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re: Chest and Vyc Miller
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:46 pm to manonwheels28
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:46 pm to manonwheels28
Cam is the the only 3 SEC level player I’ve seen the last 2 years…
Ward and V Miller would be next 2 in line as potential to be SEC talent.
a MAYBE argument for Jalen Reed, but hurt too soon to tell.
That’s it. No more. 2 years! Yet, we’re gonna let MM retool yet again and expect different ….
Ward and V Miller would be next 2 in line as potential to be SEC talent.
a MAYBE argument for Jalen Reed, but hurt too soon to tell.
That’s it. No more. 2 years! Yet, we’re gonna let MM retool yet again and expect different ….
0
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:47 pm to Hunt the Fan
there was a chart on twitter I don't know how to post, but it was the starting schools of every starting 5 of the sweet 16 teams. only Purdue had developed 5 starters at purdue. every other team only has one or two or even zero players in the starting lineup that were not transfers. good teams are built from transfers.
I actually think good young players should start at small schools for max minutes, like baseball minor leagues.
will wade said this years ago, he said every year was a totally new roster build. McMahon had more of a development mindset but it appears that he realizes wade (who is a genius) was a little ahead of things and knew the way.
I actually think good young players should start at small schools for max minutes, like baseball minor leagues.
will wade said this years ago, he said every year was a totally new roster build. McMahon had more of a development mindset but it appears that he realizes wade (who is a genius) was a little ahead of things and knew the way.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:50 pm to Hunt the Fan
Hunt, I get the reaction to Chest and Miller might be a little dramatic, since they are not world beaters, but to kind of dismiss the talent (which we have sorely lacked) is equally ridiculous.
Chest is a role player that fills a valuable need to any team. Rebounding, defense and hustle is something that we have not had in a while, and we will need next year. Miller needs to work on his body and consistency, but he’s in year 1. A lot of players make a jump in year 2 in those things, so saying you aren’t worried about how much potential he has and how good he is in 2 years doesn’t make sense when we brought him in out of HS. If that’s the case, we might as well quit recruiting freshman.
I just don’t see the reasoning behind spending this year to invest in NIL to give him another chance. If we’ve got 8M to spend on a roster, we should just spend it on the buyout. Woodward should’ve seen where this was heading after year 2 and start preparing for it. We’ve been the worst program over the course of the last 3 years and there’s several people that aren’t surprised.
Chest is a role player that fills a valuable need to any team. Rebounding, defense and hustle is something that we have not had in a while, and we will need next year. Miller needs to work on his body and consistency, but he’s in year 1. A lot of players make a jump in year 2 in those things, so saying you aren’t worried about how much potential he has and how good he is in 2 years doesn’t make sense when we brought him in out of HS. If that’s the case, we might as well quit recruiting freshman.
I just don’t see the reasoning behind spending this year to invest in NIL to give him another chance. If we’ve got 8M to spend on a roster, we should just spend it on the buyout. Woodward should’ve seen where this was heading after year 2 and start preparing for it. We’ve been the worst program over the course of the last 3 years and there’s several people that aren’t surprised.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:55 pm to Hunt the Fan
quote:
Chest is a great athlete who can really rebound. He doesn't, at this point, have another skill to offer. He's an average defender, horrendous shooter and cannot create with the ball on offense at all. At 6-foot-8, he's a little undersized for the skillset that he has. That sounds more like a seven footer. He's a role player.
I agree. I have said from day 1 he reminds me of Emmit Williams. He's not a guy who is going to carry a team often. But he provides things other than scoring that contribute to winning. More that anything though, he was a high level, physical, athlete that LSU has had very few of in the past 3 years. You can coach offense. You can coach defense. You can't coach explosive athleticism and toughness. I wouldn't be shocked to see him end up at, best case scenario, Houston, where that kind of play is a halmark of their program.
quote:
Miller shows some flashes, but he shot 34% from the floor, 29% from three and 63% on free throws in league games. He created nine assists in 209 minutes on the floor. He's still a developmental player.
