nba.
This post was edited on 1/27/16 at 9:21 pm
Posted on 1/28/16 at 1:53 am to Chucktown_Badger
quote:No shite, especially since players have made about 69% of their free throws for the past 50 years. The 16% difference between the decades-long mean and your hypothetical is, I'd say, pretty significant.
If I'm a coach who is up 2 with a minute left, and my guy who is an 85% free throw shooter gets fouled, there's a damn good chance I have him shoot those and try to stretch to a two possession lead, than risk having to inbound the ball with that slim a lead (remember, if team that's down doesn't foul, and I don't convert, they now have the ball down two...so coaches would not foul on purpose in this situation).
So let's replay your scenario with a 69% ft shooter. Every coach on earth in-bounds it here.
It just isn't a good idea. I know it sounds good, but it's really, really terrible.
quote:I have a better chance of winning by playing the style that will foul all my players out than by playing the "orthodox" style in this case. My point makes complete sense.
Also, as to your point about "a lot of goons on the bench with zero fouls", that also doesn't make sense...a foul resets the shot clock, so if your strategy is just "foul relentlessly with my bench guys", you will either have all your bench guys foul out without ever gaining possession, or those guys will get torched by the opposition before they can foul
quote:Then do more thinking. The idea presented in the op is one I respect because of its initial line of thinking, but the proposed rule is so much worse than what we have now that we currently have a situation where no governing body has ever considered it.
You have yet to post one thought in this thread where I go "that's actually a good point."
Posted on 1/28/16 at 5:16 am to CubsFanBudMan
I apologize if this has been posted but I tried to read the whole thread and my ADHD kicked in on page three.
I get where the OP is coming from. I have no problem with the original rules of basketball. The problem is when the 3 pointer came in to play. It allows the team that is behind, a chance to score 3 points for every 2 point possession for the team ahead.
My suggestion:
If you foul a team in the backcourt, it's two shots and the ball for the offense. That would allow the team ahead to run off about 10 seconds before they are fouled.
I get where the OP is coming from. I have no problem with the original rules of basketball. The problem is when the 3 pointer came in to play. It allows the team that is behind, a chance to score 3 points for every 2 point possession for the team ahead.
My suggestion:
If you foul a team in the backcourt, it's two shots and the ball for the offense. That would allow the team ahead to run off about 10 seconds before they are fouled.
Posted on 1/28/16 at 8:37 am to CubsFanBudMan
NO.
if a team has the lead with 24 or 30 (college) seconds left, they could theoretically run out the clock if they had the option to decline shooting free throws.
if a team has the lead with 24 or 30 (college) seconds left, they could theoretically run out the clock if they had the option to decline shooting free throws.
Posted on 1/28/16 at 9:27 am to 632627
the NBA is going to end up having to take action, since things are reaching a logical extreme w/ guys jumping on an opponent's back during free throws and fouling the inbounder now (I confess I did not know you could do that, I figured it was a technical).
When it effects the entertainment value of the league, their hand will be forced. I don't think that declining free throws will happen, since shooting free throws is part of the game, rather consequences of that strategy will change to discourage the strategy -- like 2 plus the ball or 3 shots or something.
When it effects the entertainment value of the league, their hand will be forced. I don't think that declining free throws will happen, since shooting free throws is part of the game, rather consequences of that strategy will change to discourage the strategy -- like 2 plus the ball or 3 shots or something.
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