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this criticism of chavis is absolutely absurd (long)
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:24 am
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:24 am
the stupidity on the rant has reached astronomical levels since the ole miss loss.
I would just love for someone to cite one defense in the history of college football who lost 7 starters, six of them juniors, to the nfl, the next season had two true freshman starting at cb/nickel, and fielded a defense anywhere near the top 50, much less 25th in the fricking nation.
When you have fricking 18 year old kids as your cover corners, and your only other cover corner with experience (mills) has a tendency to get burned deep, AND your front four consistently fails to get pressure on their own, the only real option is to play zone. Why the frick do you think HS defenses run 90% zone defenses? They're easy for the kids to understand and execute and prevent big plays.
When we had the best secondary in cfb you didnt hear a goddamn word about "third and chavis" because with those athletes, combined with experience, you can run bump and run, combo zones, zone blitzes, whatever. Try incorporating those schemes into a secondary with kids barely old enough to buy a fricking pack of cigarettes, you are virtually guaranteed a couple blown assignments and busted coverage per game, and against a team with any decent qb, those are gonna be six every time.
And as for the argument that he only fielded top defenses because he relied on talent? Please refer to the University of Texas defense under Many Diaz. UT had and still has just as many high nfl draft picks on defense, a front seven loaded with 5 star recruits, and fielded the worst defense in UT history last season. they were 90th in the country in rush defense for christ sake. Talent alone can not, has not, and will never make a great defense. Just look at TCU. They field one of the best defenses in the country with half the talent.
Coaches have to scheme for teams based on their players strengths and weaknesses. If we had been blitzing more frequently and leaving our dbs on an island, the second one of them gets burned the rants response would be "omg jalen mills sucks put in some other player i know nothing about, chavis is so overrated"
I'm it's just ridiculous. The guy is easily a top 5 DC, has a stellar record over like 15+ seasons in the SEC, is fielding a defense with multiple 18-19 olds starting, then defense has semed to improve as the seasons gone on, but we lose one game to a team that always plays us tough, and half the fanbase wants him fired.
over the past ten years, the LSU fanbase has turned from one of the most die hard, passionate, optimistic fanbases in the country to the most cynical, spoiled, half assed group of people, and i'm downright embarrassed how fast these "fans" turned on both some of their players and coaches after one fricking game. I mean miles has a laundry thing of things to give him flak about, but to even consider tat john chavis should be fired...just unreal.
I would just love for someone to cite one defense in the history of college football who lost 7 starters, six of them juniors, to the nfl, the next season had two true freshman starting at cb/nickel, and fielded a defense anywhere near the top 50, much less 25th in the fricking nation.
When you have fricking 18 year old kids as your cover corners, and your only other cover corner with experience (mills) has a tendency to get burned deep, AND your front four consistently fails to get pressure on their own, the only real option is to play zone. Why the frick do you think HS defenses run 90% zone defenses? They're easy for the kids to understand and execute and prevent big plays.
When we had the best secondary in cfb you didnt hear a goddamn word about "third and chavis" because with those athletes, combined with experience, you can run bump and run, combo zones, zone blitzes, whatever. Try incorporating those schemes into a secondary with kids barely old enough to buy a fricking pack of cigarettes, you are virtually guaranteed a couple blown assignments and busted coverage per game, and against a team with any decent qb, those are gonna be six every time.
And as for the argument that he only fielded top defenses because he relied on talent? Please refer to the University of Texas defense under Many Diaz. UT had and still has just as many high nfl draft picks on defense, a front seven loaded with 5 star recruits, and fielded the worst defense in UT history last season. they were 90th in the country in rush defense for christ sake. Talent alone can not, has not, and will never make a great defense. Just look at TCU. They field one of the best defenses in the country with half the talent.
