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re: Would anyone like to have an intelligent conversation regarding our D?

Posted on 1/27/21 at 6:31 am to
Posted by sml71
Run if you hear banjos.
Member since Dec 2005
4345 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 6:31 am to
Look...I haven’t watched a single bouncey ball game this season (regardless of team).

But if you’re going to start a thread with a title like “would anyone like to have an intelligent conversation regarding our D” and then start the post with a gem like “If you are going to say fire Will Wade, our guys are all lazy, streetball, please do not post in here”, then it’s pretty clear that you don’t want to have any type of conversation at all.
Posted by Tiger Ugly
Baton Rouge
Member since Jul 2008
17747 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 6:35 am to
The first thing I would say that hurts us defensively is that none of our starters can stay in front of people on dribble penetration. Particularly Smart and Watford they just flat out lack lateral quickness. Thomas is only marginally better in that regard.

IMHO this leads to many of our issues, help has to rotate constantly to cover for this inequity and that compromises rebounding position and also leads to kick outs for open 3's.

Now we do have some guys on the bench who can do better but they have yet to show they can score enough to justify more minutes.

Now could improved technique and communication help our guys who are challenged in regard to lateral quickness? Yes I think to some extent and you can put that on the coaching, but the quicker players would still expose them even with better technique and communication.

I know some have said it's our defensive philosophy, that steals and deflections are valued and not keeping things in front of us. I would not discount that totally, but I don't think that's the reason we get beat so often on initial dribble penetration for the most part and I still think that's the biggest issue.

Also, I thought specifically as to the game last night the Aggies started running some baseline screen action to get some shooters open and our efforts at least initially, to get around the screens was half-arse to say it nicely. Perhaps some butt was chewed cause we did a little better in that regard toward the end.
Posted by KC Tiger
Member since Sep 2006
4919 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 7:12 am to
quote:

No one wants to hear this but our 3 point defense isn’t that bad. The Alabama game was a disaster obviously. In the last 2 games (UK & A&M) opponents have shot 19/64.


The fallacy a lot of folks make is that this is a knee jerk reaction to the last three games. It’s not. This is a three year trend. However, in regards to “how well” we’ve played this year outside of the Bama game I would caution some hesitancy. Teams seem to shoot well above their average against us. That is the true measure of how good (or bad) a defense is. A&M is no different. They are an absolutely horrible offensive team (one of the worst in the country), but were able to light it up against us (relative to their season average).
This post was edited on 1/27/21 at 7:13 am
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
66531 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 7:27 am to
This year, prior to Kentucky, we’ve been good at 3pt% allowed at 31%. Last year was bad 35% but this season we were at 28% until the Bama game which is very good. The problem we have with the 3 is that we give up too many good looks. Since we’ve gone mostly man to man, starting at halftime of the Kentucky game we’re at 27% which is outstanding. We gave up 1-9 vs UK in the second half and 12-38 last night. Our zone defense was giving up too many quality looks and even though last night ATM shot it 38 times almost none of them were good looks. Even during that spell when they got hot they were making 27 footers and moving 3s which is why it didn’t last long.
This post was edited on 1/27/21 at 7:29 am
Posted by ForeverLSU5
Member since Mar 2019
2143 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 7:50 am to
When LSU is more athletic than their opponent (90% of the time) their press actually works how they want it to, by completely messing the other teams tempo up. Now against teams like Kentucky that are about equal or better in athleticism it isn't going to work. When LSU presses they are ok with teams scoring because they know they can just outscore them. The main problem with our defense is effort, I think the announcers made a good point last night when they we are probably trying to conserve energy on that end bc we have 4 guys that play 30+ minutes a night. The effort also shows in our defensive rebounding, I think the biggest fix for our half court defense will be getting guys like Cook, Hyatt, Shareef, and Gaines more playing time so they can exert all their energy on the defensive end.

ETA: The entire point of the press is to speed the game up because when LSU is playing fast and in transition they are almost unguardable, but we struggle in half court offense and Wade knows this, hence pressing.
This post was edited on 1/27/21 at 7:52 am
Posted by geauxtigers33
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2014
13735 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 7:58 am to
quote:

No one wants to hear this but our 3 point defense isn’t that bad.


