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re: Nutrition topics that are in dispute and your findings
Posted on 6/15/21 at 9:55 am to Powerman
Posted on 6/15/21 at 9:55 am to Powerman
Soy is another disputed topic. I saw it in a thread on another board, and I actually thought it kind of fit this thread better. Corn and soybeans are the two crops for US farm subsidies.
As foods, the byproducts from these can be awful. High-fructose corn syrup, hydrogenated soybean oil, various ingredients that contain MfG, etc.
Then you've got dextrose and maltodextrin. Some bodybuilders use those to spike insulin. But that's done as part of a method for recovery from extreme workouts. People who rarely exercise or don't exercise are consuming these as ingredients in all sorts of foods and drinks.
The macros on soybeans themselves and foods like tofu and endamame aren't bad. But there's the issue of phytoestrogens.
It seems Asian countries have utilized soybeans in some of the best ways as fermented foods.
As foods, the byproducts from these can be awful. High-fructose corn syrup, hydrogenated soybean oil, various ingredients that contain MfG, etc.
Then you've got dextrose and maltodextrin. Some bodybuilders use those to spike insulin. But that's done as part of a method for recovery from extreme workouts. People who rarely exercise or don't exercise are consuming these as ingredients in all sorts of foods and drinks.
The macros on soybeans themselves and foods like tofu and endamame aren't bad. But there's the issue of phytoestrogens.
It seems Asian countries have utilized soybeans in some of the best ways as fermented foods.
This post was edited on 6/15/21 at 9:58 am
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Posted on 6/15/21 at 11:19 am to inadaze
quote:
There are 40 essential micronutrients that people have to get from their diet. Those micronutrients are vital to improve health and prevent disease.
I see what you're saying about people having trouble with the basics, but there are a lot of micronutrient deficiencies as well.
Study: Half of All Americans are Magnesium Deficient
And a simple multi takes care of 99% of those lol.
And do micros really matter for optimizing health when you are 30%+ bodyfat?
My point is 99% of people need to get their bodyfat % down to the 15% range for males, 23-25% range for females before worrying some damn micros.
Perfect example is most(not all but most) female vegans. Have no muscle tome and can't do a pushup but scream about veggies being healthy. It's all bullshite. People focusing on the wrong thing.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 11:47 am to Powerman
Eggs is a good one. Bacon is another. It was always beat into our heads that bacon was terrible for you. Now, I hear how bacon is just like any other piece of meat so long as you don’t eat too much.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 11:51 am to lsu777
quote:
My point is 99% of people need to get their bodyfat % down to the 15% range for males, 23-25% range for females before worrying some damn micros.
Fat acceptance! Am I right or am I right?
This post was edited on 6/15/21 at 11:56 am
Posted on 6/15/21 at 12:08 pm to lsu777
quote:
And do micros really matter for optimizing health when you are 30%+ bodyfat?
I think an argument could be made that it probably matters more to those people
quote:
My point is 99% of people need to get their bodyfat % down to the 15% range for males, 23-25% range for females before worrying some damn micros.
Why not do both at the same time?
You can definitely get your macros "right" and eat an unhealthy diet
Posted on 6/15/21 at 12:17 pm to Powerman
quote:
I think an argument could be made that it probably matters more to those people
quote:
Why not do both at the same time?
You can definitely get your macros "right" and eat an unhealthy diet
because 95%+ of the benefits of a "diet" comes from the fat loss itself, nto a diet.
and no you really cant get your macros right and have an unhealthy diet.
all this other stuff is just majoring in the minors and focusing on BS that doesnt matter.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 12:42 pm to lsu777
quote:
because 95%+ of the benefits of a "diet" comes from the fat loss itself, nto a diet.
and no you really cant get your macros right and have an unhealthy diet.
all this other stuff is just majoring in the minors and focusing on BS that doesnt matter.
Indisputable, being a healthy weight leads to increased longevity in almost every case.
All the meal timing and certain macros and all that shite is just about optimizing and gaining that last 5%.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 12:43 pm to lsu777
quote:
and no you really cant get your macros right and have an unhealthy diet.
I'll have to disagree there
You could eat some pretty horrendous shite and hit your macro targets
Posted on 6/15/21 at 12:49 pm to Powerman
I’ll go ahead
Vegetables being ultimate health food.
