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re: Where are all the "it's not the offense it's injuries/execution" posters
Posted on 2/9/13 at 11:55 pm to ItNeverRains
Posted on 2/9/13 at 11:55 pm to ItNeverRains
quote:As obvious from OP title, you want to be right so bad, but wrong again.
Yes, Miles loved that 2011 offense so much it's gone Monday.
It's the 2012 offense that's gone.
2011 offense was a no show on Sept 1st, 2012, unfortunately.
You can keep trying though, just read up on some facts before posting and you're bound to be right.
ETA :nb4noshow1-9-12:
This post was edited on 2/10/13 at 12:17 am
1
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:50 am to Mayhawman
As stated, you could say a lot of different things and be right about what the "problem" was on offense.
QB play
OL play/injuries
Execution
WR too short/slow/dropping passes
Scheme
Playcalling
whatever
IOW, there was a shitstorm offensively the last few years.
Mayhawman, nobody denies the 2011 offense put up a lot of points. But it's not so simple as "points". The defense and special teams set them up with short fields a lot. Wing was special that year and flipped field position a lot. The 2011 offense was good, sometimes. Sometimes it sucked. It was never great. Yet since it's a TEAM game, it worked out great quite a bit...thanks to the defense, punter, and punt/kick returns helping the offense out.
Bottom line, the offense has been sub top 50 for 5 consecutive years, and had it been top 30, LSU is likely owner of a couple more crystals...at LEAST one more.
Here's to Cameron and here's to Les for recognizing and addressing the issue.
QB play
OL play/injuries
Execution
WR too short/slow/dropping passes
Scheme
Playcalling
whatever
IOW, there was a shitstorm offensively the last few years.
Mayhawman, nobody denies the 2011 offense put up a lot of points. But it's not so simple as "points". The defense and special teams set them up with short fields a lot. Wing was special that year and flipped field position a lot. The 2011 offense was good, sometimes. Sometimes it sucked. It was never great. Yet since it's a TEAM game, it worked out great quite a bit...thanks to the defense, punter, and punt/kick returns helping the offense out.
Bottom line, the offense has been sub top 50 for 5 consecutive years, and had it been top 30, LSU is likely owner of a couple more crystals...at LEAST one more.
Here's to Cameron and here's to Les for recognizing and addressing the issue.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:56 am to ItNeverRains
It was part of the problem. I just wasnt ready to go fire everyone. Especially guys that bust their arse for this program to be what it is today. But id also guess cam probably would have always been a first choice. Now hes available so les got him. This may not have happened otherwise.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:58 am to dgnx6
Can we just do away with all the games? Just start a thread stating you hate les miles and be done with it.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:02 am to Fishhead
quote:
It was never great. Yet since it's a TEAM game, it worked out great quite a bit...thanks to the defense, punter, and punt/kick returns helping the offense out.
Bs, ole miss our qbs threw for %100. You cant do better than that.
Also the o didnt turn the ball over. It was very effective. Of course the d will have to help out. If it doesnt, you lose. You know why we went undefeated. Cus the other teams offense, defense, and special teams werent scoring on us. All 3 phases last season were great.
If our o was so bad, then why didnt the other teans defense and st help their offense out? Youd think wed lose almost every game if our o was that bad. The fact is it wasnt. People take the bama game and make that the whole season.
This post was edited on 2/10/13 at 1:06 am
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:17 am to ItNeverRains
Weve also averaged over 30pts a game under Les. I know that can be skewed with shitty ooc games, but still.
Anyone who wants to bash les should watch the 2002 and 2004 seasons over again. Maybe you would appreciate him more and be glad jimbo isnt our head coach.
Anyone who wants to bash les should watch the 2002 and 2004 seasons over again. Maybe you would appreciate him more and be glad jimbo isnt our head coach.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:21 am to dgnx6
quote:
Anyone who wants to bash les should watch the 2002 and 2004 seasons over again. Maybe you would appreciate him more and be glad jimbo isnt our head coach.
They can't do that, because then they can't keep using their bullshite arguments.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:26 am to Mayhawman
quote:
I'm happy to get Cameron and think he'll only improve the O, but I don't need to lie about previous squads to spin any agenda. I'll always call you fricks out on a lie about my Tigahs.
No lies here. To support the 2011 offense bass on stats is obtuse and narrow minded. It was greatly aided by superior defense and st plays. Also, the offense was actually competent and an asset until Miles tried to fix what was not broken by reinserting Jefferson, see Oregon and WVU games. While you might be able to point your finger in a program and pat yourself in the back for how smart you are for reading it, to truly support the debacle of what the 2011 offense became is asinine.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:46 am to ItNeverRains
quote:
Where are all the "it's not the offense it's injuries/execution" posters
To start, it is the offseason, there is no execution involved
But this hire establishes that Miles is looking for a crisper offense (in the same! scheme)....
