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re: Who does everyone have in the Pacquio v. Horn fight tonight?
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:03 am to Patrick_Bateman
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:03 am to Patrick_Bateman
Why does boxing even have judges?
You can basically look at the punching stats and tell who won. Just develop a way to determine the winner that way.
Obviously the punching stats are developed by people or computers or whatever, but those are easier to verify. There can be checks and balances there.
There's not checks and balances when a judge just says "117-111" with literally no explanation behind it.
You can basically look at the punching stats and tell who won. Just develop a way to determine the winner that way.
Obviously the punching stats are developed by people or computers or whatever, but those are easier to verify. There can be checks and balances there.
There's not checks and balances when a judge just says "117-111" with literally no explanation behind it.
This post was edited on 7/2/17 at 1:06 am
2
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:04 am to beauchristopher
I thought the entire card was filled with good fights, was a pretty good night of boxing overall, that decision withstanding. it's too bad that will overshadow it tho.
I can't wait to see Lomachenko and Crawford on this promo.
I can't wait to see Lomachenko and Crawford on this promo.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:05 am to Schmelly
I haven't watched boxing in maybe 10-12 years, but I'm glad I tuned in tonight. The fight was entertaining, to be sure.
Gonna float this out there... I don't necessarily think this was as bad as Teddy Atlas was ranting. Consider-
professional boxing does have some leeway in the scoring. I've seen it reward aggression, and I've seen it heavily slanted towards the champ/favorite. It rarely goes straight down the stat line.
If you're like Teddy, then you favor the champ (and he was talking about Manny all fight long, will he knock this guy out, etc). Any close round will go to the champ.
Other end of the spectrum, you don't care about total punches landed, if they aren't effective. You favor the guy pushing the action. As they used to say, this isn't amateur boxing, you don't automatically win a round just by landing more. You get credit for controlling the pace.
Teddy gave a lot of early rounds to Manny, and he wasn't the aggressor, and he wasn't hurting Horn. I think at one point he had Pac 6 rds to 1. In all honesty, there wasn't much difference in any of those rounds, Horn was pushing the action, Manny was countering but not hurting him.
Offhand, I'd say those are the rounds the judges gave to Horn instead.
He got the benefit of being the aggressor, Manny didn't get the benefit of being the champ, and what's more, I do think the crowd factored in- Horn got the benefit of being the crowd favorite. Not a rigged score, but in this case, he didn't have to beat Manny, Manny had to beat him in those rds, and he didn't.
Gonna float this out there... I don't necessarily think this was as bad as Teddy Atlas was ranting. Consider-
professional boxing does have some leeway in the scoring. I've seen it reward aggression, and I've seen it heavily slanted towards the champ/favorite. It rarely goes straight down the stat line.
If you're like Teddy, then you favor the champ (and he was talking about Manny all fight long, will he knock this guy out, etc). Any close round will go to the champ.
Other end of the spectrum, you don't care about total punches landed, if they aren't effective. You favor the guy pushing the action. As they used to say, this isn't amateur boxing, you don't automatically win a round just by landing more. You get credit for controlling the pace.
Teddy gave a lot of early rounds to Manny, and he wasn't the aggressor, and he wasn't hurting Horn. I think at one point he had Pac 6 rds to 1. In all honesty, there wasn't much difference in any of those rounds, Horn was pushing the action, Manny was countering but not hurting him.
Offhand, I'd say those are the rounds the judges gave to Horn instead.
He got the benefit of being the aggressor, Manny didn't get the benefit of being the champ, and what's more, I do think the crowd factored in- Horn got the benefit of being the crowd favorite. Not a rigged score, but in this case, he didn't have to beat Manny, Manny had to beat him in those rds, and he didn't.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:05 am to Pedro
Obviously 117-111 is rediculous.
But I in no way think 115-113 for Horn is crazy.
The whole show at the end of the 9th was preposterous. Horn was fricking fine once the round ended. It was not a 10-8 thing.
The melt is funny though.
But I in no way think 115-113 for Horn is crazy.
The whole show at the end of the 9th was preposterous. Horn was fricking fine once the round ended. It was not a 10-8 thing.
The melt is funny though.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:07 am to Patrick_Bateman
PAC out jabbed him and out powered him as well as actually mangled his face up
He head butted PAC twice
He head butted PAC twice
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:07 am to BayouBengals03
That sounds good to me if no knockout
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:08 am to Wild Thang
quote:
The whole show at the end of the 9th was preposterous. Horn was fricking fine once the round ended. It was not a 10-8 thing.
If the ref is threatening to stop the fight, I'd say it's not your typical 10-9 round...
