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Message
re: The lack of a big man is killing us
Posted on 2/19/20 at 2:03 pm to Alt26
Posted on 2/19/20 at 2:03 pm to Alt26
Alt I have seen you go in on the defense and WW's coaching of defense in multiple threads. (justified as it has been bad)
BUT, it seems to me that this shouldn't be looked at as if it is football. By that I mean football has been a consistent winner for 20 years now and has set the bar to a point where anything short of playoff contention gets us upset.
With Basketball, we are not even 3 years removed from going 2-16 in SEC play, we haven't made back to back tournaments since the early 2000s, and like it or not the current roster was affected by the Wade suspension.
I understand being frustrated that our team is poor defensively but should we not, as a fan base, take a step back and realize where we are? We have a team that is probably going to make the tournament for the second year in a row. We have a really good recruiting class coming in for next year. We have team that is competitive in every game and doesn't quit. (they easily could have rolled over last night but didn't).
Sure there are things that we could be doing better and WW shoulders some of the blame but this program is so much better today than it was when he took over.
I'm not trying to say that Wade is above criticism, I am just trying to convey that our program is better than it has been in a long time. While Wade may not be perfect, he is the guy that has gotten us here.
IDK what I'm trying to say other than if I told you 3 years ago that WW would have us int he tournament almost every year with the occasional run then pretty much everyone would have been over the moon.
BUT, it seems to me that this shouldn't be looked at as if it is football. By that I mean football has been a consistent winner for 20 years now and has set the bar to a point where anything short of playoff contention gets us upset.
With Basketball, we are not even 3 years removed from going 2-16 in SEC play, we haven't made back to back tournaments since the early 2000s, and like it or not the current roster was affected by the Wade suspension.
I understand being frustrated that our team is poor defensively but should we not, as a fan base, take a step back and realize where we are? We have a team that is probably going to make the tournament for the second year in a row. We have a really good recruiting class coming in for next year. We have team that is competitive in every game and doesn't quit. (they easily could have rolled over last night but didn't).
Sure there are things that we could be doing better and WW shoulders some of the blame but this program is so much better today than it was when he took over.
I'm not trying to say that Wade is above criticism, I am just trying to convey that our program is better than it has been in a long time. While Wade may not be perfect, he is the guy that has gotten us here.
IDK what I'm trying to say other than if I told you 3 years ago that WW would have us int he tournament almost every year with the occasional run then pretty much everyone would have been over the moon.
1
Posted on 2/19/20 at 2:28 pm to boogedy
We’re missing Tremont, Kavell and Naz. Any questions??
Posted on 2/19/20 at 2:33 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
IDK what I'm trying to say other than if I told you 3 years ago that WW would have us int he tournament almost every year with the occasional run then pretty much everyone would have been over the moon.
No question. For the record I think Wade is the best basketball hire LSU has made since Brown left. The frustration comes not from too great of expectations, but because Wade has done such a good job in such a short amount of time and it is ONE glaring constant deficiency that is keeping a good team from potentially being great. LSU is is close. Not just close to being a tournament team every year. But close to being a big time factor in CBB. Wade level jumped all reasonable expectations with his early recruiting success. His starting line up consists of 4 top 70 players (2 of those 5 stars) + a 4 year starting PG. That's top level talent really just a notch below the traditional blue bloods.
I'm thrilled to have a reason to even be interested in Selection Sunday. That's not the problem. It's akin to watching an A student settle for a B- when you know with just a clear change in ONE aspect could lead to HUGE results.
Jones's and Johnson's teams were never really close to being anything special. Wade's are. They are on the cusp of greatness. Not in three years. But now! The personnel is there. It reminds me of the football program under Les where you could see just how close they were to being really special, but it was that one constant, clear, deficiency Les refused to fix that was holding them back. This is a national championship level offense. Just a good, not great, defense (top 50) would put them in the realistic realm of a true contender.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:10 pm to Alt26
I don’t think Evans, #3 from Vandy, has made another 3 since our game. He had 31 points in 35 minutes. Always seem to have someone who plays the game of their life against us.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:19 pm to T
quote:
o, what kills us is we never put any kind of pressure on guys on the perimeter which allows them to easily beat us with the dribble or a wide open shot.
How can we pressure three point shooters and allow a 6'10" athlete to catch the ball under the basket?
In addition, no one the team has the ability to block a shot except Williams. He is not going to consistently guard a 6"10" player around the basket.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:19 pm to Alt26
quote:
His starting line up consists of 4 top 70 players (2 of those 5 stars) + a 4 year starting PG. That's top level talent really just a notch below the traditional blue bloods.
I think this is difference in our opinions and I don't think either is really wrong, its just a glass half full vs glass half empty thing.
We both see a roster on the cusp but you see the talent we currently have in much better light than I do.
I think we have a team that has a PG that could do whatever he wanted in HS who is trying to figure out how to play as a role player cuz his talent isn't quite what he thought it was. I think we have a SG who is an awesome, cerebral player but we are asking him to be something he is not. We are trying to get Mays to do the things Waters used to to do at the end of games and I just don't think that is who Mays is. I think Mays has done a commendable job trying to fill that role, I just think a team that is asking Mays to be the guy to get a bucket on his own whenever we need it is flawed.
I see a team with no true bigs which isn't the worst thing ever except the 3 guys we have that play down low all have issues. Williams apparently doesn't know where he needs to be on defense, Watford barely plays defense, and Days is always in foul trouble. We also have no one behind them so we have to live with what they give us.
On the bench I see Marlon Taylor who is basically just an athlete in a basketball uniform. Without Waters, he is pretty useless on offense cuz all he can do is jump and he is average on defense at best. Manning is a breath of fresh air and I really like this kid but he has been hurt. Hopefully he gets more PT going forward cuz I think he is a difference maker. And Hyatt shows flashes of talent but you can tell he is really a year or two away from being a legit player.
