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re: How is O different than Miles?
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:23 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:23 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
he hired crowton to change things up after Jimbo and we went more spread and then started building around a spread-option attack. it just didn't work. our OL was switching from man to zone and we had some talent issues. JJ wasn't really a running QB and we tried to make him into one (and he was JJ). miles could never buy in to changing his mentality
it was just a mess. then in 2011 stud had to takeover and we went super simple, got incredibly lucky to score so many points via defense/STs that Miles was just like "frick it". still though, even after that, we did have 2013 sandwiched in the middle of absolute dinosaur offenses
Les was too scared to change. i think O is going to be the opposite. he's going to change shite a ton and doesn't have the mental or coaching ability to really develop an identity. when our coordinators start to leave, it's going to be utter chaos because O isn't creating a philosophy/system to build around
it's like...yeah Les isn't going to win a title and we're losing 2-3 games because of his system, but we aren't going to go 5-7. under O we have 5-7 potential relatively easy
It doesn't take a novel. This thread has lasted way to long. The differences could be seen early and often. Don't over-analyze. Period.
1
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:24 am to LSUbase13
Miles was OC at OSU before he was HC. Why anyone would ever hire Miles to be an OC is beyond me, but he was in fact an offensive coordinator.
The similarities are striking though.
The similarities are striking though.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:24 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
i think talent and sub-standard coaching hires (Crowton, Stud) derailed it and when we didn't have initial success, Miles panicked a bit
Thing is, Miles always had this underlying mindset/philosophy to revert back to at such times. Doesn't seem like O does. I think that's probably a positive. At the very least it's something different about the two.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:25 am to TheHeisenberg
quote:
The differences could be seen early and often. Don't over-analyze. Period.
"don't think. it hurts. yaw yaw"
-Orgeron
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:27 am to Y.A. Tittle
quote:
Miles always had this underlying mindset/philosophy to revert back to at such times. Doesn't seem like O does. I think that's probably a positive
i don't
i'm not saying i liked Miles's philosophy (10+ years of data on that)
but how many HCs win national titles without a program philosophy?
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:28 am to LSUbase13
quote:
It's the exact same hire.
No.
O will let Aranda run the defense he wants. His OC will run the offense. That was the issue with Miles. He had too much input on the offense.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:30 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
but how many HCs win national titles without a program philosophy?
A single-minded offensive philosophy (that you garnered from your self-declared mentor in the early 70s Big 10) is not a "program philosophy." (Miles had one of those too, but that's not what I'm talking about here).
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:31 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
"don't think. it hurts. yaw yaw"
-Orgeron
What does that even mean? Long novel........ then nonsense.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:33 am to stho381
quote:
His OC will run the offense
and what happens when the OC runs into turbulance?
O is admitting that he is not capable of being a real HC, so he's totally deferring to coordinators (even in terms of salary. that was literally his selling point to the AD about reshaping our program). how does he handle a coordinator who is given full autonomy who isn't performing, or doing something irrational/bad?
let's assume it's Kiffin. you think Lane Kiffin, a much more qualified HC candidate and a vastly superior coach/thinker to O, is going to listen to what O has to say? when he's being sold on getting near-HC money and autonomy? oh yeah and Kiffin was also O's boss at TWO different spots and was higher on the pecking order than O at another
so what happens when Kiffin does one of those Kiffin games where Saban has to reel him in. you think O is going to capable mentally or via authority to do that?
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:33 am to LSUbase13
O could BP 400. Les, Probably not.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:34 am to LSUbase13
quote:
Both are dependent upon great coordinators. I think O can do as well as Miles...not better.
It's the exact same hire.
Really??? I haven't read through this thread yet so I'm sure it's been addressed, but I have to say that this post just oozes pure ignorance. Did you observe our offensive approach at all after that dolt Miles was finally shitcanned? If you did then you really are not a very astute fan.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:36 am to Y.A. Tittle
quote:
A single-minded offensive philosophy (that you garnered from your self-declared mentor in the early 70s Big 10) is not a "program philosophy." (Miles had one of those too, but that's not what I'm talking about here).
but Miles failed and we knew he failed b/c his philosophy was faulty
even Dabo has a ton of input on offense and has maintained that Clemson will run the Chad Morris offense. and they're probably going to take a slide back when Watson leaves this year.
