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Operation Meetinghouse - The Most Destructive Bombing Raid in History

Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:17 pm
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
69888 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:17 pm
The YouTube channel The Operations Room has released a new video on the firebombing of Tokyo which took place during the night of March 9-10, 1945. An estimated 100,000 Japanese civilians were killed in the ensuing firestorm, more than either the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs when taken individually.

Posted by redstick13
Lower Saxony
Member since Feb 2007
40483 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:20 pm to
quote:

The Operations Room


Love all their videos.
Posted by geauxtigers87
Louisiana
Member since Mar 2011
26996 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:23 pm to
i think it's in one of Toll's books when he talks about this attack and tells the story of a japanese family that survived on the roof of a school. dad spent the night taking one kid out of water cistern and putting another one in. before the water was steam on the kids as they went back in. everyone who was inside the school, including those who had jumped in the pool were cooked alive. the water boiled off in the pool it was so hot.
Posted by wileyjones
Member since May 2014
2700 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:43 pm to
quote:

100,000 Japanese civilians were killed
war is hell.. but man that's a lot of innocents killed
Posted by sledgehammer
SWLA
Member since Oct 2020
6803 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:47 pm to
Thanks for sharing.
Posted by Strannix
C.S.A.
Member since Dec 2012
52962 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:50 pm to
quote:

war is hell.. but man that's a lot of innocents killed


Sad, many dont realize the atomic bombs SAVED hundreds of thousands of American lives and millions of Japanese lives.
Posted by geauxtigers87
Louisiana
Member since Mar 2011
26996 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:51 pm to
quote:

war is hell.. but man that's a lot of innocents killed


There's an argument to be made the fire bombing of Japanese cities was worse than the atomic bombs imo.

Bombs ended the war, but we crossed whatever line was left to cross with the fire bombing
Posted by wileyjones
Member since May 2014
2700 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 4:58 pm to
quote:

many dont realize the atomic bombs SAVED hundreds of thousands of American lives and millions of Japanese lives.
likewise, many don't realize the Japanese had approached the soviets offering to surrender before the atom bombs were dropped.

no reason for Americans to invade the mainland either; they were out of oil, fuel and food. your quote is revisionist history imo, justifying the mass murder of civilians and showboating to the soviets.
Posted by notiger1997
Metairie
Member since May 2009
61367 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 5:01 pm to
quote:

wileyjones

Maria’s a cute story, but Japan would have fought with everything they had for many more months if we hadn’t dropped the bombs.
Posted by Mo Jeaux
Member since Aug 2008
62568 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 5:01 pm to
quote:

Sad, many dont realize the atomic bombs SAVED hundreds of thousands of American lives and millions of Japanese lives.


That’s the story that we tell at least.
Posted by sledgehammer
SWLA
Member since Oct 2020
6803 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 5:13 pm to
These are the results of a Gallup poll conducted immediately after Little Boy and Fat Man and before the official surrender of Japan.
Posted by Trout Bandit
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Dec 2012
14877 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:08 pm to
quote:

100,000 Japanese civilians were killed in the ensuing firestorm

frick Em
Posted by Darth_Vader
A galaxy far, far away
Member since Dec 2011
72336 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:39 pm to
quote:

likewise, many don't realize the Japanese had approached the soviets offering to surrender before the atom bombs were dropped.


Their terms were a nonstarter, for one, no American occupation, they’d hold their own war crimes trials, no disarmament, etc.

quote:

no reason for Americans to invade the mainland either; they were out of oil, fuel and food.


You are making the mistake of looking at this matter with the benefit of hindsight. You have to consider things that were known at the time, not later. In the summer of 1945, US intelligence estimates were the Japanese could hold out for anywhere from 3 months to perhaps as much as a year from a food standpoint. As for fuel, that was not as much of a factor as you think because the nature of how Japanese forces fought defensive battles, which by mid1945 they’d been doing for over a year. Namely, they fought from hardened fixed positions that were pre-provisioned. Thy were expected not to hold out indefinitely, only until their provisions ran out, simply put. Japan wasn’t going to resupply them anyway, thus their need for fuel was not what you think it was. Japan was making preparations to go down in history’s biggest blaze of glory, going so far as to arm a train school children to fight with bamboo spears. They knew they could not win, but they didn’t care. They were going to fight to the bitter end.