Coaches have to scheme for teams based on their players strengths and weaknesses. If we had been blitzing more frequently and leaving our dbs on an island, the second one of them gets burned the rants response would be "omg jalen mills sucks put in some other player i know nothing about, chavis is so overrated"
I'm it's just ridiculous. The guy is easily a top 5 DC, has a stellar record over like 15+ seasons in the SEC, is fielding a defense with multiple 18-19 olds starting, then defense has semed to improve as the seasons gone on, but we lose one game to a team that always plays us tough, and half the fanbase wants him fired.
over the past ten years, the LSU fanbase has turned from one of the most die hard, passionate, optimistic fanbases in the country to the most cynical, spoiled, half assed group of people, and i'm downright embarrassed how fast these "fans" turned on both some of their players and coaches after one fricking game. I mean miles has a laundry thing of things to give him flak about, but to even consider tat john chavis should be fired...just unreal.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:29 am to el duderino III
quote:
over the past ten years, the LSU fanbase has turned from one of the most die hard, passionate, optimistic fanbases in the country to the most cynical, spoiled, half assed group of people
You nailed it here. So much bitching, pissing, and moaning it's unbelievable.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:30 am to el duderino III
3rd and chavis is real. It was real when we were loaded with NFL ready defenders, and it's real now. There is a lot of talent on that D. No reason we can't get pressure on small school qbs, especially when Ole Miss 2nd string D got pressure on our qb.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:31 am to el duderino III
What's hilarious is that, before the season even started, many posters expected that our defense would be young and in rebuilding mode. That we would get 2-4 losses. Well, here we are and the team seems to be MEETING expectations yet the Rantards still want to crucify everyone. They are just a bunch of entitled crybabies.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:36 am to el duderino III
It's a game. That's it. Entertainment if you will. When my entertainment is no longer entertaining or is downright frustrating, I move on to something else.
People need to look in the mirror and evaluate what is important in life. I will tell you what's not important. A football game. A bunch of young college students fighting over a ball. College students which for the most part, wouldn't even be allowed in the university. Only because they run fast, jump high or throw a ball a long way are they enrolled at LSU.
You seem to be wound a little tight. Maybe you should put your "fanhood" in check. Look in the mirror and pump the brakes.
People need to look in the mirror and evaluate what is important in life. I will tell you what's not important. A football game. A bunch of young college students fighting over a ball. College students which for the most part, wouldn't even be allowed in the university. Only because they run fast, jump high or throw a ball a long way are they enrolled at LSU.
You seem to be wound a little tight. Maybe you should put your "fanhood" in check. Look in the mirror and pump the brakes.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:38 am to el duderino III
I still can't believe how fast everyone turned on Chavis.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:45 am to el duderino III
quote:
would just love for someone to cite one defense in the history of college football who lost 7 starters, six of them juniors, to the nfl, the next season had two true freshman starting at cb/nickel, and fielded a defense anywhere near the top 50, much less 25th in the fricking nation.
It ,of course ,goes back to all the jrs going pro, nobody but LSU could have as good of a season as they are having losing that many Srs to be and still be a high ranked team.
+1
As far as the whole coaching staff goes, it was a game of 2 halves. Changes were made at halftime, the Tigers came out and wore down the Palidens,as they should in that situation. And came out and put up some good stats in the second half. If you would have just listened to the second half you would have been very pleased. I know im playing Capt. obvious here, but so be it. They started the game fired up , LSU did not. As far as the Ole Miss game goes , they make their season on the LSU game ,their offense was not dinged up that bad, and look what they did to A&M.
This post was edited on 10/28/13 at 8:48 am
Posted on 10/28/13 at 8:48 am to el duderino III
i dont think anyone wants chavis fired. hell, other than dj mccarthy (who HAD to go) has miles actually fired a coach ever?
there are problems across the board with the defense, scheme and personnell wise. chavis has been running his stuff for over 20 years so its not like offensive coordinators are losing sleep at night trying to figure out ways to exploit it. i'd like to see him mix it up but therein lies the problem with personnell, some of them just aren't very good.
and if jalen collins can get benched why cant welter?
there are problems across the board with the defense, scheme and personnell wise. chavis has been running his stuff for over 20 years so its not like offensive coordinators are losing sleep at night trying to figure out ways to exploit it. i'd like to see him mix it up but therein lies the problem with personnell, some of them just aren't very good.
and if jalen collins can get benched why cant welter?
