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re: Is it arrogance or confidence that Coach Orgeron possesses
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:12 am to danfraz
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:12 am to danfraz
I thought O was an atrocious and embarrassing hire. If I could have, I would have fired Alleva the next day for forfeiting the duties of his office.
That said, I've learned over the years watching Cholly Mac on down that a successful HC must recruit well, be a strong leader of the program, and hire great assistants. So far, the new and improved Ogre is doing OK on this I'd say.
I'm putting down the pitch fork....for now.
That said, I've learned over the years watching Cholly Mac on down that a successful HC must recruit well, be a strong leader of the program, and hire great assistants. So far, the new and improved Ogre is doing OK on this I'd say.
I'm putting down the pitch fork....for now.
0
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:15 am to Broski
quote:
Pump the breaks there, champ. Canada is a good offensive mind, could be a great one, but he has proved nothing at the top level yet.
He was the only offensive coach to be a finalist for the Coordinator of the Year award.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:18 am to Sev09
quote:
He was the only offensive coach to be a finalist for the Coordinator of the Year award.
And beat the winner head to head. The Clemson DC won and was taken to the wood shed by Canada's offense.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:20 am to Sev09
quote:
He was the only offensive coach to be a finalist for the Coordinator of the Year award.
This is nice. And I like everything I've seen and read about him. Still no guarantees. I'll continue to operate with cautious optimism.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:23 am to danfraz
quote:
Oh you haven't heard? Miles hired a staff just to keep them locked up in the dungeon below Tiger Stadium. He kept them in line with dogs and making them put lotion in the basket.
quote:
A decade ago Mike Gundy and Josh Henson would sit in the Oklahoma State offensive meeting room and draw up plays they knew their boss would never run. That boss was Cowboys head coach Les Miles.
Henson and Gundy’s ideas “would go on deaf ears with Les,” Gundy said here this week, “because it didn’t involve two tight ends and a fullback.”
Did Les insist on moving guards to tackle, a tackle to center and practice plays only to shelve them come game day?
I'm not interested in throwing dirt on Les because he did many great things as HC here and I like him as a person, but his unwillingness to adapt and allow his offense to evolve led to his downfall. That's a fact.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:25 am to danfraz
quote:
Oh you haven't heard? Miles hired a staff just to keep them locked up in the dungeon below Tiger Stadium. He kept them in line with dogs and making them put lotion in the basket. I mean frick this thread is a dumpster fire of idiocy. O is a great coach despite his 10-50 record cause he's at LSU now :redass:
Don't get me wrong, I'm all in on O now. Not because I thought he was a great hire (I didn't think he was a horrible hire either), but for the same reason I've been all in on every coach since they hired Arnsparger. It's because I don't want to be right on how bad a coaching hire was, I want LSU to win. I also think he has possibly move passed the Ole Miss debacle by realizing at least some of the things he did wrong.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:26 am to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
no it wouldn't. winning single games doesnt mean the winning coach is a better coach.
Who the hell ever said anything about "better coach"? You sure didn't. So now you're trying to change the basis for the argument.
You said
quote:
any sec program that didn't hire a 55 year old career dline coach is laughing at lsu.
I pointed out that the teams that got their asses kicked by the 55 YO dline coach with a TE's coach running the offense aren't laughing.
So now you want to change the argument to the better coach. The Tiger Rant message board is laughing at RichMomma. One post doesn't make a poster a joke but ridiculous post after post after post does.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:26 am to Broski
quote:
shite the bed [quote]Sorry for not being ecstatic about a coach who was an unmitigated disaster at his only other full-time head coaching gig[quote]
It was Ole Miss. Unmitigated Disaster should be their mascot.
[quote]shite the bed in our two toughest games last season
The D was outstanding against Bama. Losing 10-0 against a top 2 team in the country is not shitting the bed. But I'll give you FL, if it were my call the FL game would have knocked O out of contention.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:47 am to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
Coach A one of the most accomplished tenures in sec history,let alone lsu history
Coach B has never run a successful offense,defense or program
Let's set the record straight, shall we?
Miles success was largely due to his recruiting and hiring skills. not his coaching abilities.
Miles's nature of gambling and his number of wins against top ten opponents is what sets him apart sets him up high among legendary coaches. No one coach ever provided college football more entertainment and excitement than Miles.
Miles's problem, he and his staff were rewarded handsomely, so when the coach arrogantly refuses to change coaches or philosophy, this was very troubling, Mile seem to lose interests in winning.
Orgeron lacks the arrogance Miles had, he also lacks the record Miles had, but he deserves an opportunity since he is now LSU's coach , allow him the courtesy of a FULL SEASON to succeed or fail. Then you can opine!
