Started By
Message

re: CBS Sports has O on the hot seat.

Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:02 pm to
Posted by TigerLunatik
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Jan 2005
108829 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:02 pm to
quote:

He had his hand picked OC last year too. No one put a gun to his head and told him to hire Canada.

Some around here say that he was forced and cite an artical that said "the BOS were expecting a big name. Enter the Matt's Canada situation."

I don't think that's the case personally. The article simply says that the wanted big name and not necessarily that they wanted that big name to be Canada.
This post was edited on 7/10/18 at 1:13 pm
Posted by The Egg
Houston, TX
Member since Dec 2004
83739 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:02 pm to
quote:

No one put a gun to his head and told him to hire Canada.
instead, Orgeron put a gun to Alleva's head and said he had Kiffin in the bag.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299716 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:07 pm to
quote:

The article simply says that the wanted big name and not necessarily that they wanted that big name to be Canada.


Canada made a big splash in Pitts win over Clemson. Outside of that, their offense wasn't much different than what we had been accustomed. It was a bad hire by O
Posted by JBeam
Guns,Germs & Steel
Member since Jan 2011
68377 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:09 pm to
quote:

This right here is everything that is wrong with our fan base and administration.

Anyone that isn’t outraged by that statement is an absolute fool.

This is the same fanbase and admin that kept CLM around after a TAMU win.

I don't see LSU winning 8-10 games this season. But I do see a large portion of the fanbase going with the "He's one of us. Give him a chance." slogan that keeps CEO's job.
Posted by TigerLunatik
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Jan 2005
108829 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:09 pm to
I don't think bad is a strong enough word to describe the hire.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299716 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:14 pm to
quote:

I don't think bad is a strong enough word to describe the hire


Canada isn't a bad OC, just isn't great and is apparently a toxic personality.
Posted by Imber
Member since Sep 2017
18238 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:14 pm to
quote:

That would actually be a fun game to play...presuppose the excuses used if things go bad.

Problem is, most of the guys arguing the other side of this are not honest actors, so even if you made it VERY VERY clear that you were not hoping for things to go south just anticipating excuses if they did, you'd be lambasted for hoping things go south.

I'd also like to think that by exposing obvious excuses preseason it would prevent them from being used later on...but you know it wouldn't. In fact, it would almost certainly be used as a list from which to draw.




Schedule was too hard
We played X number of freshmen.
Miles left the roster depleted.
Aranda didn't have the defense prepared to play.
Players didn't execute
Fan negativity
Injuries
Ensminger didn't have enough time to install his offense.
(Insert QB) needs more time to develop/learn the offense.

And my personal favorite - No one else wants to be the HC at LSU.

What did I miss?
Posted by Macavity92
Member since Dec 2004
6349 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:14 pm to
quote:

Les Miles was fired because the brand of football he was playing was damaging LSU. It was causing a lot of harm to the "business" of LSU.... that means $$$$.



LSU 5th most valuable CF program 2014. LINK

2015 --- "Overall, LSU increased revenues by $3 million over its 2014-15 level." LINK

2016 the hybrid Les/O year --- "The school’s overall athletic revenue climbed to $147.7 million, a near $6 million increase from the previous year." LINK

Not quite sure how Les was hurting the brand. Note that the 2016 numbers are not football only. These numbers likely also include conference distributions. Point is, LSU is one of the most profitable programs in the country and that was true even under Les. This does not support your theory for his termination.
Posted by JBeam
Guns,Germs & Steel
Member since Jan 2011
68377 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:14 pm to
It was the best he could do when Kiffin didn't come here and Ensimger turned him down after the interim gig.

I don't hate the Canada hire. But I also don't love it. Given the weapons, he had last year and having to deal with CEO. I think we got the most out of the situation.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299716 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:20 pm to
quote:

he had last year and having to deal with CEO. I think we got the most out of the situation.


Someone had to step in. It was apparent after the first couple of games the system was too complex for LSUs players.

O stepping in was the right thing to do, the offense improved throughout the year. Hiring Canada was a bad move on Orgerons part however.
Posted by TigerLunatik
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Jan 2005
108829 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:22 pm to
quote:

Canada isn't a bad OC, just isn't great and is apparently a toxic personality.

I was talking about the hire itself, not that he's a bad coach.
Posted by JBeam
Guns,Germs & Steel
Member since Jan 2011
68377 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:32 pm to
quote:

Someone had to step in. It was apparent after the first couple of games the system was too complex for LSUs players.

I don't think the offense was to complex for LSU's players. The fact is that CEO wanted to roll with Brennan much earlier and Canada wanted to stick with Etling. Which is where some of this turmoil between the two gained legs.
Posted by TigerLunatik
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Jan 2005
108829 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:33 pm to
quote:

The fact is that CEO wanted to roll with Brennan much earlier and Canada wanted to stick with Etling.

I was under the impression that it was the other way around.
Posted by cra_cra
Member since Nov 2016
1743 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:36 pm to
quote:

quote:
Les Miles was fired because the brand of football he was playing was damaging LSU. It was causing a lot of harm to the "business" of LSU.... that means $$$$.