There were three options available to the US and its allies in late summer 1945 to end the war:

1. Invade, resulting in over a million American casualties plus multiple times that Japanese. This option was estimated to take at least 3-6 months to end the war, possibly more.

2. Blockade, resulting in few American casualties, but millions of dead Japanese from disease and starvation. This option was estimated to take 6 months to a year to end the war.

3. Drop the bomb, resulting in perhaps about a dozen or so American casualties at most and around 100K Japanese. This option was estimated to take days to end the war.

Everyone focuses now on the casualty estimate of each option. But what they fail to take into consideration is the time aspect of each option. This is a mistake.

For starters, it wasn’t just Japanese and Americans dying as a result of the war. Every day across Asia, thousands of innocent civilians were dying as well in Japanese occupied areas. I’m talking about places like Vietnam, Cambodia, Java, Formosa, Korea, and huge swaths of China. It’s estimated the monthly death toll in these areas was in the tens of thousands from disease and starvation. The most humane thing for America to do was to end the war as quickly as possible.

That’s what the bomb did, it ended the war far quicker than either invasion or blockade. And it killed far fewer people than either of the other two options would have.

quote:

your quote is revisionist history imo, justifying the mass murder of civilians and showboating to the soviets.



The only revisionist history being pushed here is being done so by you. If you look at the situation in 1945, both on the American and Japanese side, it’s quite clear the best (and most humane) option to end the war available to Truman was to drop the bomb.
Posted by Riverside
Member since Jul 2022
8533 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:43 pm to
quote:

no reason for Americans to invade the mainland either; they were out of oil, fuel and food. your quote is revisionist history imo, justifying the mass murder of civilians and showboating to the soviets.


Hey President Obama. How’s Big Mike doing?
Posted by Ghost of Colby
Alberta, overlooking B.C.
Member since Jan 2009
15161 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:47 pm to
quote:

war is hell.. but man that's a lot of innocents killed

The older I get, the more I question and criticize the fire bombing of cities like Dresden and Tokyo.

Maybe I’m getting old and weak, but maybe I’m getting wiser. I don’t know.
Posted by UKWildcats
Lexington, KY
Member since Mar 2015
18852 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:48 pm to
quote:

wileyjones
You're either really young, really stupid, or both.
Posted by Riverside
Member since Jul 2022
8533 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:50 pm to
quote:

Maybe I’m getting old and weak, but maybe I’m getting wiser. I don’t know.


Or maybe you’ve forgotten who started the Second World War and the mass atrocities both Germany and Japan committed against mankind.
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
69888 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 6:54 pm to
quote:

likewise, many don't realize the Japanese had approached the soviets offering to surrender before the atom bombs were dropped.



That's because they didn't.

They approached the Soviets with the hope that they could help mediate an end to the war but never once did they offer unconditional surrender (a prerequisite to any negotiation), nor did they formally ask to surrender. Instead they wanted the Soviets to present the Allies with a list of better terms such as keeping their emperor, no occupation/limited occupation of the home islands, the right for Japan to disarm itself, and the right for Japan to oversee war crime tribunals.

It also must be noted that the Soviets deliberately stalled these talks with the Japanese because they already intended to enter the war on the side of the Allies in August and never communicated that the Japanese were seriously considering peace.
Posted by choppadocta
Louisiana
Member since May 2014
2421 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 7:12 pm to
A lot of people don't realize that by that time most of Japan's heavy industry had been destroyed, so they had moved to a cottage industry, lots of people with machine tools, drill presses, sheet metal tools and stuff etc.Inside their houses prodoucing war armaments.
Posted by Trevaylin
south texas
Member since Feb 2019
9740 posts
Posted on 12/30/25 at 7:18 pm to



We lived in Yokohama in 1983, and the house came with an older maid to cook and clean. She told stories of the fire bombing and how fast the flames spread through the wood houses. She described nights of spending the time in canals in the neighborhood for protection. They were scared
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