On top of this, the team can't shoot 3s. The ability to shoot 3s could have covered up a lot of these deficiencies but alas we can't.
Like Wade said, this team is better than their last 5 games but I don't think they are as good as the 10 game win streak either. This team has talented pieces but they have a lot of holes as well.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:37 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Certainly some validity to criticism of Wade's ability to teach and motivate players on the defensive end since the defense was also porous when he had a solid rim protector last year.
However, some of the issue is simply that LSU's roster seems built to dominate the offensive glass with size mismatches that are also complete disadvantages on the defensive end.
For example, in the recent Auburn and Alabama games Watford and Days grabbed a lot of offensive boards over AU's 6-0 McCormick or Bama's 6-2 Shackleford trying to block them out. However those two players also went off driving and shooting 3 pointers on the other end against the much slower forwards.
A rim protector would help but a lot of good teams play without one.
LSU's issue seems to be quickness disadvantages through most of the lineup that's compounded with questionable defensive fundamentals and, at times, effort.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:41 pm to Gus007
quote:
How can we pressure three point shooters and allow a 6'10" athlete to catch the ball under the basket?
Putting pressure on someone also makes it a lot harder for them to pass the ball. Right now we are just standing 3-4 away and letting them do whatever they want. Standing 3 feet off the guy does nothing to help with a guy catching the ball under the basket so I don’t know why you even brought that up
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:42 pm to boogedy
Having our biggest man chase point guards 25 feet from the basket doesn’t help either.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 3:49 pm to phi1514
quote:
In other words, losing Naz Reid and Tremont Waters, and not having folks to fill those roles, really hurts...
NO .The loss of K-W is what's killing us. Period
Posted on 2/19/20 at 4:00 pm to wm72
quote:
A rim protector would help but a lot of good teams play without one.
LSU's issue seems to be quickness disadvantages through most of the lineup that's compounded with questionable defensive fundamentals and, at times, effort.
Yep. We'd be okay defensively if we could either guard on the perimeter or had a rim protector. With neither of those things we are consistently having to choose between two bad options- give up a good look at the rim on a dribble drive or give up an open three after we help.
I will say that we make stupid decisions at times with who we help off of- I lose my mind when we help off a good shooter in the corner to stop a small guard in the lane who probably isn't making the layup anyway.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 4:06 pm to Alt26
quote:
Alt26
Alt you’re looking at this from the wrong perspective. The issue isn’t really opponents 2pt FG% in the paint as much as it is our lack of ability to defend the drive and kick and our tendency to get caught in rotation because of how our defense tends to crash hard when we give up dribble penetration. Now some of this has to do with our players attempting to compensate due to our lack of a true rim protector, some of it has to do with laziness or fatigue, and some of it has to do with coaching philosophy. But I do think that if we had a KBW type player it would greatly help our defense by discouraging deep drives into the paint and it would free up the other 4 defenders to worry about their own assignment rather than helping in the paint. So it wouldn’t fix all our woes but it would help tremendously. I mean just look at least season. Our 3 point defense wasn’t incredible by any means, but 147th in opponents 3pt % is way better than 288th. Especially because our opponents shot a similar number of 3s a game last year against us as they have this year (23.8 in 2018 vs 25.7 in 2019/20)
Posted on 2/19/20 at 4:19 pm to BobBarker
Our perimeter D is our biggest problem and has impacted us negatively more than lack of a true Big. I know our staff teaches proper perimeter D. It seems our players simply cannot put what they are taught into practice effectively. And we do not have enough players to sit starters who fail at perimeter D.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 4:23 pm to GeorgeWest
quote:
Our perimeter D is our biggest problem and has impacted us negatively more than lack of a true Big.
Others are arguing its a chicken and an egg situation. The lack of a rim protector makes it necessary for us to collapse and help when guys get in the lane leaving people open for 3s.
The flip side is that we also don't seem particularly good at denying the dribbler access to the lane which gets us back to the collapsing D and open 3s. Around and Around we go.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 4:41 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Lack of a point guard... may have a good local one coming in!
Lack of a quality bench... this team has become "burned out" playing only 7, and sometimes 8 players a game
Lack of a big, bulky inside presence... go to the Midwest and recruit a couple of big bodies!
Lack of a quality bench... this team has become "burned out" playing only 7, and sometimes 8 players a game
Lack of a big, bulky inside presence... go to the Midwest and recruit a couple of big bodies!
Posted on 2/19/20 at 4:53 pm to boogedy
Naz reid
Earning that big money in the g league, i know everyone got to do they're own thing but another year would have helped him tremendously
Earning that big money in the g league, i know everyone got to do they're own thing but another year would have helped him tremendously
Posted on 2/19/20 at 5:26 pm to WhiteMandingo
Naz is in the NBA averaging 7.4ppg and climbing steadily. Had a good week before the All-Star break 11ppg 5rpg over his last 4. I agree he should’ve stayed but his Dad played a big part in him leaving.
This post was edited on 2/19/20 at 5:35 pm
Posted on 2/19/20 at 7:26 pm to boogedy
Keep losing games and we won’t need to worry about March madness.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 9:46 pm to Madking
I did not know that good for him.
Posted on 2/19/20 at 10:04 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Yes..teams have figured out how to attack LSU on defense... if the bigs come out to guard the opponent they drive pass them in the lane..if no one stops them or they are free they lay it in easily..if defenders do collapse in the lane to stop the drive the opponent then drives in the lane then passes back out to a wide open shooter waiting to hit a wide open 3... it’s not going to change for the rest of the upcoming games...
This post was edited on 2/19/20 at 10:05 pm
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