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Career talk - Organizational Culture
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:22 am
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:22 am
I really didn't want to post this on the OT because I'm not looking for 'hookers and blow' answers. Hopefully some of you have some experience in dealing with turnaround and/or working around some of this and are interested in having some real discussion.
The basics: I work in a mid-sized (700+/- employees) regional organization with about 10 locations. There are some pretty blatantly unhealthy work behaviors going on that are known to upper management that are just flat out ignored. The only reasons I can come up with are that a) its just hard to hold people accountable and/or b) management is indifferent or doesn't realize the true cancer that these issues are.
1. Half of the executive team is invisible. Lots of getting to work @ 10, leaving @ 2 type behavior.
2. Employees stealing time....to the tune of thousands of dollars per year in overtime and fake expense reimbursement.
Is it possible that the organization is structured in a way that keeps everyone so busy and overworked that management doesn't have the time or desire to create another shitstorm by taking action against these behaviors? Or is it more likely that management is just flat out bad?
The basics: I work in a mid-sized (700+/- employees) regional organization with about 10 locations. There are some pretty blatantly unhealthy work behaviors going on that are known to upper management that are just flat out ignored. The only reasons I can come up with are that a) its just hard to hold people accountable and/or b) management is indifferent or doesn't realize the true cancer that these issues are.
1. Half of the executive team is invisible. Lots of getting to work @ 10, leaving @ 2 type behavior.
2. Employees stealing time....to the tune of thousands of dollars per year in overtime and fake expense reimbursement.
Is it possible that the organization is structured in a way that keeps everyone so busy and overworked that management doesn't have the time or desire to create another shitstorm by taking action against these behaviors? Or is it more likely that management is just flat out bad?
16
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:45 am to meAnon
quote:
Or is it more likely that management is just flat out bad?
Your #1 item points to this being the case.
Maybe I'm jaded because I'm older, but I feel like the vast majority of large companies are like you described. I quit caring about it a long time ago and just do what's expected of me and go home to my family every night.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:48 am to meAnon
If it's bad enough that you think there may be criminal stuff going on that could impact the company as a going concern find a new job.
If it's a bunch of dumbass middle management then go to work, collect your paycheck, and go home. As long as they keep paying you it's not worth your time or effort
If it's a bunch of dumbass middle management then go to work, collect your paycheck, and go home. As long as they keep paying you it's not worth your time or effort
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:52 am to meAnon
You’re probably posting this while at work.
“…first take the beam of wood out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to take the splinter out of your brother's eye.”
Matthew 7:5
“…first take the beam of wood out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to take the splinter out of your brother's eye.”
Matthew 7:5
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:55 am to meAnon
quote:
1. Half of the executive team is invisible. Lots of getting to work @ 10, leaving @ 2 type behavior.
unless you are an executive this is none of your business
quote:
2. Employees stealing time....to the tune of thousands of dollars per year in overtime and fake expense reimbursement.
unless you are in compliance or HR, this is none of your business
if you think its a bad place to work, start looking
Posted on 4/8/21 at 10:59 am to meAnon
Culture drips down from the very top. Meaning if the CEO isn't holding his operational staff accountable then at every stop along the way it becomes more and more lax.
Sharp operators don't hang around in lazy cultures, so they go elsewhere and more mediocrity slides into their place, further exacerbating the problem. The front line employees are doing everything they can get away with, because that's what they're being unintentionally incentivized to do.
"What you tolerate you encourage"
Sharp operators don't hang around in lazy cultures, so they go elsewhere and more mediocrity slides into their place, further exacerbating the problem. The front line employees are doing everything they can get away with, because that's what they're being unintentionally incentivized to do.
"What you tolerate you encourage"
Posted on 4/8/21 at 11:26 am to meAnon
My initial reactions/questions are: why is it bothering you so much? Just keep your head down, do you work and stop worrying about others. Alternatively, leave and find a new work environment that is more to your liking.
Those things are easier said than done, I understand. As to the first, it can get very frustrating if your working hard, but see others slacking and half-assing their jobs and not being adversely affected because of it. I've learned over the years, leaving isn't always the answer either, b/c there is bullshite to be up with wherever you go.
I will say I used to work in a similarly sized place with out the same number of offices, and there were plenty of people like you described. It seemed that once you got hired on there, they didn't do much to run you off unless you did something really egregious. It can come from a wide number of reasons: apathy, poor management, learning over years of experience that you are bound to get some bad apple employees, so why fire one bad apple only to hire another one in all likelihood?
Those things are easier said than done, I understand. As to the first, it can get very frustrating if your working hard, but see others slacking and half-assing their jobs and not being adversely affected because of it. I've learned over the years, leaving isn't always the answer either, b/c there is bullshite to be up with wherever you go.
I will say I used to work in a similarly sized place with out the same number of offices, and there were plenty of people like you described. It seemed that once you got hired on there, they didn't do much to run you off unless you did something really egregious. It can come from a wide number of reasons: apathy, poor management, learning over years of experience that you are bound to get some bad apple employees, so why fire one bad apple only to hire another one in all likelihood?