He was one of the few guys on this team who could create his own offense. While sometime the decision making was questionable, he wasn't intimidated as a freshman and wasn't afraid to try to beat guys off the dribble. His little curl mid-range shot was deadly. He's a scorer with a scorer's mentality. For a coach/program that has been HORRIBLE offensively (avg 128 in KenPom over three years on offense), guys who could find a way to get shots outside of the putrid approach/scheme was welcomed. Where he really struggled was as a spot-up 3 point shooter. He was bad...even though the shooting form looked good. However, I remember seeing a freshman Darius Days not be able to hit water if he fell out of a boat from 3 despite having a good mid-range game. But, by year two those shots started to fall and he became a great 3 point shooter.
quote:
If he can't (which is a real possibility), ok. Go get a new coach. If he can....great. You've found that out, and now you saved the $10mm to buy him out and $3mm/year to hire the new guy and staff.
That doesn't factor in the potential opportunity cost of missing out this year on what could be your next great HC and unnecessarily wasting another year hoping for the unlikely. Yes, if you can MM today you pay his $10M buyout along with the staff. You also have to get a new staff. But it's not like MM's salary comes off the books by leting him coach this year. If you fire him next season you only "save" ~$2M because you'll still then have to pay his $8M buyout, + the staff + new HC.
We have nearly 100 games of data now. The overall question that has to be asked is not "can he be better next season?" It's, "do you think this is the guy that can ever get LSU to the level Auburn, Alabama, Florida, Tennessee, are?" If the answer is "no", then you're just wasting time and prolonging the inevitable.
Good coaches can still be competitive even if they are outmanned to some degree. LSU wasn't competitive (and no, leading at halftime isn't "competitive"). That's why they had the second lowest average scoring margin/point differential in the league. It's one thing to just not be able to get over the hump at the end because you just don't have the guys to consistently do it. It's quite another to get consistently blown out. Which has happened A LOT over the last 3 years.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:58 pm to Tigerfan14
quote:This.
I just don’t see the reasoning behind spending this year to invest in NIL to give him another chance. If we’ve got 8M to spend on a roster, we should just spend it on the buyout.
Throwing the resources into NIL instead of the buyout seems to very much indicate that Woodward is intent on proving he didn't make a bad hire instead of moving on and trying again. It can very much be a crap-shoot when hiring coaches. I can't say for certain that's the driver, but sure seems like it.
And if was all talent we shouldn't have had so many games where we led/close at halftime then get doors blown off after halftime adjustments.
I think it was S, that posted something like this in another thread:
Box Score:
LSU 32 22
Opp 30 47
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:01 pm to Hunt the Fan
No, turn overs snotty defense and lackluster offense is our Coaches problem as is the talent. How many players shot 50% from the field? If you shoot 30-40% at this point in your career you never will shoot 50. Bank that. It’s all about the ball in the bucket however you can do it.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:02 pm to Hunt the Fan
quote:That’s what they all say. It’s not crying.. It’s facts. The problem is you don’t even cover it!!
I'm also capable of evaluating the reality of LSU basketball without crying about three years ago in some hopes that I can go back in time.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:02 pm to manonwheels28
LSU is in WIN NOW mode. Those guys don’t help win next year. Maybe in 2-3 years but we need to upgrade badly
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:07 pm to Alt26
quote:
he reminds me of Emmit Williams
I agree, but this sort of player is becoming obsolete. everyone needs to be able to shoot. 4 of 5 players on the floor have to be shooters or the spacing cant work.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:08 pm to drizztiger
The more concerning thing is wondering what will define this investment being a success? If we are a 10 seed and get bounced in round 1, was the $8m (aledgedly) worth it?
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:10 pm to LSUButt
quote:
LSU is in WIN NOW mode. Those guys don’t help win next year. Maybe in 2-3 years but we need to upgrade badly
you are smokin arse
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:12 pm to LSUButt
quote:LSU is more in the HOPE WE DON'T GO 0-18 IN THE SEC mode.