LSU 5th most valuable CF program 2014. LINK

2015 --- "Overall, LSU increased revenues by $3 million over its 2014-15 level." LINK

2016 the hybrid Les/O year --- "The school’s overall athletic revenue climbed to $147.7 million, a near $6 million increase from the previous year." LINK

Not quite sure how Les was hurting the brand. Note that the 2016 numbers are not football only. These numbers likely also include conference distributions. Point is, LSU is one of the most profitable programs in the country and that was true even under Les. This does not support your theory for his termination.


Bravo! Someone gets it. So let’s discuss.

I’ll give you another place to look. Study to payout trends to each sec team, and then think two words..... sec network.

Then look at trends on the game including the playoffs.

And thus the arms race begins. Exposure. Marketability. Go further into the rabbit hole.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299716 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:37 pm to
quote:

I don't think the offense was to complex for LSU's players


I think we set a record for offensive penalties the first three games. It was terrible
Posted by Alt26
Member since Mar 2010
35678 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:38 pm to
quote:

8-9 wins didn't get Miles fired. Running the same play 90% of the time got him fired. IT was creating a situation where, as stated above, it began to affect revenue and it was only trending worse.


And running the "same play 90%" was cited as the cause for only wining 8-9 games as opposed to competing for SEC/National titles.

But since your argument is that the "brand" of football was the reason Les was fired vs. the win/loss results, let's compare 2011 (maybe Miles' best team at LSU) with 2015 (the season that almost saw him fired)

2011

points per game: 35.7
total yards per game: 355.1
yards per play: 5.7
pass yards per game: 152.5
pass attempts per game: 19.9
rush yards per game: 202.6
offensive TD's scored: 56
Total offense rank: 86

2015

points per game: 32.8
total yards per game: 437.2
yards per play: 6.7
pass yards per game: 180.4
pass attempts per game: 23.2
rush yards per game: 256.8
offensive TD's scored: 49
total offense rank: 39

By many objective measures the 2015 offense was better or at least "more explosive" than the 2011 offense. In fact, it was Les's second highest ranked offense in eight years! Yet, after 2011 (at least the regular season) Miles was lauded at a national COY candidate. In 2015, despite the numbers showing he was improving his "brand" of offensive football, he was carried off the field in his final game thinking he was fired.

Why? He was throwing the ball more per game and for more yards. They were gaining more per play than in 2011. The offense was ranked nearly 50 spots higher than 2011. The "brand" of offensive football had improved. So why the desire to fire him after 2015 when he arguably had a more "boring" offense in 2011?

It's ok to say. You know why. Because he went 13-1 in 2011 with a SEC championship and NCG appearance, while in 2015 he went 8-3, with three straight losses in November and a Texas Bowl appearance.

No one would have given a flying frick "how" the offense looked in 2015 if LSU would have beaten Bama, Ark, Ole Miss and gone undefeated that year. Just like no one gave a flying frick how mediocre the offense looked throughout 2011 until it finally reared it's head in the championship game.

Wins and loses are ALL that matter. And the simple truth is that he wasn't getting enough of them for many people. And those people felt the lack of offense was the reason why he wasn't getting them. But unless you are just willfully disingenuous, or completely naive, there is NO thought of Les being fired in 2015 if he wins that November. NONE! In fact, I suspect he is celebrated for running out his second highest ranked offense in eight years on his way to the SECCG
Posted by Goldrush25
San Diego, CA
Member since Oct 2012
33963 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:40 pm to
quote:

How many coaches with the resume of Miles get fired mid-season?


You have to qualify the firing of Les with the fact that Alleva was the one doing the firing. That guy could frick up a cup of coffee.

He should've dropped the hammer at the end of the last season, but we all know that entire situation was bungled. No competent AD tries to fire someone, then backs out only to fire him 4 games into the next season.

quote:

How many schools have seriously considered him since he was let go? I mean 1 natty and 1 natty loss... seems like a lot of teams out there would kill for that, but they aren't. Why?


How many teams are hiring a 64 year old coach at all?

quote:

Every school in the country was negatively recruiting against him.


And you think they're not negatively recruiting against O? They've openly mocked him on TV.

quote:

LSU was getting harder to sell (recruits and our own fans) and it was quantifiable.


Were there studies done to quantify this? Even polling? Otherwise it's just speculation.
This post was edited on 7/10/18 at 1:52 pm
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299716 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:41 pm to
quote:


I was under the impression that it was the other way around.



There were about a billion rumors. I don't believe any of them. Kind of like the post 9/11 rumors.
Posted by TigerLunatik
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Jan 2005
108829 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:44 pm to
The rumors seem to grow in frequency and ridiculousness when it comes this coaching staff.
Posted by nvasil1
Hellinois
Member since Oct 2009
17753 posts
Posted on 7/10/18 at 1:45 pm to
quote:

It was apparent after the first couple of games the system was too complex for LSUs players.

What's wrong with our players? How come Pitt had no trouble picking it up and setting a school record for points in a season?
quote:

O stepping in was the right thing to do, the offense improved throughout the year.

If it was the right thing to do, how come the players said they switched back to Canada's playbook in the 2nd half against Troy?

Maybe the offense improved because the players got more comfortable in Canada's offense and weren't being made to run plays from 2016 anymore.
first pageprev pagePage 6 of 9Next pagelast page

Back to top
logoFollow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News
Follow us on X, Facebook and Instagram to get the latest updates on LSU Football and Recruiting.

FacebookXInstagram