I have yet to see the rct on taking the intervention group, doing nothing but only adding a serving of vegetables to each meal. No lifestyle changes, no exercise, just adding vegetables and still eating the shitty things for meals/snacks.
I doubt the body weight and blood draws would be much improved.
Now, are vegetables better than your granola bars or cereal? I think so and they are a good option. Are they the driver mainstream makes them? I doubt it. Nutrients can be found more efficiently through other foods.
Vegetables being ultimate health food.
I have yet to see the rct on taking the intervention group, doing nothing but only adding a serving of vegetables to each meal. No lifestyle changes, no exercise, just adding vegetables and still eating the shitty things for meals/snacks.
I doubt the body weight and blood draws would be much improved.
Now, are vegetables better than your granola bars or cereal? I think so and they are a good option. Are they the driver mainstream makes them? I doubt it. Nutrients can be found more efficiently through other foods.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 1:13 pm to lsu777
Yes, I think micronutrients matter a lot to even people "30%+". They matter for the reasons I mentioned plus having those micros at good levels will have a positive effect relative to their hunger -- which could lead to bad choices of what to consume. There are lots of other factors related to leptin levels -- good sleep, healthy fats and protein, other lifestyle factors. But yeah, micronutrients factor in with the others.
I think a multivitamin is a good idea, but most "simple" multivitamins don't have much magnesium, and some types of magnesium that companies use don't absorb well, so that could still be an issue.
A lot of the cheaper multivitamins also don't have Vitamin K and some minerals. Also, included in essential micronutrients are 9 amino acids, Omega-3 and Omega-6. So I think it's important to look for quality in a multivitamin, and maybe supplement with fish oil and magnesium if someone's not getting those from their diet.
I think having good levels of micronutrients will help the people you're referring to in losing bodyfat.
I think a multivitamin is a good idea, but most "simple" multivitamins don't have much magnesium, and some types of magnesium that companies use don't absorb well, so that could still be an issue.
A lot of the cheaper multivitamins also don't have Vitamin K and some minerals. Also, included in essential micronutrients are 9 amino acids, Omega-3 and Omega-6. So I think it's important to look for quality in a multivitamin, and maybe supplement with fish oil and magnesium if someone's not getting those from their diet.
I think having good levels of micronutrients will help the people you're referring to in losing bodyfat.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 1:28 pm to Powerman
Being highly active and other factors like genetics could offset some of it, but I agree. A person can be at their macros, but still be eating "unhealthy".
Posted on 6/15/21 at 2:15 pm to Junky
I’m a big proponent of adding a healthy portion of vegetables to your meals. Try eating 300 calories of broccoli for lunch. You can’t, and if you could you would be full for so long you wouldn’t even think about grabbing a little debbie as a snack later.
I hate on keto a lot because people have perverted it into an “eat all the cheese and greasy meat you want as long as it’s not carbs” diet. I think if you’re going to do keto at least follow the Atkins diet recommendations on vegetables, salads, portion sizes, etc.
I hate on keto a lot because people have perverted it into an “eat all the cheese and greasy meat you want as long as it’s not carbs” diet. I think if you’re going to do keto at least follow the Atkins diet recommendations on vegetables, salads, portion sizes, etc.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 2:31 pm to Powerman
Mainly, one strategy fits all body types. The human body is nothing more than a manufacturing facility. Some can process fat better than carbs, and vice-versa.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 2:49 pm to Powerman
I align with the Greg Doucettes of the world when it comes to bulking and cutting. I used to do bulking and cutting cycles but it was a waste of time. I would bulk up and then cut off the fat and when I was done cutting it was as if I never bulked because of the muscle loss during the cut.
I've had more success with the "maingaining" or "gaintaining". Cut down to a body fat you like, then just eat slightly below maintenance. You will gain muscle slower, but you don't have to waste time with bulk/cut cycles and worry about getting fat.
I've had more success with the "maingaining" or "gaintaining". Cut down to a body fat you like, then just eat slightly below maintenance. You will gain muscle slower, but you don't have to waste time with bulk/cut cycles and worry about getting fat.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 2:55 pm to goldennugget
quote:
I align with the Greg Doucettes of the world when it comes to bulking and cutting. I used to do bulking and cutting cycles but it was a waste of time. I would bulk up and then cut off the fat and when I was done cutting it was as if I never bulked because of the muscle loss during the cut.