This post was edited on 7/2/17 at 1:09 am
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:08 am to Wild Thang
quote:
The whole show at the end of the 9th was preposterous.
The ref walking to the corner and saying he wanted to end the fight honestly looked staged. Like there was no reason for him to do that at all.
Honestly a little fishy.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:08 am to BayouBengals03
That's really a great point
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:09 am to vengeanceofrain
quote:How much coke have you done tonight?
vengeanceofrain
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:11 am to Scoob
Teddy gave the first round to him
Manny definitely won the next two
I had it that way just watching with no commentary early on
Manny definitely won the next two
I had it that way just watching with no commentary early on
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:12 am to ReauxlTide222
Not enough lol
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:12 am to Scoob
quote:
professional boxing does have some leeway in the scoring. I've seen it reward aggression, and I've seen it heavily slanted towards the champ/favorite. It rarely goes straight down the stat line.
And this is why it's fricking stupid.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:13 am to Scoob
If you look at this fight in a different light, the decision isn't really that surprising.
Horn put 55 thousand butts in the seats.
Right now, there isn't an American boxer outside of Mayweather that would do the same here. But there used to be- Sugar Ray, Golden Boy, etc etc.
You put one of those guys into the ring in, say, Giants Stadium or the Superdome, fighting an aging champ from another country, and they will win the round unless they get dominated. That's exactly what happened in the past, and it happened today. It's just that nobody here knew who Horn was; but they clearly did over there.
Horn put 55 thousand butts in the seats.
Right now, there isn't an American boxer outside of Mayweather that would do the same here. But there used to be- Sugar Ray, Golden Boy, etc etc.
You put one of those guys into the ring in, say, Giants Stadium or the Superdome, fighting an aging champ from another country, and they will win the round unless they get dominated. That's exactly what happened in the past, and it happened today. It's just that nobody here knew who Horn was; but they clearly did over there.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:13 am to Bunyan
I'd like to have seen Mosley in the booth tonight
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:13 am to Scoob
quote:Not Not what more Manny needed to do, he landed twice as many punches.
he didn't have to beat Manny, Manny had to beat him in those rds, and he didn't
Manny landed almost as many power punches as Horn landed total punches. Horn couldn't touch Manny, at all.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:14 am to Wild Thang
Yeah I agree with this. Horns style gave Pacquiao fits and Pac is just not at the level he's been known for.
Looking forward to the Broner-Mikey Garcia fight later this month.
Looking forward to the Broner-Mikey Garcia fight later this month.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:15 am to Scoob
quote:Your overall premise surely probably helped Horn but... Horn did get dominated for most of the fight.
and they will win the round unless they get dominated
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:15 am to smash williams
quote:Did it?
Horns style gave Pacquiao fits
The punch data says otherwise.
Posted on 7/2/17 at 1:18 am to Scoob
quote:
I haven't watched boxing in maybe 10-12 years, but I'm glad I tuned in tonight. The fight was entertaining, to be sure.
Gonna float this out there... I don't necessarily think this was as bad as Teddy Atlas was ranting. Consider-
professional boxing does have some leeway in the scoring. I've seen it reward aggression, and I've seen it heavily slanted towards the champ/favorite. It rarely goes straight down the stat line.
If you're like Teddy, then you favor the champ (and he was talking about Manny all fight long, will he knock this guy out, etc). Any close round will go to the champ.
Other end of the spectrum, you don't care about total punches landed, if they aren't effective. You favor the guy pushing the action. As they used to say, this isn't amateur boxing, you don't automatically win a round just by landing more. You get credit for controlling the pace.
Teddy gave a lot of early rounds to Manny, and he wasn't the aggressor, and he wasn't hurting Horn. I think at one point he had Pac 6 rds to 1. In all honesty, there wasn't much difference in any of those rounds, Horn was pushing the action, Manny was countering but not hurting him.
Offhand, I'd say those are the rounds the judges gave to Horn instead.
He got the benefit of being the aggressor, Manny didn't get the benefit of being the champ, and what's more, I do think the crowd factored in- Horn got the benefit of being the crowd favorite. Not a rigged score, but in this case, he didn't have to beat Manny, Manny had to beat him in those rds, and he didn't.
Everything you said is true.
Atlas had it 6-1 through 7? I was like
4-3 at best for PAC, I had it the other way. I did not have a 10-8 in the 9th. That's just stupid.
And if it was so close to being done, How does Horn go from the jump starting the 10th, let alone own the final round?
Give me a break. And frick Stephen A, who the frick is he to comment on boxing? I will listen to Kellerman's reaction even If I don't agree.
I think it was a draw. I didn't see a winner. And it was a bad arse fight for free (cable bills lol)
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