He will run the same scheme..
What he brings in his years of experience working with NFL offenses and QBs
He has had poor head coaching stints....
And I want to caution my Tiger comrades, Yes Brees praised him and that means a lot, BUT
Baltimore fans bickered about the offense as Tiger fans.... (He does not use motion, and the routes are not to create openings, but the WRs are counted on beating their man)
And we have to consider... consider! Who made who? .. Did Cameron make Tomlinson or Tomlnson make Cameron??
With all that said... SOLID SOLID SOLID hire
And a hire that won't change much of what we see, but what the players will get IMHO....
We can't say much in playcalling, we can't predict Miles's plan for 2013.... But Cameron's experience with the offense will be very valuable with the staff already in place...That is for sure!
Good hire! But rest assured, his greatest contribution should be coaching the players up!
I will share what Detllier says.... and I hinted at that... but I was talking OC not QB coach... but a Good QB coach does a lot for an offense to look crisp.
“Scott, as long as Les Miles is head coach the philosophy won't change and they will be a run oriented team, but the problem is the fact that they have not fully developed any of the QB's since Matt Flynn. Jordan Jefferson, Jarrett Lee and Zach Mettenberger have the same errors in set-up, delivery and pocket presence ability. Cam is a good QB's coach. He has done an excellent job developing Brees, P. Rivers and Joe Flacco. Joe mentioned during Super Bowl week how much Cam had helped him in his development from a technical standpoint and also how good a listener he is to what a QB likes to do and what doesn't work right. The good coaches understand that you have to adjust your scheme to what a QB does best.
That is the key to this recruiting class. They have a great array of talented young men to take the place of Mingo, Montgomery, Logan, Downs and Edwards, but it will turn out to be how well they fully develop the skills of Hayden Rettig and Anthony Jennings that will be the key. Alabama has pulled away because they developed AJ McCarron. And the Tigers have been stuck in neutral developing QB's. McCarron-back to back BCS titles, Tebow and his success in Florida, Cam Newton in Auburn and what Matt Flynn did at LSU. Great defense against the run, a strong rushing attack and a QB. that can make crucial plays from week to week.
The other feature that needs to be upgraded is getting the tight ends and running backs more involved in the passing game. That has been a poor part of this passing attack. Alabama has done a good job getting TE's and backs more involved in the passing game. DeSean Smith has the physical skills to take that position to another level. He's that good.
Overall I like what Cam brings to the table, but mostly as a quarterback mentor. The philosophy will not change much because Cameron will do what Les wants offensively and that is a be a physical rushing team, but he can upgrade the QB spot through good coaching and putting them in a position that to make plays at crucial times.”
This post was edited on 2/10/13 at 9:21 am
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:58 am to Fishhead
quote:Didn't even cross the 50 on that infamous and fateful National Embarrassment Night in the Dome on one nine.
Bottom line, the offense has been sub top 50 for 5 consecutive years
It was like getting in a Time Machine and being transported back a few years watching the Haslett-Brooks "Joined at the Hip" freak show.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 7:03 am to blackjackjackson
quote:
lm used the same scheme that balt. and s.f. used to reach the superbowl.
Kapernick and Flacco run the same scheme on offense?
Posted on 2/10/13 at 7:36 am to Roi.Trois.Faulk
The bottomline is this: a change had to happen. Whether people want to say it's not going to work because Miles is the one calling the plays, or they want to say that Miles made a piss poor hire and it'll be more of the same, or it was a marginally good hire - blah, blah blah.
The point still stands. A change needed to be made. I'm glad that Miles actually took action instead of not doing anything. That in and of itself kind of gave me a chubby.
The thing that impresses me is that Cameron coached in the NFL. That's got to mean something. I would think you would have to be just a bit more knowledgeable about x's and o's and schemes being a professional assistant vs. facing college offenses. The schemes are still the same in principle, but in the NFL there's talent on every single team. And let's face it, you have to be good to be in the NFL whether you're a player or a coach.
The point still stands. A change needed to be made. I'm glad that Miles actually took action instead of not doing anything. That in and of itself kind of gave me a chubby.
The thing that impresses me is that Cameron coached in the NFL. That's got to mean something. I would think you would have to be just a bit more knowledgeable about x's and o's and schemes being a professional assistant vs. facing college offenses. The schemes are still the same in principle, but in the NFL there's talent on every single team. And let's face it, you have to be good to be in the NFL whether you're a player or a coach.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:07 pm to JR Hamilsbach
quote:FIFY.