Posted on 10/28/13 at 9:33 am to el duderino III
The defense has done nothing
But regress since 2011. If your players get beat because of sub par talent that's one thing. To see them lose because they can't tackle, can't understand where to line up, play the wrong coverages and show ZERO improvement over the course of the season is on Chavis.
But regress since 2011. If your players get beat because of sub par talent that's one thing. To see them lose because they can't tackle, can't understand where to line up, play the wrong coverages and show ZERO improvement over the course of the season is on Chavis.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 9:44 am to el duderino III
I agree, (did not read all of it, tl;dr) but if we are going to have that philosophy, then we need to put up 40 points on everyone to win. We didn't do that against OM and we didn't under Florida (but should have).
Les philosophy of playing keep the ball and score less does not compute with Chavis philosophy of prevent/zone defense because we have youth.
That's where the problem lies, you have a defensive strategy that does not work well with the offensive strategy.
Les philosophy of playing keep the ball and score less does not compute with Chavis philosophy of prevent/zone defense because we have youth.
That's where the problem lies, you have a defensive strategy that does not work well with the offensive strategy.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 9:44 am to el duderino III
quote:Best thing I have read on the rant in years. Sadly, it's true.
over the past ten years, the LSU fanbase has turned from one of the most die hard, passionate, optimistic fanbases in the country to the most cynical, spoiled, half assed group of people, and i'm downright embarrassed how fast these "fans" turned on both some of their players and coaches
Posted on 10/28/13 at 9:51 am to el duderino III
LSU can't Close...either on Offense with 1st Downs or Defense when the clock is Running Out...Single biggest Weakness in the Past 2 Plus Years.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 9:53 am to el duderino III
He deserves criticism for his end of game defense the last few years
Posted on 10/28/13 at 10:15 am to el duderino III
I'll be the first to say that the fire Chavis talk is bullshite. The guy is a great coach, we just don't have the experience. Our D is actually playing a lot better then it was against UGA and even the first half of MSU. We did collapse at the end of the Ole Miss game, but we are thin on D so it isn't a surprise for that to happen at the end like that. We will give Alabama a tough game.....don' t know if we win but we will fight. I think we beat A & M and Arky. Another 10 win season, which I think most of us would have taken after the NFL draft last year.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 10:17 am to el duderino III
Nick Saban and Average AJ studied (and exposed) our two minute defense last year and picked us apart to end the 2nd quarter and 4th quarter.
It didn't start (or end) in November 2012. We've been doing it for a while, these are just some games I remember teams passing all over us for quick TDs. Posted before but everyone said no, it's the offense that sucks and can't get a first so the D spends too much time on the field.
UNC 2010
bama 2010 - 1 minute TD drive
Ole Miss 2010
South Carolina 2012 - 1 minute TD drive
A&M 2012 - 1 minute TD drive
bama 2012 - two 1 minute TD drives, they won
Ole Miss 2012 - followed bama's gameplan
Clemson 2012 - followed bama's gameplan, they won
Georgia 2013 - ended each half with TDs, they won
Ole Miss 2013 - Mett was awful, but we couldn't stop em
Yes, 2012 had inexperienced corners. I do not know the game of football like players or coaches, but I know Chief should've sent Nick a Little Debbie for letting him know what needs to be changed....then made that change. But unfortunately, he has not made a change.
It's about hunger and complacency. Chief plays the odds. The hungry coaches love the opportunity to play those odds. First year SEC coach Malzahn isn't going to say "game over" when he is down 21-0 on the road in the first half. 2nd year SEC coach Freeze didn't say "they are too talented, healthy, and well coached with an NFL quarterback so let's go at it how we normally would." Not everyone is John L. Les is acting like this is the 2011 team which it is not.
It didn't start (or end) in November 2012. We've been doing it for a while, these are just some games I remember teams passing all over us for quick TDs. Posted before but everyone said no, it's the offense that sucks and can't get a first so the D spends too much time on the field.
