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The Recruting Debate on the Offensive Line (There are facts in here. You've been warned)
Posted on 11/13/18 at 10:57 am
Posted on 11/13/18 at 10:57 am
So, there has been a pretty steady debate on this board that the offensive line at LSU suffers badly due to recruiting. I took all the offensive line recruits from LSU and Alabama from 2014 - 2018 and added up there averages of those offensive line classes and this is what came out on the other side. This is just a discussion of the offensive line and not the team as a whole. Since the offense is the main topic of discussion lately and the OL being the most discussed point of that offense.
LSU has had a total of 18 OL commits since 2014.
5 Stars: 1
4 Stars: 10
3 Stars: 7
Average Grade : .9035
Alabama has had a total of 22 OL commits since 2014.
5 Stars: 3
4 Stars: 14
3 Stars: 3
Average Grade : .9357
So, you're going to tell me that an average grade of .0322 makes that much difference on an offensive line? I would say that this somewhat proves the coaching differences on the offensive side of the ball. If .0322 of difference in grade of recruits is what makes your offensive line a revolving door then there would be a lot of teams in trouble here. There are other teams that have played Alabama and not had as much trouble blocking them as we have with more talented players according to the recruiting rankings.
Now, I'm not saying all recruits are created equal, but if you want to go with that argument then maybe it's a talent evaluation problem and that still falls on the offensive coaching staff.
Take all that for what it's worth but I just wanted to see what the difference actually was and I was honestly expecting a larger gap. The fact is that the talent gap really isn't that large and there is no way that it should make that big of a difference.
LSU has had a total of 18 OL commits since 2014.
5 Stars: 1
4 Stars: 10
3 Stars: 7
Average Grade : .9035
Alabama has had a total of 22 OL commits since 2014.
5 Stars: 3
4 Stars: 14
3 Stars: 3
Average Grade : .9357
So, you're going to tell me that an average grade of .0322 makes that much difference on an offensive line? I would say that this somewhat proves the coaching differences on the offensive side of the ball. If .0322 of difference in grade of recruits is what makes your offensive line a revolving door then there would be a lot of teams in trouble here. There are other teams that have played Alabama and not had as much trouble blocking them as we have with more talented players according to the recruiting rankings.
Now, I'm not saying all recruits are created equal, but if you want to go with that argument then maybe it's a talent evaluation problem and that still falls on the offensive coaching staff.
Take all that for what it's worth but I just wanted to see what the difference actually was and I was honestly expecting a larger gap. The fact is that the talent gap really isn't that large and there is no way that it should make that big of a difference.
31
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:02 am to koLSU86
quote:
o, you're going to tell me that an average grade of .0322
you are looking at it on a scale of 1-100. thats not the scale.
4 star recruits are basically .90-.97. in that case, a difference of .03 is quite significant.
eta: sorry basic math offends the snowflake positigers
This post was edited on 11/13/18 at 11:12 am
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:02 am to koLSU86
There is a "talent gap" between Bama's DL depth and LSU's OL...
But the primary factor (in my opinion) in the difference between Bama vs LSU and Bama vs the rest of the SEC, is that Alabama knows the LSU game is a "big game" and plays up for it, every year. That is a reflection of the coaching, true... but it's also the players.
So, when you combine some talent gap with their "all in" approach to the LSU game... it widens that gap a bit more.
As noted, that's my opinion. Not saying it's the only factor, but I do believe it plays a roll.
But the primary factor (in my opinion) in the difference between Bama vs LSU and Bama vs the rest of the SEC, is that Alabama knows the LSU game is a "big game" and plays up for it, every year. That is a reflection of the coaching, true... but it's also the players.
So, when you combine some talent gap with their "all in" approach to the LSU game... it widens that gap a bit more.
As noted, that's my opinion. Not saying it's the only factor, but I do believe it plays a roll.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:04 am to koLSU86
I’ve posted 3 similar threads but people like Tiger Ree and Pirate among others try to spin it.
Facts are facts
Grimes leaves as run game coordinator and really likely primary OC assistant besides Ine coach and both the Oline and the run game go to shite to the point this team is ranked in the 100’s in total offense
88 in TFL Allowed
97th Sacks allowed.
Brumfiled was a high 4* and is a 23 year old SENIOR who was getting whipped like a rag doll in multiple games.
If LSU lost it’s offensive identity in the last several games, then just wait until TAMU because they are #2 rush defense, 25th total defense, 30th in sacks, etc.. you’ve been warned and Vegas will place a line to get dumbasses on here to bet the Tigers.
Facts are facts
Grimes leaves as run game coordinator and really likely primary OC assistant besides Ine coach and both the Oline and the run game go to shite to the point this team is ranked in the 100’s in total offense
88 in TFL Allowed
97th Sacks allowed.
Brumfiled was a high 4* and is a 23 year old SENIOR who was getting whipped like a rag doll in multiple games.