Posted on 7/23/17 at 9:56 am to Tiger Ree
quote:
The Tiger Rant message board is laughing at RichMomma. One post doesn't make a poster a joke but ridiculous post after post after post does.
Look at this irony right here.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 10:00 am to shinerfan
quote:
The D was outstanding against Bama. Losing 10-0 against a top 2 team in the country is not shitting the bed. But I'll give you FL, if it were my call the FL game would have knocked O out of contention.
The defense , with the exception of one frick up, was excellent against Florida. A perfect storm of miscues...all in Florida's favor, was the difference in a game that we actually dominated. The offensive game plan against the gumps was unimaginative. That alone probably cost Emsminger the OC job in spite of record performances at times last season. Sadly, if Orgeron were in charge last season from the start, we problem finish with just two losses. With Canada as OC, we are maybe undefeated. The asshats bitching on here about CEO's days at Ole Miss are some ignorant people. That was at a lesser program over a decade ago. Experience can be an invaluable thing concerning personal and professional growth. His experience at Ole Miss probably made him a better coach at USC. His experience at USC may have made him into a better coach at LSU. We have a tough schedule this season and lost a shite ton of talent from last season, yet I still see us having a better season this year. If we get to year three of CEO and we aren't competing for a title at that point, then he needs to go as well. Until then...Geaux Tigers and a big GFY to the haters.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 10:06 am to jimmy the leg
Great post. All that needs to be said in this thread.
This post was edited on 7/23/17 at 10:07 am
Posted on 7/23/17 at 10:29 am to TrueTigerTale
I don't see arrogance or confidence to be honest.
I see a lot of coachspeak with a ton of shtick and the Cajun personality. Not saying anything is wrong with that but I don't see huge confidence oozing from him.
As an aside there are very positive comments about our new OC Canada. For the most part I agree. If one looks at Canada's track record as an OC there is much reason to be optimistic. He has had success as an OC in the past. It is appropriate and fair to judge him on it.
What I find a bit nuts is the very same people praising Canada based on his experience and track record are the first to jump down someone's throat if one suggests using the same criteria to the HC.
Why is it appropriate to judge Canada on his record as an OC but not Orgeron's as HC.
Like I said I am on board with judging Canada on his past and am excited to see what he will do here. And it's totally fair to judge him on his past as an OC and to expect similar results.
Why is not also fair and appropriate to judge O on his record?
Seriously if we hired an OC that had a track record as an OC say 10-25, got fired, was never a full time OC again on any level, got in season promotions kinda like Ensminger last year, would the praise be same if we hired an OC with that kind of record?
I see a lot of coachspeak with a ton of shtick and the Cajun personality. Not saying anything is wrong with that but I don't see huge confidence oozing from him.
As an aside there are very positive comments about our new OC Canada. For the most part I agree. If one looks at Canada's track record as an OC there is much reason to be optimistic. He has had success as an OC in the past. It is appropriate and fair to judge him on it.
What I find a bit nuts is the very same people praising Canada based on his experience and track record are the first to jump down someone's throat if one suggests using the same criteria to the HC.
Why is it appropriate to judge Canada on his record as an OC but not Orgeron's as HC.
Like I said I am on board with judging Canada on his past and am excited to see what he will do here. And it's totally fair to judge him on his past as an OC and to expect similar results.
Why is not also fair and appropriate to judge O on his record?
Seriously if we hired an OC that had a track record as an OC say 10-25, got fired, was never a full time OC again on any level, got in season promotions kinda like Ensminger last year, would the praise be same if we hired an OC with that kind of record?
Posted on 7/23/17 at 10:32 am to TrueTigerTale
quote:
But I don’t buy that it’ll be Miles. Yeah, he led LSU to a national title, but he also whiffed on several coaching vacancies this past winter which sources say stemmed from poor, "rambling interview
performances".
Well which several coaching vacancies was O up for?
Posted on 7/23/17 at 11:53 am to BayouBengals18
quote:
Yet you throw a bitch for when people question our dumbass AD hiring a guy that's under .500 as a HC. Solid logic
What does my decision on when I watch a football game have to do with any of this shite?
Is Coach O under .500 in his last two coaching gigs in the most recent decade? Did Coach O not have the chance to prove on-the-job that he was qualified to be the LSU HC?
Posted on 7/23/17 at 12:04 pm to Tiger Ree
quote:
Did Coach O not have the chance to prove on-the-job that he was qualified to be the LSU HC?
O did very well as interim at USC and here. And deserves credit and praise for it.