To dis the 2011 offense bass on one stat is obtuse and narrow minded.
Many stats support the truth.
13-1 vs brutal schedule, AP#2, #1 MoV season in recent LSU history, top 10 in FBS MoV, #5 in LSU Total O, #2 in scoring O,and many more.
What have you got?
Because it supports your agenda, you base your spin on one stat, Total O national rank, which is watered down with a bunch of mid majors that play nobody.
50% of those top 60 teams are non BCS conference with a joke of a schedule and would be bottom feeders in the SEC.
quote:Fail again.
Also, the offense was actually competent and an asset until Miles tried to fix what was not broken by reinserting Jefferson
quote:I'll add to that excerpt, the final 2 games were vs the #1 and #5 FBS defense, so output dropped understandably.
Final three regular season games
Jefferson's final three regular season games were LSU's most productive games in 2011 for total yards and yards per play.[6] In all three games, LSU gained over 450 yards; LSU had gained over 450 yards only once in the prior nine games.[6] Jefferson had a perfect game passing against Ole Miss, and he passed for over 200 yards against Arkansas. LSU averaged nearly 10 points more per game and nearly doubled the rushing yards when Jefferson started as QB. Jefferson finished the regular season with a passer rating of 163.5, highest among SEC starting QBs.[6] Of LSU's final three regular season opponents, one-third of the opponents were ranked in the Top 25 at the end of the season.
quote:You do realize the 2003 team scored more defensive TDs than 2011?
It was greatly aided by superior defense and st plays.
So is that your same assumption for the 2003 offense?
They each lost a game, although not vs similarly ranked opponents.
Just what do you base your dislike of 2011 offense on besides FBS Total O rank?
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:21 pm to redfieldk717
Non SEC caliber QBs have limited Tigers' offensive production.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:42 pm to ItNeverRains
It's not the offense
It's the injuries, execution and development.
Y'all act like the play calling was just terrible. There were bad moments but saban had more than a handful himself last year alone.
The problem is these guys aren't getting developed to their full potential. WR at LSU shouldn't be dropping that many passes and QB needs to be developed better.
The onlines problem was injuries.
All of these problems can be corrected and miles definitely took the correct measures of doing so.
It's the injuries, execution and development.
Y'all act like the play calling was just terrible. There were bad moments but saban had more than a handful himself last year alone.
The problem is these guys aren't getting developed to their full potential. WR at LSU shouldn't be dropping that many passes and QB needs to be developed better.
The onlines problem was injuries.
All of these problems can be corrected and miles definitely took the correct measures of doing so.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:48 pm to RBWilliams8
quote:
It's the injuries, execution
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:48 pm to ItNeverRains
Did you even watch the games? Execution and injuries were a big problem. Even the simplest play can work if you execute it right and beat the guy in front of you
Posted on 2/10/13 at 12:52 pm to ItNeverRains
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:07 pm to Bernie Moore
quote:
Non SEC caliber QBs have limited Tigers' offensive production.
Wonder why the LSU QB that led the SEC in pass efficiency, who was also named the All-SEC Sr team, got benched in 2011?
It was the scheme, plain and simple. Everything was dumbed down for Miles' QB, and it showed. Things got of of sync (dropped passes, delays, false starts, blown timeouts). Alabama, Fla and Clemson losses were coaching blunders based on that philosophy
Firing the OC is proof that Miles finally accepted that reality.
Posted on 2/10/13 at 1:11 pm to Guava Jelly
Glad Miles disagrees with last four posters.
2011 #2 in FBS for turnover margin, combined with no injuries, and best special teams player I've ever seen at LSU is he reason we scored, but our offensive rank was garbage. Army and UGA had the plan to stop us, just lacked the talent, eventually wore both down. Team on 1/9 had the talent, so we gained 50 yards.
Again, I think CC is home run hire, Miles, although slow to make moves, does get it right. I think the future has ridiculous potential.
If CC calls an SS option for ZM, I reserve the right to change opinion
2011 #2 in FBS for turnover margin, combined with no injuries, and best special teams player I've ever seen at LSU is he reason we scored, but our offensive rank was garbage. Army and UGA had the plan to stop us, just lacked the talent, eventually wore both down. Team on 1/9 had the talent, so we gained 50 yards.
Again, I think CC is home run hire, Miles, although slow to make moves, does get it right. I think the future has ridiculous potential.
If CC calls an SS option for ZM, I reserve the right to change opinion
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