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re: Better QB at LSU, Mauck or Flynn?
Posted on 4/6/11 at 10:57 am to Suntiger
Posted on 4/6/11 at 10:57 am to Suntiger
quote:
Yeah, because Joseph Barksdale, Ciron Black, Herman Johnson, Brett Helms, Quinn Johnson, Jacob Hester, Richard Dickson, D. Byrd, Brandon LaFell, Tyson Jackson, Glenn Dorsey, Ali Highsmith, RJF, Kirston Pittman, Drake Nevis and Darry Beckwith sucked.
Drake Nevis was young and inconsistent
Glenn Dorsey was hurt
RJF was suspended almost the entire year
Beckwith was hurt I believe
Our defense sucked in 2007 in the 2nd half of the season. To compare that defense to 2003 is insulting, and individual players don't make the whole unit great.
and that oline was not near as good as the 2003 Oline. Stewart was his LT. Your oline is only as good as its weakest link.
2003 clearly had a much better defense
2003 had an amazing running game and GREAT protection.
2003 had better receivers IMO
2003 Vincent > 2007 Hester
This post was edited on 4/6/11 at 11:00 am
3
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:01 am to theantiquetiger
I haven't read the thread, and I probably won't. I like both of those guys, both as people, and as quarterbacks. I personally like Flynn, mostly because I followed him from the time he committed. But, I have absolutely no quarrel with anyone who likes Mauck. I am grateful that both of them came to LSU and represented our school.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:06 am to theantiquetiger
if mauck woulda came back for his senior season with michael clayton we woulda repeated in 04
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:15 am to TigerBait1127
quote:
Drake Nevis was young and inconsistent
Glenn Dorsey was hurt
RJF was suspended almost the entire year
Beckwith was hurt I believe
Dorsey was a freakin' All American that year and dominated even after the chop block. That was Nevis' best year besides last year. I'll give you RJF. Beckwith and Ali Highsmith had all star seasons that year. Beckwith got injured in 2008, not 2007.
quote:
that oline was not near as good as the 2003 Oline. Stewart was his LT. Your oline is only as good as its weakest link.
Stewart and Barksdale split time at RT, and I don't think you can say that C. Black, Herman Johnson, Brett Helms, Lyll Hitt, Carnell Stewart/Joseph Barksdale was so much worse than Andrew Whitworth, Stephen Peterman, Rodney Reed, Ben Wilkerson and Nate Livings.
quote:
2003 Vincent > 2007 Hester
They both were 1,000 yard rushers. Not a huge drop off or pick up one way or the other.
And again, you are forgetting that the 2007 team won without Flynn. The 2002 team could not win without Mauck.
quote:
Flynn...Both had weapons all around them and great defenses. Flynn was mobile enough to create things and had a better arm.
Mauck was a runner too. He ran 149 times for 345 yards and 5 touchdowns, which is just a bit more than Flynn's 128 attempts for 341 yards and 5 touchdowns with both having thier longest runs of 27 yards.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:20 am to Suntiger
Nevis had 17 tackles and 0 sacks in 2007
If that was his best year besides last year then what a waste
Beckwith had 65 tackles 1.5 sacks
RJF 9 tackles 1.5 tackles
Kirston Pittman was a stud on that defense with 68 tackles and led team in sacks with 8
If that was his best year besides last year then what a waste
Beckwith had 65 tackles 1.5 sacks
RJF 9 tackles 1.5 tackles
Kirston Pittman was a stud on that defense with 68 tackles and led team in sacks with 8
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:20 am to Suntiger
quote:
The 2002 team could not win without Mauck.
he wasn't the only guy that got hurt.
The 2007 won with a back QB that was a 5* stud recruit that only failed due to off field issues.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:22 am to Suntiger
quote:Didn't they win 3 games, so they could win just not as well since 5-1 with Mauck and 3-4 with Randall
The 2002 team could not win without Mauck.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:26 am to Suntiger
quote:
Dorsey was a freakin' All American that year and dominated even after the chop block.
disagree, he was average after the chop block.
More importantly, THE DEFENSIVE UNIT couldn't keep anyone out the endzone at the end of the year
quote:
They both were 1,000 yard rushers. Not a huge drop off or pick up one way or the other.
Vincent ran for 1,000 yards in half a season because our oline was dominant. quote:
nd I don't think you can say that C. Black, Herman Johnson, Brett Helms, Lyll Hitt, Carnell Stewart/Joseph Barksdale was so much worse than Andrew Whitworth, Stephen Peterman, Rodney Reed, Ben Wilkerson and Nate Livings.
the 2003 oline was the best oline in LSU history and much better than the 2007 oline. I really don't think it is even close.
quote:
And again, you are forgetting that the 2007 team won without Flynn. The 2002 team could not win without Mauck.
no I'm not. The 2007 team had a very good backup QB. The 2003 team did not.
quote:
Mauck was a runner too. He ran 149 times for 345 yards and 5 touchdowns, which is just a bit more than Flynn's 128 attempts for 341 yards and 5 touchdowns with both having thier longest runs of 27 yards.
so Flynn ran for way more YPC despite having a bum ankle all year?
Posted on 4/6/11 at 11:49 am to TigerBait1127
quote:
Had Flynn been our QB his Juior year he'd have won 2 NC's
While my vote is MF we must not forget about the help he had from WV beating Pitt and RP's performance in the SEC championship game that got us to the National Championship. So yeah my vote is MF but he had help and luck which you have to have both to win a National Championship. So I can not necessarily agree with the quote above because who knows if all the chips would have fell in place for us.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 12:46 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
the 2003 oline was the best oline in LSU history and much better than the 2007 oline. I really don't think it is even close.
that 07 line was no slouch. worse in pass pro than 03, but better at rushing the ball.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 12:57 pm to TigerBait1127
"Our defense sucked in 2007 in the 2nd half of the season."