If LSU lost it’s offensive identity in the last several games, then just wait until TAMU because they are #2 rush defense, 25th total defense, 30th in sacks, etc.. you’ve been warned and Vegas will place a line to get dumbasses on here to bet the Tigers.
This post was edited on 11/13/18 at 11:11 am
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:07 am to jcole4lsu
quote:. Yeah but how does that stack up against other SEC schools? On par except with UGA and that is only recent.
you are looking at it on a scale of 1-100. thats not the scale.
4 star recruits are basically .90-.97. in that case, a difference of .03 is quite significant.
The talent gap is some of the tackles really didn’t develop into tackles and the guards are certainly not tackles.. get it?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:07 am to LSU91MBA
quote:
There is a "talent gap" between Bama's DL depth and LSU's OL...
But the primary factor (in my opinion) in the difference between Bama vs LSU and Bama vs the rest of the SEC, is that Alabama knows the LSU game is a "big game" and plays up for it, every year. That is a reflection of the coaching, true... but it's also the players.
So, when you combine some talent gap with their "all in" approach to the LSU game... it widens that gap a bit more.
As noted, that's my opinion. Not saying it's the only factor, but I do believe it plays a roll.
I think this isn't talked about nearly enough. LSU is the team that Alabama schedules a bye week for.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:08 am to koLSU86
(no message)
This post was edited on 4/2/21 at 2:05 am
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:11 am to RATeamWannabe
quote:
LSU is the team that Alabama schedules a bye week for.
We also have a bye week
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:12 am to koLSU86
It’s an unpopular opinion but I believe that it’s our strength and conditioning program. It doesn’t seem to develop big men anymore. Bamas OL and DL are equal as freshman but then 2 years later, Bamas guys are just stronger and more physical.
It’s not like this happened once or twice, its every year they lose 2-3 OL/DL to the draft (1st rounders) and then the next guy steps in and doesn’t miss a beat.
It’s not like this happened once or twice, its every year they lose 2-3 OL/DL to the draft (1st rounders) and then the next guy steps in and doesn’t miss a beat.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:16 am to Lakeboy7
quote:
Yeah but Alabama has these things called tackles. They normally are on the ends of the line and are athletic enough to help protect your QB when you pass. LSU uses 5 guards which is great for running the ball not so good for passing.
Using 5 guards is Chapter 4 of Les Ball
This. I wish the OP had broken it down further and seen how many of the recruits for both teams were guards and how many were tackles. Also as far as development is concerned is there that much difference in 3,4 or 5 stars after a few years in a system? It's hard for a freshman or sophomore to come in and contribute. The one unit on the team that really needs to work with each other over a period of time to play up to their potential.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:17 am to 225Tyga
What if the ratings / numbers /recruiting services are wrong?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:19 am to koLSU86
Also did the OP allow for the guys that got processed when O got hired?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:23 am to koLSU86
Sometimes it is the X's & O's!!
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:28 am to 225Tyga
quote:
It’s an unpopular opinion but I believe that it’s our strength and conditioning program. It doesn’t seem to develop big men anymore. Bamas OL and DL are equal as freshman but then 2 years later, Bamas guys are just stronger and more physical. It’s not like this happened once or twice, its every year they lose 2-3 OL/DL to the draft (1st rounders) and then the next guy steps in and doesn’t miss a beat.
I can for sure agree with this. I do think that we need new blood in the S&C department.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:32 am to TBoy@LSU
quote:
What if the ratings / numbers /recruiting services are wrong?
That's why I said in the OP that all recruits aren't created equal and maybe it's a talent evaluation problem. If Coach O and company are sitting at the computer looking at 247 for their ideas on who to recruit we have a bigger problem than originally thought.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:35 am to koLSU86
If you are looking specifically at this year the better measure is:
LSU:
LT - SO
LG - FR
OC - SO
RG - JUCO TR JR
RT - SO
Bama:
LT - JR
LG - SR
OC - RS SR
RG - SO
RT - SO
LSU:
LT - SO
LG - FR
OC - SO
RG - JUCO TR JR
RT - SO
Bama:
LT - JR
LG - SR
OC - RS SR
RG - SO
RT - SO
This post was edited on 11/13/18 at 11:36 am
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:35 am to koLSU86
Well, if your numbers are correct the difference is 0.322 which seems small, but who knows. That said, the numbers strongly suggest that the difference in coaching the players up is enormous which game results confirm.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:40 am to koLSU86
Obviously not all 4 stars are created equal.Having talent is on thing but work ethic is another
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:41 am to LSU91MBA
Better coaching, heavy PED use and SEC refs allowing tGumps OL to hold on every play make a much bigger difference than the kids coming in the door.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:42 am to koLSU86
Big difference and throw in that our best guys are leaving as soon as they can and we are forced to play freshmen while Bama is able to redshirt.
What is LSU'S star rating at center?
What is LSU'S star rating at center?
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