I've had more success with the "maingaining" or "gaintaining". Cut down to a body fat you like, then just eat slightly below maintenance. You will gain muscle slower, but you don't have to waste time with bulk/cut cycles and worry about getting fat.
I've maintained the same weight for the last year while getting significantly stronger. Like 25 lbs increase on deadlift stronger.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 3:38 pm to Mingo Was His NameO
Mark Rippetoe could have you making gains like that in 5 weeks!!!! Do your fives!!!!
I'm kidding, kind of. I think his barbell system has a lot of good core ideas for strength, but it's sort of similar to IIFYM to me. It just simplifies things for people, which can work for people who just want a real simple system to follow.
I'm kidding, kind of. I think his barbell system has a lot of good core ideas for strength, but it's sort of similar to IIFYM to me. It just simplifies things for people, which can work for people who just want a real simple system to follow.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 8:47 pm to inadaze
Well if you are talking about starting strength it's about linear progression. It's for novice hence the name novice barbell training.
Mingo ain't a novice though and is really strong for his bodyweight.
Mingo ain't a novice though and is really strong for his bodyweight.
Posted on 6/15/21 at 9:39 pm to lsu777
Their most popular programs are designed for novices, but they have programs for advanced lifters as well.
Good design for strength, but I like to do more of a diverse range of movements -- more explosive movements, sprinting, yoga, etc. Strength is a goal, but not my only goal.
You talking about Barkevious? He was strong for his weight. Or this guy who went up 25 pounds in a year on deadlift? I don't know about him.
Good design for strength, but I like to do more of a diverse range of movements -- more explosive movements, sprinting, yoga, etc. Strength is a goal, but not my only goal.
You talking about Barkevious? He was strong for his weight. Or this guy who went up 25 pounds in a year on deadlift? I don't know about him.
Posted on 6/16/21 at 3:18 pm to Powerman
This one isn't really a dispute, but just some useful info. There have been a number of studies on olive oil that have found a lot of fraud. Studies have found that some of what is labeled as olive oil turns out to be soybean oil or other types of oils. Some of the fraud is due to mafia influence in Italy. Look for the seals for quality olive oil:
COOC
NAOOA
IOC
EVA
COOC
NAOOA
IOC
EVA
Posted on 6/27/21 at 8:07 pm to Powerman
I've been looking more into some of these issues with phytic acid and lectins.
Aside from preparation methods to reduce the amounts, there are some other foods that can have a countereffect. On reducing phytic acid, acidic substances and foods that contain phytase can help. Avocados contain phytase, but I'm still looking for more info on the amounts of phytase in various foods.
On reducing lectins, I found some foods that contain mannose and glucosamine (fruits, crustaceans), which can bind to lectins. (It's a mindfrick when you get into these internal complexities. "You" go through these processes all the time, but without conscious thought of it. "You" do it, but the "you" identified as the "conscious I" does not, and generally has no idea what the deeper unconscious "you" is doing.) But the most interesting information I found on lectins was the role they can play in preventing infection of coronaviruses.
Plant lectins are potent inhibitors of coronaviruses by interfering with two targets in the viral replication cycle
Reducing COVID-19 Risk through Dietary Supplementation of Plant Mannose Binding Lectins
Aside from preparation methods to reduce the amounts, there are some other foods that can have a countereffect. On reducing phytic acid, acidic substances and foods that contain phytase can help. Avocados contain phytase, but I'm still looking for more info on the amounts of phytase in various foods.
On reducing lectins, I found some foods that contain mannose and glucosamine (fruits, crustaceans), which can bind to lectins. (It's a mindfrick when you get into these internal complexities. "You" go through these processes all the time, but without conscious thought of it. "You" do it, but the "you" identified as the "conscious I" does not, and generally has no idea what the deeper unconscious "you" is doing.) But the most interesting information I found on lectins was the role they can play in preventing infection of coronaviruses.
Plant lectins are potent inhibitors of coronaviruses by interfering with two targets in the viral replication cycle
Reducing COVID-19 Risk through Dietary Supplementation of Plant Mannose Binding Lectins
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