re: Are this leftist's views way out of line?

You put his "leftist" argument in such a way that it was obvious you wanted this 80 percent right wing board to agree with you.

TdPoli is an echo chamber but it cant help you win retroactive irl arguments man

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It's because he believes no one has the right to enjoy the fruits of their labor.


So everyone should enjoy the fruits of their labor but people who are sick do not get to enjoy the fruits of being alive if it's too expensive?
Money is more important than life itself. Got it.

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You do realize that every healthcare system in the world puts an economic value on human lives, right?

Ever heard of QALY or NICE?

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Your wages are the state's & the state doles out to you what they think you should get


Plenty of other countries do it well. Oh and by the way we are the state. We don't live in an authoritarian system. The state is us.

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They generally don't have the disposable income that the U.S. has, with very few exceptions. Healthcare spending correlates very well with consumer spending; that is, it's a normal good. Because we are richer than just about every other OECD country, especially considering PPP, we spend more, and not that we spend more because our system is inherently more expensive.

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It's communism w/o the violence. Of course, his beliefs would soon beget more violence, so it's moot.


Give me a break. Plenty of other countries have Universal Health Care and haven't slipped into communism because of it. Your paranoia is showing

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The U.S. is the home of the majority of healthcare innovation in the world by almost any measure. Those systems would suffer immensely were we to move to theirs.

(no message)

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we have too much disposable income and that we needed to spend more of our money on healthcare, food, housing, energy, etc...

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does he have a mouse in his pocket? I'm sure the "we" he is discussing does not include him. He can give away all that he wants of his disposable income to needy people

not raving, just lunatic

so he believes in making the masses poor and dependent on the super rich. I'm shocked.

People like this high school teacher would have us all riding bicycles and living like paupers. The UN's agenda 21 seeks to herd us all into cities and basically make slaves of us. Instead of embracing technology and riding the wave into the future we'd all be stuck living with 19th century technology. It's a dangerous ideology that has a to toehold and has to be guarded against. Incidentally the world's leaders will be living in the lap of luxury while the rest live in misery. Anyone following this needs to be taken out and shot.

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ask him if he is willing to walk the talk and next time he is up for a raise or promotion as a teacher, will he refuse the extra money and demand it be given it a newer, less experienced lower paid teacher. you know to equalize pay for all.

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I'm sure he views himself as being in the right position, and everyone above him will give up money to everyone below him, and we'll all be right where he is now.

ETA: He never said what I just said. That's just my gut feeling. He may fully expect to do with less than what he has now. But his primary focus was on how we, as a society consume too much - we have too many cars, our houses are too big, we eat too much, we have too many computers, our tv's are too big, etc...

Another interesting point that he brought up that I didn't mention, and I'm sure will piss off liberals.

He believes that we should go back to what he called a "natural order" of society. He believes that men should work outside of the homes and women should be homemakers.

He said that women are more natural caregivers and men should be the providers. He believes that we produce too much, and part of that is because we have so many women in the workforce. So that goes back to our overconsumption, and if we produce less, we will consume less.

That was a curveball I wasn't expecting...

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That's also part of the Christian philosophy. Lol.

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And it didn't work for the early "church" when they tried it in the Book of Acts. Human nature took over when they all lived in one house and contributed everything to a communal "pot". Same thing happened as in Jamestown early colonial times. Some did not contribute and took from the pool, some took more than contributed but at least contributed.

Face it, at no time in recorded history has any type of communal social program ever worked.

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Yeah, except he didn't believe so much in the government taking and distributing the resources, as much as for the government making it difficult for anybody to accumulate wealth. He sees the process taking a long, long time, because nobody is going to voluntarily give up their wealth all at once.

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I would totally support a system that made it harder for business owners and such to get wealthy beyond all belief while underpaying their employees in exchange for gettting rid of the massive welfare state we have.

The reason we will never have any sort of movement in this is because A) Rich conservatives don't want to share what "they have earned" with their employees beyond that which the government absolutely forces them to and B) Liberals don't want to tell people work or starve

Those are two realities that each respective side won't admit about their own side. Oh sure every conservative will say "make those lazy bastards work why don't you?" and every liberal will say "you greedy bastards don't take care of your employees" but few will chastise "their own side"

I would like to see the minimum wage raised to $15 an hour and all welfare for those who are capable of working removed with a correspondig drop in taxes. IOW I don't want the government keeping the tax money that is no longer going towards welfare, they can lower taxes by the same amount. Then see how things shake out.

My bet is 90% of the people who are on welfare now would suddenly find jobs when they realized the gravy train was over. The other 10%? Let them die.

And of course we are talking about the ones who CAN work here, Those who are truly disabled (not "I'm too sad to work" disabled but "I only have one leg" disabled, are not part of this discussion.