UNC 2010
bama 2010 - 1 minute TD drive
Ole Miss 2010
South Carolina 2012 - 1 minute TD drive
A&M 2012 - 1 minute TD drive
bama 2012 - two 1 minute TD drives, they won
Ole Miss 2012 - followed bama's gameplan
Clemson 2012 - followed bama's gameplan, they won
Georgia 2013 - ended each half with TDs, they won
Ole Miss 2013 - Mett was awful, but we couldn't stop em
Yes, 2012 had inexperienced corners. I do not know the game of football like players or coaches, but I know Chief should've sent Nick a Little Debbie for letting him know what needs to be changed....then made that change. But unfortunately, he has not made a change.
It's about hunger and complacency. Chief plays the odds. The hungry coaches love the opportunity to play those odds. First year SEC coach Malzahn isn't going to say "game over" when he is down 21-0 on the road in the first half. 2nd year SEC coach Freeze didn't say "they are too talented, healthy, and well coached with an NFL quarterback so let's go at it how we normally would." Not everyone is John L. Les is acting like this is the 2011 team which it is not.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 10:18 am to el duderino III
your post is entirely too long to read, but he deserves criticism for the soft zone he plays in 3rd and long situations and at the end of each half
Posted on 10/28/13 at 10:28 am to el duderino III
FWIW, the losses to Georgia this year and the losses to Alabama and Clemson last year were all on the defense.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 10:50 am to el duderino III
quote:
I would just love for someone to cite one defense in the history of college football who lost 7 starters, six of them juniors, to the nfl, the next season had two true freshman starting at cb/nickel, and fielded a defense anywhere near the top 50, much less 25th in the fricking nation.
I agree with this.
My concern is that the pass defense began sucking last season when we had all those guys you mention and it's still sucking going by the Old Miss game.
To me, that shows a deeper problem than simply players leaving.
Posted on 10/28/13 at 10:51 am to el duderino III
So our DB play regressing last year was because those guys had too much experience?
Our LB play without Minter last year was horrific, again because of lack of experience?
Our DL last year underperformed, yet still was 1,000,000 times better than this year.
Fact is Chavis is only as good as his talent and assistant coaches, much like Miles. His scheme is uncreative and has been figured out.
Saban's defenses haven't even taken this much of a step back and have had as much departures in a single season if not more. Hell, Ole Miss was down to 4 or 5 starters on defense and their 4th and 5th DEs and even down to their 5th and 6th by the end of the LSU game and still seemed to have little issue getting pressure.
Dude is what he is. He's not as good as some of you would like to believe, simply put. His LBer coaching is extremely overrated, and always has been.
Does that mean he sucks? No. It just means he's past his prime and is on his way down and in a hurry because he simply can't out scheme opponents anymore. In fact, he's so easy to out scheme in 2-minute drills, I am trying to remember the last time in a 10 point or less game his teams have gotten a stop without giving up a quick TD to make games a lot closer than they needed to be.
Our LB play without Minter last year was horrific, again because of lack of experience?
Our DL last year underperformed, yet still was 1,000,000 times better than this year.
Fact is Chavis is only as good as his talent and assistant coaches, much like Miles. His scheme is uncreative and has been figured out.
Saban's defenses haven't even taken this much of a step back and have had as much departures in a single season if not more. Hell, Ole Miss was down to 4 or 5 starters on defense and their 4th and 5th DEs and even down to their 5th and 6th by the end of the LSU game and still seemed to have little issue getting pressure.
Dude is what he is. He's not as good as some of you would like to believe, simply put. His LBer coaching is extremely overrated, and always has been.
Does that mean he sucks? No. It just means he's past his prime and is on his way down and in a hurry because he simply can't out scheme opponents anymore. In fact, he's so easy to out scheme in 2-minute drills, I am trying to remember the last time in a 10 point or less game his teams have gotten a stop without giving up a quick TD to make games a lot closer than they needed to be.
This post was edited on 10/28/13 at 12:05 pm
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