- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Coaching Changes
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: THE Fundamental Flaw in Les's Football Philosophy
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:31 am to boxcar willie
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:31 am to boxcar willie
quote:
did not read the whole thread as it is 6 pages
You're a wise man!
quote:
but do you think that Harris doesn't fit LSU's offense in some way?
I'll answer with an example. 2nd play from scrimmage for us on O vs Bama in the 1st half and the first play in the 2nd half we ran a simple rollout to the right. The QB has three options: 1) throw to the TE, throw to the WR, or run. The first time, he could've picked-up 5+ yds rushing or thrown to the open TE, Instead he guns it over WR's head. On the second, the TE was open, the WR wasn't, and he probably wouldn't have gained much had he run. I'm not sure who he was throwing to but it was int'd.
So 8 games into the season, we (he) can't execute a simple rollout to his throwing side. Not much to read. Everything's in front of him so it should be an easy play but he botches it 2X.
So why do we call plays our QB can't execute? If that's our offense then it doesn't fit him and vice-versa.
1
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:39 am to LSU GrandDad
quote:
and against inferior competition at that.while he may turn out to be the real deal, the chances are he's just the "coach de jur" of 2015.
Agree. It will be interesting to see how he does in the next few seasons when there is personnel turnover.
I'm being critical of Les in this thread but Les does so much so well as HC. Having a great year at a small school is not the same as coaching/recruiting on an SEC level year after year.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:42 am to chilge1
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:55 am to LSU GrandDad
quote:
what is the skill set of our QB? you lack any meaningful specifics when you make your blanket statement.
I don't know. But if he's going to be our QB, whatever it is that he can do well constrains the play sheet.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 2:03 am to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
Again, cfb isnt about being unpredictable. Its about execution.
But don't you think there's a difference between asking Mett to run an option as opposed to Tebow? Are all plays equally executable? Can being unpredictable and creating mismatches aid execution? And from a defensive standpoint isn't it easier to defend a play that's expected than one that isn't?
Posted on 4/1/16 at 4:44 am to AlwysATgr
quote:
Is this: Les does not engineer his offense around the skill-set of his QB. His philosophy is to intentionally minimize the role of the QB in the O scheme.
This is actually one of the good things they do from a offensive standpoint. This is good because theoretically if one QB goes down you can plug the next guy in without much drop off. It keeps too much weight off the QB.
Where LSU does it wrong IMO is that, you can still utilize your QB's strong points without putting pressure on him, but they seldom do this. The way LSU does it actually puts more pressure on the QB. By being so conservative and not using his skills your actually putting more pressure on him when they do face a must pass situation. He is not prepared and comfortable to face that situation because he has been protected within the offense and isn't ready.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 9:55 am to AlwysATgr
quote:
rollout to the right. The QB has three options: 1) throw to the TE, throw to the WR, or run.
I still don't get what you are trying to say? We shouldn't run plays where Harris has the option to run or throw? We shouldn't let him try to throw to the TE? WTF? you make no sense.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 10:33 am to boxcar willie
If QB play is poor then there are different ways to assess the problem:
1. Is the offense designed to optimize QB play (his skill set)?
2. Is play calling adjusted when a QB struggles to get him in rhythm.
3. Is the QB being developed properly?
4. Has there been effective recruiting at the QB spot?
All 4 still fall on coaching and recruiting. If our QBs aren't that good then we need to recruit better. If they are skilled but raw we need to develop better.
As far as play calling it's a tough situation. When you are playing down and distance all the time you get scared of incompletions. If the offense is set up to run on 1st and 2nd and pass on 3rd you put a lot of pressure on the QB with predictability. There's no easy fix when the trust isn't there except to get the reps in. We know how to run, but consistency in the passing game including pass protection should be priority 1.
1. Is the offense designed to optimize QB play (his skill set)?
2. Is play calling adjusted when a QB struggles to get him in rhythm.
3. Is the QB being developed properly?
4. Has there been effective recruiting at the QB spot?
All 4 still fall on coaching and recruiting. If our QBs aren't that good then we need to recruit better. If they are skilled but raw we need to develop better.
As far as play calling it's a tough situation. When you are playing down and distance all the time you get scared of incompletions. If the offense is set up to run on 1st and 2nd and pass on 3rd you put a lot of pressure on the QB with predictability. There's no easy fix when the trust isn't there except to get the reps in. We know how to run, but consistency in the passing game including pass protection should be priority 1.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 11:17 am to UncleTed
I don't think Les wants a "QB-centric" offense for the reasons you stated. Having 'interchangeable' QB's is good. But running an O that doesn't match what your QB does well is where the flaw resides.
