re: Explain it to me like I’m 5 - Running edition

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Goal is to get my 5K/10K pace below 7 mins

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Same, ultimately I'd love to go sub 21:00 but that will take a while. 42 here. OP I have the same issue as you, hard to slow myself down. Got a 5k coming up in a couple of weeks so we'll see if there are any results from this 5 weeks or so of training I've been doing.

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I can push through the leg pain but my competitive nature won’t let me run 10-11 minute mile.

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Why are you having leg pain? Youll get more efficient and heart rate will go down the more you adapt. Why do you need to
monitor heart rate?

What are your "hill repeats"? was this 6 hill runs that took 2min each? what grade is the hill?

if your threshold run is only 140-150 hr something is wrong or you just don't run hard.

BTW everyone knows you're almost 50. not sure why you always mention this.

" 6 x 2 mins with a 2 min or better cool down. 170+ HR on the sprints and back down to 140. Not sure on the grade, but I run in Vestavia Hills and Cahaba Heights. Not exactly flat."

if this is a sprint i would think your HR would be pushing much closer to max.

from the all knowing google search - the Threshold Zone” where we get up to about 80-90% of our max heart rate. so for you at 195 max a 85% threshold is 165 not 140-150 which tells me you aren't running hard enough when you are suppose to which is pretty much the concept of zone 2 training?

i've asked before but what your measuring stick to say the zone 2 80/20 plan is working for you? is it your 5k got x% faster over a certain time frame or you HR number for your age is x% higher than the "norm".

several people comment about the zone 2 being so great but what is it measured against?

sure theres a correlation b/w age and heart rate but you age comments seems to follow statements about your pace. not sure if its a boast or a self-roast....

BTW i'm 46 never trained by hr. i just run so i'm pretty much an expert based on staying at a holiday inn once.

Running after lifting was really difficult for me. The quality of the runs just was not there. I lift MWF and run T, Th, S now, which has been way more sustainable and the training has felt way better.

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several people comment about the zone 2 being so great but what is it measured against?

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Aerobic fitness, think of it like a pyramid structure. Most of your work needs to be setting the base. Especially starting out, at least 80% of your workouts should be expanding the base level, or Z2 cardio.

To improve fitness, you need consistency, duration, and intensity. Don't increase any one of those too much at the same time. This is how I train on my Peloton using the power zone classes they have.

For example, if I ride 3-4 times a week, 2 of those will be a 45 minute endurance based class. You're never feeling gassed, but you can tell you're working out. Then a 3rd class, you might push a little harder, but not all out. The weekend is usually reserved for a longer, hour plus ride at an easier pace. The goal is to do the same endurance type workout, but for a longer period to let your body adjust to working at that same pace for longer.

To compare it to running, if you usually run 3-4x a week for 30-45 minutes at a 10 min/mile pace, you might try to run for only 30 minutes at a 9 min/mile pace on one of them. A slight increase in your tempo, and you can tell it is harder, but not going to kill you. Follow that with a longer run on the weekend. Go for an hour, but take it easy. Slow it down to an 11 min/mile pace and settle in for the longer duration.

The next week, you can either increase the intensity on the shorter run, think speed work, or increase the duration on the longer run, or add another 30 minute run into the mix. You would still keep your base runs the same. But you wouldn't do all 3 in the same week. When you get to where your tempo feels comfortable in your base runs, then slightly increase your pace. Move from a 10 minute pace to 9:30 and see how your body adjusts for a week or two. If that feels comfortable, then increase the pace a little on the shorter run. If that felt okay, run for 75 minutes on your long run the following week.

I admit it has been a while since I ran, since I do most of my aerobic work on the bike, but the training plans have a good bit of common sense crossover. The only way to get comfortable doing longer workouts is to gradually increase. The only way you can gradually increase those is by putting in the work during the week so you're prepared for the longer workout. The only way to speed up your faster runs is by being fitter from doing the base work. Without that, you'll feel gassed and burn out.

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i don't fully understand how one should measure progress. yes for a beginner pretty much any method of being active will lead to progress.

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This is kind of where I am too. I guess for people who have no running background and would tend to injure themselves or burn out, a Z2 approach like Maffetone keeps them from doing too much; but I'm wary of any "system" that bases its training too much on HR, especially with a formula. I've got thousands of lifetime miles and know what easy feels like. Why do I need to check my watch to make sure I'm at 150bpm and not 160? What if it's hot out? Am I expected to slow my pace to a walk if it's too humid? How does that prepare me for races that are going to be hot and humid?

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so it goes back to original question how should one measure that zone 2 training is working?

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Peter Attia on Zone 2

This will be more information than you probably need. My measurement that I am using is my VO2 max. I want to try and increase it as much as possible before I hit age 70.

I ran all last year using a different coach's HR targets: 140-160 for zone 2 and 180+ for VO2 max. While my VO2 did go up, it was marginal. I'm trying this for 6 months and will retest again in April to see if it moves the needle.