Totally different skillset required to navigate someone else's staff and players than being the one who manages the whole program and makes all the hires and fires.
And after O's interim stint at USC his phone didn't ring with a bunch of HC offers.
Look I hope he is successful and LSU wins a bunch of games and championships but let's not pretend it was a great or even good hire based on the same criteria we use to praise Canada or any other coach.
Deep down if Georgia or South Carolina or A&M or any other SEC school hired O, no one here would argue it was a good hire. And no other school would fear what O brought to them.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 12:46 pm to lsu2006
quote:
Wtf? Who's criticizing Orgeron for taking the job? No need to make stuff up
You fks are acting like he should have turned it down....what because he shite the bed at Ol Piss?
Posted on 7/23/17 at 12:57 pm to NoGeaux
quote:
Totally different skillset required to navigate someone else's staff and players than being the one who manages the whole program and makes all the hires and fires.
How is the skillset different? Does an IHC not manage the whole program? Did O not fire Cameron, hire Pete Jenkins and promote Meatball while he was the interim at LSU?
quote:
And after O's interim stint at USC his phone didn't ring with a bunch of HC offers.
So? Their are a lot of former head coaches whose phones didn't ring. It's not like every team in the nation had a vacancy for a HC at that time.
quote:
but let's not pretend it was a great or even good hire
But it's okay to bitch, moan, groan and cry before anyone knows if it is a great or even a good hire.
quote:
Deep down if Georgia or South Carolina or A&M or any other SEC school hired O, no one here would argue it was a good hire. And no other school would fear what O brought to them
If those teams had hired coach O as an interim coach and he kicked arse with a TE's coach running the offense like O did to Arkansas (38-10) or A&M (54-39) on the road or Missouri (42-7), Ole Miss (38-21) or Arkansas (38-10) at home. Then went out and hired the only offensive Broyles Award finalist as OC, other schools would definitely fear what O brought to them.
What's more impressive:
Taking over for a coach who was fired after going 4-7 in their last 11 games with 3 of the 4 wins coming against Hawaii, Utah State and Boston College. And taking that team, players and coaches and going 5-2 including a win over the #4 team in the country.
Taking over for a coach who was fired after going 4-5 in their last 9 games with 3 of the four wins being home wins against a 1-AA school and a 3-point win over Mississippi State and a neutral site game against defenseless TX Tech, hell even the fourth win was a 19-7 shellacking of A&M in Baton Rouge. And taking that team, firing the OC, promoting the TE's coach to OC and going 6-2 including a bowl win.
OR
Making these changes to the LSU program after becoming the IHC four games into the season:
1) Fired Cam Cameron
2) Fired Bradley Dale Peveto
3) Fired Dameyune Craig (recruiting coordinator last class - had a WR committed since the previous year and found out on signing day the guy would not qualify. Not a good WR's coach.
4) Fired Jabar Juluke - RB coach responsible for Derrius Guice going the wrong way and missing out on every RB recruit except one.
5) Extended Dave Aranda.
6) Promoted Dennis Johnson (Meatball) who out-recruited Tom Herman for K'lavon Chaisson. He was and may still be the nation's #1 rated recruiter for the 2018 class.
7) Hired Tommie Robinson RB coach - the nation's #1 rated recruiter for the 2017 class. Has coached in the NFL as well as college.
8) Hired Matt Canada OC - the only Broyles award candidate on the offensive side of the ball last season.
9) Hired Mickey Joseph WR - has life long ties to the New Orleans and Louisiana and has been recruiting the area for years.
10) Hired Pete Jenkins DL - Probably the most well known and acclaimed D-Line coach in football - college and pro.
11) Is changing the culture of LSU football for the better as has been mentioned by several current and former players and outsiders alike.
Honestly, they all look pretty darn impressive to me.
Which of the changes/moves above do you disagree with? Which one(s) cause you to be pessimistic about the LSU football program's future?
This post was edited on 7/23/17 at 1:02 pm
Posted on 7/23/17 at 1:00 pm to TrueTigerTale
quote:
arrogance or confidence
I mean Urban is arrogant..Spurrier...Kiffin...Saban to a degree..and a few more. But I dont get that arrogant vibe from O. He hasnt done anything yet at LSU to exude arrogance.
Miles was a hell of alot more arrogant in my mind in the sense that he believed his system was the only one that would work here...refusing to change the offense even in the face of mounting criticism and shitty results.
Posted on 7/23/17 at 1:03 pm to RedTigerRulz
quote:
You fks are acting like he should have turned it down
Yeah, no one is doing that.
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