Urban, Saban, Harbaugh, etc all have philosophies and everything flows from that philosophy. they just have really good ones. you need both...you need that program philosophy/scheme AND it has to be adaptable, innovative, and efficient. who has won without one?
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:55 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
and what happens when the OC runs into turbulance?
The same thing that would happen if Bama's OC ran into turbulence. Nick Saban isn't going to run the offense.
quote:
how does he handle a coordinator who is given full autonomy who isn't performing, or doing something irrational/bad?
The same way Saban would handle an OC that wasn't getting it done. The same way Urban Meyer would handle a DC who isn't getting it done. This idea that HC's can run all facets of the program just as well as their coordinators is wrong. Coaches specialize on defense or offense. Whichever side you don't specialize on is the one you will rely on a coordinator to handle.
quote:
let's assume it's Kiffin. you think Lane Kiffin, a much more qualified HC candidate and a vastly superior coach/thinker to O, is going to listen to what O has to say? when he's being sold on getting near-HC money and autonomy? oh yeah and Kiffin was also O's boss at TWO different spots and was higher on the pecking order than O at another
I would disagree on Kiffin being more qualified. He's failed at 3 stops now between the NFL and CFB. Kiffin was O's boss and got fired, so that isn't the case anymore.
quote:
so what happens when Kiffin does one of those Kiffin games where Saban has to reel him in. you think O is going to capable mentally or via authority to do that?
I'm not sure and neither are you. You are speculating about how you think Coach O is going to run the program and then trying to belittle those that don't share your doom and gloom prediction of his coaching tenure. How about you let the guy at least get a couple games under his belt before crapping on him as a head coach.
At the end of the day, it makes no difference who the coach of LSU is as long as we win. I am just willing to give the guy a chance to succeed before I start bashing away with the rest of you.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 11:59 am to LSUbase13
quote:
It's the exact same hire.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 12:00 pm to tigahslawyer
What a way to throw a legendary coach under the bus
Posted on 11/27/16 at 12:01 pm to LSUbase13
Well you're dumb then..
Posted on 11/27/16 at 12:02 pm to stho381
quote:
Nick Saban isn't going to run the offense.
Nick Saban has given Kiffin a lot of leeway but he has the final say
LINK
quote:
When Saban was asked after the game what the "argument" was about, he disputed the way the question was worded.
"There are no arguments," he said. "Those are called arse-chewings."
Saban also has input on the offensive side of the ball. his OCs structure the offense around that
quote:
The same way Saban would handle an OC that wasn't getting it done. The same way Urban Meyer would handle a DC who isn't getting it done.
O has ceded that level of power/control and has no philosophy/scheme for the OC to fall into. it's the coordinator's offense/defense and O has ceded authority and has no input
Urban and Saban have philosophies and their coordinators fall into that. the HC also has the final say
Posted on 11/27/16 at 12:02 pm to LSUbase13
He's light years ahead in clock management.
His coordinators get plays in on time.
He spends more time studying film with players.
I don't see the same coach at all.
His coordinators get plays in on time.
He spends more time studying film with players.
I don't see the same coach at all.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 12:03 pm to LSUbase13
quote:
It's the exact same hire.
To be fair, I don't think this is accurate.
Miles clearly had become an albatross around the necks of his coordinators. At least to this point, it appears O doesn't have that problem.
Posted on 11/27/16 at 12:07 pm to LSUbase13
O will play the CEO role that doesn't try to pretend he can be CFO, CIO, COO etc
Miles didn't do that
Also firing all of Miles' buddies so far who were a detriment to the team
And the players seem to respond to him in a big way
That's all I got right now though
Miles didn't do that
Also firing all of Miles' buddies so far who were a detriment to the team
And the players seem to respond to him in a big way
That's all I got right now though
This post was edited on 11/27/16 at 12:51 pm
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