Percentage wise yes but 3 point attempts against LSU is very high. Based off of watching multiple years of this It seems Wade is just ok with giving up 3 point attempts and banking on them being college players and they will miss a lot more than they make crash the boards and get rebounds (which this team is not good at doing). And probably 90 percent of the teams you play this strategy will work because most teams don’t have consistent outside scorers. This style does not match up well with teams like Bama that just want to put up as many 3’s as possible and has multiple guys that are good from 3.
Posted by Superbonics
Member since Oct 2015
447 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:01 am to
See Tremont Waters.....need to recruit a true PG
Posted by ArcticTiger
North Pole
Member since Nov 2018
2497 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:08 am to
With the struggles on D, and last two games against poor shooting teams, you keep it as simple as possible. Go with a basic 1-3-1 or 2-1-2. Focus on basic stuff and how to properly block out while rebounding. This may seem simple but in the current world with AAU Run and Gun some of these guys may not have been thought this stuff?
This post was edited on 1/28/21 at 3:05 pm
Posted by jimbeam
University of LSU
Member since Oct 2011
75703 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:20 am to
quote:

then it’s pretty clear that you don’t want to have any type of conversation at all.
The thread is going swimmingly. Lots of good ideas flowing. Please see yourself out.
Posted by TeamLSU
Member since Feb 2009
3647 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:30 am to
quote:

It is crazy how slow they are on rotations.


This by a WIDE Margin. Their rotations are absolutely horrible. Lack of focus on that side of the ball is lacking to say the least.

quote:

Dribble penetration corner threes are this teams kryptonite.


This all starts at the point. We can't even slow down, much less lock down the point of attack.

quote:

I’m a huge Wade fan but it just seems like guys never know how to rotate no matter what type of defense we are playing.



Until this is fixed, I can see LSU being a 2 and BBQ type team in the Big Dance consistently.
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
66531 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:40 am to
“I can see LSU being a 2 and BBQ type team in the Big Dance consistently”


The NCAA tournament is single elimination.
Posted by HoopyD
Member since Nov 2004
3446 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:45 am to
Watford and Thomas are defensive liabilities. Watford falls for any head fake and just jumps at shooters. Thomas has an offense only mentality and shows no desire to play defense.

I thought the match-up zone would hide some of those deficiencies but somehow opponents are able to drive into the lane against a zone and kick it out for a 3 pointer and we show no desire to stop it.

At this point, you almost want to go to a Loyola-Marymount type D. Full court press and try to get some cheap steals or turnovers. If they break it and score, no big deal...try to get in transition as fast as possible. Our weakness is half court defense and we should try to stay out of it as much as possible.
Posted by crowbar832001
Member since Dec 2008
3664 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 8:50 am to
Aren’t you the same one last week that was saying, don’t talk bad about WW or our defense.

You didn’t want to have an intelligent conversation on the subject matter?

It looks like you did some research and joined what some of us already knew.

I’m proud of you. It shows some people can change.
Posted by jimbeam
University of LSU
Member since Oct 2011
75703 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:00 am to
I was stating the fact yes that to that point in the season our 3pt defense was top 25
This post was edited on 1/27/21 at 9:04 am
Posted by TeamLSU
Member since Feb 2009
3647 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:01 am to
quote:

The NCAA tournament is single elimination.


I know that. I'm saying they will probably win the 1st Game of the tourney by being flat out better than the opponent, but the 2nd game will on average be a tougher matchup, therefore, they will have played TWO games in the Tourney.

Reference: 2 and BBQ.
This post was edited on 1/27/21 at 9:05 am
Posted by jimbeam
University of LSU
Member since Oct 2011
75703 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:05 am to
Better than one and done?
Posted by BigRaggedyTiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2015
537 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:06 am to
I honestly could care less about basketball
Posted by TeamLSU
Member since Feb 2009
3647 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:08 am to
quote:

Better than one and done?



Definitely better than one and done Jim. Hell, baby steps here. I'm just glad we're at the point in the program that getting to the Big Dance every year is expected now. Baby Steps.
Posted by jimbeam
University of LSU
Member since Oct 2011
75703 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:08 am to
Thank you for your input. I would suggesting caring less then
Posted by josh336
baton rouge
Member since Jan 2007
81985 posts
Posted on 1/27/21 at 9:33 am to
Just wanted to point out lsu is currently 68th out of 340 teams in 3 pt % allowed, which isnt bad at all. Yes, they give up the dribble drive and kick to the 3 way too often. But the switching man defense has helped us in this regard. Also, to correct one poster in this thread, we switched plenty against A&M, it wasnt straight man.
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