LSU is in WIN NOW mode. Those guys don’t help win next year. Maybe in 2-3 years but we need to upgrade badly
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:18 pm to Tigerfan14
quote:Agreed. That's what Alt is saying when asking what is CoachMc's ceiling?
The more concerning thing is wondering what will define this investment being a success? If we are a 10 seed and get bounced in round 1, was the $8m (aledgedly) worth it?
If it's squeaking into the NCAAT every other year and getting immediately bounced with an $8mil yearly NIL budget, we just need to cut bait. Bring in McMillan, let him know his first two seasons, his NIL budget will be limited, while we recover from the buyout, so start building and in year 3, we should be in a good state to significantly up the NIL funding. Give him a chance and see what happens. We have enough games under CoachMc to have a solid idea of the expected outcome.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:24 pm to manonwheels28
quote:
Losing Chest and Vyc hurt!
We are getting a lot of new NIL money. Why didn’t we give a little bit of it to them to stay?
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:29 pm to drizztiger
quote:
I have an issue with apologists at all costs using excuse after excuse for poor coaching and horrible basketball.
I don't think those people actually exist in the real world. They're trolls and know certain people will work themselves into a tizzy when the dog whistle is blown.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:44 pm to drizztiger
quote:
A few days ago, the story being told was with Vyc and Chest back, along with some others, we have a decent young core for CoachMc to worth with and add to with the incoming freshman and NIL $$ portal.
Now the story from some are, let Chest and Vyc go, we didn't need them anyway, they were overrated and each only brought unneeded rebounding and potential scoring, respectively.
These dudes are bi-polar or something.
Some folks pick a narrative and try to mold the facts to fit the narrative. There are folks on both sides who do that, I just want LSU to be as good as they can, losing multiple good young players who clearly have the potential to grow significantly in their game is never ideal and usually, at minimum, bad and probably really bad.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:52 pm to Hunt the Fan
He had the number 4 class in the SEC and 13? In the nation. The product he put on the court really represented that. I’ve said before and I’ll say it again. Maybe if we have the #1 overall class, he can get us to a bubble team. He’s a joke and if I were Woody, I would not have campaigned to get him a nickel more than he has had for NIL. Cry wolf too many times and the donors may run off.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:55 pm to mdomingue
quote:
losing multiple good young players who clearly have the potential to grow significantly in their game is never ideal and usually, at minimum, bad and probably really bad.
this is less true than ever. almost all teams lose a lot of young talent every year now. unless they are starting and getting paid they are gone. kentucky and Duke lose massive amounts of talent every year. I would argue that the teams that lose the most talent are the best because talent leaves because it is replaced.
in general the loss of talent is a constant for everyone now. everyone is transferring constantly. the teams left in the tournament except Purdue and Michigan state are largely all transfer starting lineups. those transfers replaced other talent that left.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:58 pm to mdomingue
quote:Even CoachMc detractors want LSU basketball to be as good as possible. It's the only reason we care.
I just want LSU to be as good as they can
Some will get painted as wanting CoachMc to fail, or only Wade fanboys, etc., which is completely false. We wanted CoachMc to succeed since day 1 and the Wade train has left the station. But ignoring all evidence in front of us and just hoping that throwing as much NIL as we can scrape together will unsink the ship is just throwing a dart hoping to hit the board.
It's not that it's impossible for CoachMc to turn it around and succeed at LSU, as I would never say that, but it does seem more unlikely than likely even with additional funding.
Instead of using $8mil to buy him better players for a season, we should use that to bring in a better coach. Names have already been discussed some here, not named Wade.
And to the players. we cheer when we bring in Vyc and Chest and then cheer again when they leave. It's quite the journey.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 3:00 pm to Big4SALTbro
quote:
The Mcmen don’t agree for now give them 10 months and they will and use it as another excuse
I wonder if there are any posters paid to take a position to sway public sentiment. Would only take a few to embolden others who fall on the side of support to confuse perception of support for McMahon and Woodward’s/Wade firing across social media. I suspect would require a small budget to pay a plant.
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