This is money and every Tiger fan should read and heed.
quote:
Where LSU does it wrong IMO is that, you can still utilize your QB's strong points without putting pressure on him, but they seldom do this. The way LSU does it actually puts more pressure on the QB. By being so conservative and not using his skills your actually putting more pressure on him when they do face a must pass situation. He is not prepared and comfortable to face that situation because he has been protected within the offense and isn't ready.
This is money and every Tiger fan should read and heed.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 11:21 am to TGFN57
quote:
THE Fundamental Flaw in Les's Football Philosophy
Why do people post here on subjects like this when they have absolutely no idea what they are talking about?
Well this guy must know what he's talking about because he's posting the truth. If what he says is incorrect we wouldn't have the offensive problems we do year after year. Why are there so many Mile's apologist who will take average results year after year based on his one MNC and Two SEC championships that are well in the rear view mirror now.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 11:24 am to boxcar willie
quote:
I still don't get what you are trying to say? We shouldn't run plays where Harris has the option to run or throw? We shouldn't let him try to throw to the TE?
I didn't mean to convey that at all. I was using the same play we ran 2X vs Bama as an example of (repeatedly) calling a play our QB obviously couldn't execute. And wondering why call it at all if he can execute it?
UncleTed explains (above) really well how our approach retards QB play.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 11:29 am to BayouCowboy
quote:
BayouCowboy
Very good post.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 11:32 am to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
Yeah the lsu coach with the most
Top 5 finishes at lsu
Top 10 finishes at lsu
Top 15 finishes at lsu
Top 25 finishes at lsu
The highest win % in school history
Has 50% of tital game appearances
Is the problem
I swear its like you ignorant fricks live in some timeline where Miles' tenure hasnt been the best tenure in lsu history. If miles is so average why is he the winningest coach in lsu history?
Our 2001 roster was as talented a roster as we have ever had at lsu and lord Saban lost 3 sec games in a sec that is much weaker.
It's amazing how I'm constantly reminded by Les Milophiles how great he is despite the fact that the last 4 years have sucked. He may have reached his peak and is on the way down. Have any of you fools thought about that as a possibility?
Posted on 4/1/16 at 11:37 am to tduecen
It all goes back to the J Lee pick 6 year, ever since then Miles is not willing to lose games that way.
The years before that he let Flynn and Russell sling it around all the time.
The years before that he let Flynn and Russell sling it around all the time.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:43 pm to AlwysATgr
quote:
UncleTed explains (above) really well how our approach retards QB play.
what he said is what I and many others on here have been saying for years. That has nothing to do with wanting you wanting Harris not to throw to the TE or over the middle of the field or not wanting Harris to have run/pass options.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 1:46 pm to boxcar willie
If anything, they tried to tailor the offense to much to Harris perceived strengths and weaknesses by taking away passes to the TE's and the short/middle passing game.
the "fundemwental flaw" if there is one is the exact opposite of what you stated. We should work more on developing the passing game dispite the weeknesses of our QB's and WR's. That our QB weekness is that he is inaccurate and our recievers weekness is they suffer from the dropsies is all the more reason to throw on early downs and spread the field and try to get them into some sort of rythym through repetition in easier situations
the "fundemwental flaw" if there is one is the exact opposite of what you stated. We should work more on developing the passing game dispite the weeknesses of our QB's and WR's. That our QB weekness is that he is inaccurate and our recievers weekness is they suffer from the dropsies is all the more reason to throw on early downs and spread the field and try to get them into some sort of rythym through repetition in easier situations
This post was edited on 4/1/16 at 2:27 pm
Posted on 4/1/16 at 2:30 pm to boxcar willie
if anything, the coaching staff tends to over manage and limit our QB's and WR's due to their perceived strengths and weeknesses
Posted on 4/1/16 at 2:49 pm to boxcar willie
quote:
That has nothing to do with wanting you wanting Harris not to throw to the TE or over the middle of the field or not wanting Harris to have run/pass options.
I'm sorry but I'm not following you on this. For my part, I don't care if we throw to the TE (over the middle or anywhere else) or if our QB has run-pass options.
The play(s) against Bama that I used as an example wasn't merely a case of a single, errant throw. That happens to every QB. In this case, it was bad decision making compounded by a very bad throw. So we run it again and the results are even worse.
Why call the same in-executable play 2X? It was obvious that BH doesn't have that shot in his bag.
I'm simply suggesting to shape our O around the things our QB can execute.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 2:56 pm to danal
quote:
It's amazing how I'm constantly reminded by Les Milophiles how great he is despite the fact that the last 4 years have sucked. He may have reached his peak and is on the way down. Have any of you fools thought about that as a possibility?
exactly. Last three years, 14-10 in the SEC, and 9-9 against the SEC West.
Posted on 4/1/16 at 7:10 pm to AlwysATgr
Page 7 of 10
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News