Posted on 4/8/21 at 11:38 am to The Spleen
quote:
I feel like the vast majority of large companies are like you described.
I don't know because I've never really worked anywhere else. I've been here in different capacities for almost 20 years and I'm trying not to sink into a lost cause mentality.
I work with essentially everyone from CEO to front line folks and I can't hide from the downstream effects of this stuff.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 11:45 am to jfw3535
quote:
it can get very frustrating if your working hard, but see others slacking and half-assing their jobs and not being adversely affected because of it
So, this is 100% true, but my frustration is not so much with having to do more than my lazy colleagues, but moreso specifically tied to looking our employees in the eye when they have complaints or notice these behaviors, knowing that their doubts are justified, but not having a legitimate answer as to why its allowed.
Someone on here once talked about a Nick Saban quote...
"High achievers don't like mediocre people, and mediocre people don't like high achievers"
I think one of our main problems is that our 'high achievers' are actually mediocre people.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 11:47 am to Mingo Was His NameO
quote:
go to work, collect your paycheck, and go home
Respectfully, I think this is how we got to where we are now.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 11:50 am to meAnon
quote:
Respectfully, I think this is how we got to where we are now.
Then start your own business or find a new gig.
Im not being a dick, but do you really think you can change the culture of 700 people by yourself from your position?
It is what it is, I'm not telling you it's ideal, but the reality is nothing you can do will change a damn thing
This post was edited on 4/8/21 at 11:51 am
Posted on 4/8/21 at 11:53 am to meAnon
That is just bad management and probably starts at the top with poor management by the President/CEO and trickles down. Eventually it will ruin the business over time.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 12:07 pm to Mingo Was His NameO
quote:
Im not being a dick
Agreed - I appreciate your thoughts.
Let me ask you this.
I think we have all have essentially agreed that without the CEO's buyin, these are unfixable issues -
What if the the CEO is oblivious?
What if the CEO is aware, but not willing to do anything? As an employee of the organization, do you feel like other senior management folks should be battling with her every day to correct the culture?
This post was edited on 4/8/21 at 12:09 pm
Posted on 4/8/21 at 12:17 pm to meAnon
I'm going to guess you are under the age of 25. I totally get what you are saying. I think you will have to decide whether you will spend your energy on work or at home.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 12:20 pm to meAnon
quote:
What if the the CEO is oblivious?
Then the CEO is a poor leader.
quote:
What if the CEO is aware, but not willing to do anything?
Then the CEO is a poor leader.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 12:21 pm to ShootingsBricks4Life
quote:
I'm going to guess you are under the age of 25
Based on what, and does that make any of the issues less real?
This post was edited on 4/8/21 at 12:24 pm
Posted on 4/8/21 at 1:04 pm to meAnon
(no message)
This post was edited on 7/25/22 at 4:40 pm
Posted on 4/8/21 at 1:19 pm to meAnon
I started at a company like that. I left and found out that I was not insane and that it could be better. If the culture is that bad then it's leadership's fault.
If you want to make sure executive management knows, you can send an anonymous e-mail to the CEO or whoever you think necessary to make sure they are apprised of the situation. Then see if they do anything about it. You better keep your head down during this period to make sure they don't make you or your search for a new job could become involuntary.
Do you know what your company's values are? Are they routinely discussed? Do you have routine discussions at various levels about holding each other accountable and providing examples of good leadership? Does anyone care about any of this? Do they get rid of people who are obviously not in alignment with the company values? If not, GTFO if that's not the kind of place you want to work. If leadership doesn't care, why should you? Their business model may be to suck but somehow maybe make a profit. Bad business model. Bad business. Bad leadership.
If you want to make sure executive management knows, you can send an anonymous e-mail to the CEO or whoever you think necessary to make sure they are apprised of the situation. Then see if they do anything about it. You better keep your head down during this period to make sure they don't make you or your search for a new job could become involuntary.
Do you know what your company's values are? Are they routinely discussed? Do you have routine discussions at various levels about holding each other accountable and providing examples of good leadership? Does anyone care about any of this? Do they get rid of people who are obviously not in alignment with the company values? If not, GTFO if that's not the kind of place you want to work. If leadership doesn't care, why should you? Their business model may be to suck but somehow maybe make a profit. Bad business model. Bad business. Bad leadership.
This post was edited on 4/8/21 at 1:20 pm
Posted on 4/8/21 at 1:35 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I quit caring about it a long time ago and just do what's expected of me and go home to my family every night.
I am fighting to get to this point so badly. How do you give up caring? Teach me your ways.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 2:39 pm to RoyalWe
quote:
I left and found out that I was not insane and that it could be better.
Thats the thought in the back of my mind-i know every place 'has its problems,' but there is no way every place's problems are toxic, unaccountable culture.
quote:
Values - - Does anyone care about any of this?
If you asked our front line employees, I'm pretty confident the answer would be a pretty resounding no.
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