Dat's the truth, largely due to injuries over the course of the season. We lost games in 2007 in which we scored 27 and 28 points in regulation. Not all teh D's fault for sure and teh Ky and Arky games were not Flynn's finest hours, but it would have been unthinkable for the 2003 D not to carry the day if given that many points.
Dat's the truth, largely due to injuries over the course of the season. We lost games in 2007 in which we scored 27 and 28 points in regulation. Not all teh D's fault for sure and teh Ky and Arky games were not Flynn's finest hours, but it would have been unthinkable for the 2003 D not to carry the day if given that many points.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 12:59 pm to SA4LSU
quote:
I can not necessarily agree with the quote above because who knows if all the chips would have fell in place for us
seeing as we lost the same amount of games in 2006 as we did in 2007, its absurd to say we would have won the NC in 2006 with Flynn. We lost to Kentucky on the road in 2007 but somehow we would beaten Fla the swamp or at Auburn who finsihed #8 in 2006.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 1:44 pm to theantiquetiger
I'll go with Flynn. Strangely, one of the biggest clutch plays he ever made at LSU and one of the ones I best remember was a play where he didn't even pick up a first down.
Against Florida in 07, we had a third and fifteen, Flynn went back to pass, had no one open, and scrambled for fourteen yards. We picked up the yard on fourth down and kept the touchdown drive alive. He just seemed to make clutch plays when he had to, like the touchdown pass to Doucet against Alabama on fourth down.
I liked Mauck as well, though few people remember he came to LSU as a safety. At the very beginning of his time at LSU, Saban had him working out at the safety spot, though he didn't stay there long.
Against Florida in 07, we had a third and fifteen, Flynn went back to pass, had no one open, and scrambled for fourteen yards. We picked up the yard on fourth down and kept the touchdown drive alive. He just seemed to make clutch plays when he had to, like the touchdown pass to Doucet against Alabama on fourth down.
I liked Mauck as well, though few people remember he came to LSU as a safety. At the very beginning of his time at LSU, Saban had him working out at the safety spot, though he didn't stay there long.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 2:04 pm to Suntiger
Suntiger - You hit it on the head when you said
"Marcus Randall went 3-4 after Mauck got hurt."
Blame that injury on a guy by the name of Nick Saban. We were up 13, or was it 17 pts? against Fla. at Fla. and it was late in the game when Ole Little Nickie left him in, am I right? My heads a little fuzzy on this one. Someone correct me, I know I'm close to accountability. Bottom line is.... Mauck shouldn't have been in the game. Similar to Wilkerson (All SEC 1st team OFFENSE) gettin' hurt against Vandy? late in the game in another route coached by the Great Lil' Nickie.... Kentuchky game maybe?
"Marcus Randall went 3-4 after Mauck got hurt."
Blame that injury on a guy by the name of Nick Saban. We were up 13, or was it 17 pts? against Fla. at Fla. and it was late in the game when Ole Little Nickie left him in, am I right? My heads a little fuzzy on this one. Someone correct me, I know I'm close to accountability. Bottom line is.... Mauck shouldn't have been in the game. Similar to Wilkerson (All SEC 1st team OFFENSE) gettin' hurt against Vandy? late in the game in another route coached by the Great Lil' Nickie.... Kentuchky game maybe?
This post was edited on 4/6/11 at 2:09 pm
Posted on 4/6/11 at 2:07 pm to Raparooot
quote:
Suntiger - You hit it on the head when you said
"Marcus Randall went 3-4 after Mauck got hurt."
Blame that injury on a guy by the name of Nick Saban. We were up 13, or was it 17 pts? against Fla. at Fla. and it was late in the game when Ole Little Nickie left him in, am I right? My heads a little fuzzy on this one. Someone correct me, I know I'm close to accountability. Bottom line is.... Mauck shouldn't have been in the game. Similar to Wilkerson gettin' hurt late in the game in another route coached by the Great Lil' Nickie.... Kentuchky game maybe?
Kentucky or Vandy I think when Wilkerson was hurt on the last play of the game.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 2:08 pm to BillF
Vandy, I think u are correct. I will now edit my post. Thanks.
Posted on 4/6/11 at 2:13 pm to Raparooot
Just slightly off topic, we may see both of these former championship signal callers back in TS over the next couple of years. 5th anniversary of the 2007 title in 2012 and 10th for 2003 in 2013. I made my choice of Flynn but I will be happy to leave my feet and give a to both.
to both.This post was edited on 4/6/11 at 3:12 pm
Posted on 4/6/11 at 3:02 pm to Raparooot
Matt Flauck!
Posted on 4/6/11 at 3:17 pm to ATLTiger
quote:
that 07 line was no slouch. worse in pass pro than 03, but better at rushing the ball.
Who were the starters on the right side of the 07 OL?
Posted on 4/6/11 at 3:28 pm to BillF
quote:
Against Florida in 07, we had a third and fifteen, Flynn went back to pass, had no one open, and scrambled for fourteen yards. We picked up the yard on fourth down and kept the touchdown drive alive. He just seemed to make clutch plays when he had to, like the touchdown pass to Doucet against Alabama on fourth down.
Good point. We don't win that Florida game if he doesn't make that run.
I would say Flynn is the better QB. Mauck had a better defense to fall back on, and Jimbo had a habit of padding stats against poor teams.
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