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Started By
Message
Elon and Vivek are right to point out the cultural factors in the visa issue
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:45 pm
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:45 pm
I currently live in the smallest city I’ve lived in since College Station in the 80’s. (About 90K, and 2+ hours from a semi-major metropolis).
I’m from a small town in East Texas (~10K).
I just sold my company that had its main location in a town of about 10K, over 3.5 hours from where I live. Other locations also in small towns.
Most of my career before buying the company was in oil and gas in Houston, Singapore, and South Florida.
My company had a high demand for skilled trades in diesel engines, hydraulics, welding, and controls.
Almost impossible to find anybody with those skills in these towns, so we knew we had to invest years in training and developing noobs and hope to keep them.
It was depressing AF to put job postings out there and get almost nothing but laborers and restaurant staff, and most of these being 30+ years old. I mean, I get that there is a built in challenge to find the people we are looking for, but it just boggles my mind how many people reach full adulthood and have invested NOTHING in themselves to develop marketable skills. (Our most reliable demographic was young farmer kids.)
The town I live in now is “bigger” but is so overrun with tourism and unions that it’s not much better.
And don’t even get me started on the Hillbilly Elegy drug and family issues in these towns.
My point: We rightly call out the cultural issues that are holding back inner city minorities, but we turn a defiant blind eye to the same things going on with rural whites.
I’m from a small town in East Texas (~10K).
I just sold my company that had its main location in a town of about 10K, over 3.5 hours from where I live. Other locations also in small towns.
Most of my career before buying the company was in oil and gas in Houston, Singapore, and South Florida.
My company had a high demand for skilled trades in diesel engines, hydraulics, welding, and controls.
Almost impossible to find anybody with those skills in these towns, so we knew we had to invest years in training and developing noobs and hope to keep them.
It was depressing AF to put job postings out there and get almost nothing but laborers and restaurant staff, and most of these being 30+ years old. I mean, I get that there is a built in challenge to find the people we are looking for, but it just boggles my mind how many people reach full adulthood and have invested NOTHING in themselves to develop marketable skills. (Our most reliable demographic was young farmer kids.)
The town I live in now is “bigger” but is so overrun with tourism and unions that it’s not much better.
And don’t even get me started on the Hillbilly Elegy drug and family issues in these towns.
My point: We rightly call out the cultural issues that are holding back inner city minorities, but we turn a defiant blind eye to the same things going on with rural whites.
This post was edited on 12/29/24 at 1:50 pm
23
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:49 pm to Ag Zwin
I am a minority and this is the stupidest shite I have heard yet. This has nothing to do with prejudice.
Sure there are idiots saying “Whites are getting screwed”. So are “Browns” that are Americans and highly trained/educated.
This transcends race and is not based on that.
Your boy Vivek is the one explicitly trying to increase limits to one country from which his family originated. That is the racist part because Europeans, Arabs, Africans, Chinese, Japanese and other East Asians have caps too. Why is he not calling for them to be lifted?
Answer is Vivek is a POS racist that has no business in this administration and is a perfect example of a horrible human being getting rich off the suffering of others.
Sure there are idiots saying “Whites are getting screwed”. So are “Browns” that are Americans and highly trained/educated.
This transcends race and is not based on that.
Your boy Vivek is the one explicitly trying to increase limits to one country from which his family originated. That is the racist part because Europeans, Arabs, Africans, Chinese, Japanese and other East Asians have caps too. Why is he not calling for them to be lifted?
Answer is Vivek is a POS racist that has no business in this administration and is a perfect example of a horrible human being getting rich off the suffering of others.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:50 pm to Geauxgurt
quote:
I am a minority and this is the stupidest shite I have heard yet. This has nothing to do with prejudice.
Where did I say anything like that?
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:51 pm to Ag Zwin
quote:
My point: We rightly call out the cultural issues that are holding back inner city minorities, but we turn a defiant blind eye to the same things going on with rural whites.
Culture is downstream of genetics, and there are sharp limits on what you can expect from immigrants who come from less intelligent populations, like India. They also bring all of their vices with them, like lying and fraud.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:51 pm to Ag Zwin
You’re exactly right.
Prepare for some upset people.
Prepare for some upset people.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:52 pm to Ag Zwin
It’s all saved by the bell, family matters and boy meets world’s fault.
Let’s not even focus on today’s culture. Nope, it was those pesky sitcoms. Seinfeld? Disaster! The simpsons? You’re a moron! Friends? Read a book you numbskull. What tv shows do they watch in India? Must be all math and science shows, right?
Let’s not even focus on today’s culture. Nope, it was those pesky sitcoms. Seinfeld? Disaster! The simpsons? You’re a moron! Friends? Read a book you numbskull. What tv shows do they watch in India? Must be all math and science shows, right?
This post was edited on 12/29/24 at 1:55 pm
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:53 pm to Geauxgurt
quote:
I am a minority
Cool. Can you read?
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:54 pm to Richleau
quote:
You’re retarded.
Well reasoned and articulated with compelling counterarguments.
Would read again.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 1:54 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Culture is downstream of genetics, and there are sharp limits on what you can expect from immigrants who come from less intelligent populations, like India. They also bring all of their vices with them, like lying and fraud.
This sounds like Critical Race Theory.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:01 pm to Ag Zwin
Are the hiring issues the reason why you sold the company? Or was it just time to sell based on other factors like retirement?
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:02 pm to LuckyTiger
quote:
This sounds like Critical Race Theory.
CRT says that people are held back, which isn’t true. In the aggregate it’s just genetics.
What we built is not universal and not transferrable.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:09 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
In the aggregate it’s just genetics.
Still moronic... But I guess you can blame your genetics for thinking that pile of crap.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:12 pm to NineLineBind
quote:
Are the hiring issues the reason why you sold the company? Or was it just time to sell based on other factors like retirement?
Not THE issue, but was part of the mix. Without getting into the weeds of it, it was a structurally challenged industry where the customers had an unusual mix of high product support complexity and low underlying economics to pay for them. Too many headwinds to make a thriving, cash flow positive business, and with really high capital needs. (Heavy equipment for logging, primarily.)
Time to move on to something with more upside.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:15 pm to Ag Zwin
I'm interested in your point but I'm curious how it relates to Vivek. I felt like Vivek was talking more about lazy white collar employees, and your issues seem focused on the lack of a prepared blue collar workforce.
And I'm right there with you, my parents live in a small town in North Louisiana and every time I drive there from Dallas I pass a a few dozen small towns, knowing most of the people born there are doomed to a mediocre existence. Job opportunities like the ones you had seem few and far between, and even when they do come up most people don't begin to have the skills to be able to take them on.
It probably also speaks to the false dream they're sold on going to college, getting a BS degree, getting hired right away at Globo Corp and moving up the ranks over the years while becoming wealthy. Seems like people are holding out for that and missing out on great careers directly in front of them.
And I'm right there with you, my parents live in a small town in North Louisiana and every time I drive there from Dallas I pass a a few dozen small towns, knowing most of the people born there are doomed to a mediocre existence. Job opportunities like the ones you had seem few and far between, and even when they do come up most people don't begin to have the skills to be able to take them on.
It probably also speaks to the false dream they're sold on going to college, getting a BS degree, getting hired right away at Globo Corp and moving up the ranks over the years while becoming wealthy. Seems like people are holding out for that and missing out on great careers directly in front of them.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:16 pm to Ag Zwin
quote:
My point: We rightly call out the cultural issues that are holding back inner city minorities, but we turn a defiant blind eye to the same things going on with rural whites.
And we attack college education for Americans while importing people from abroad solely because they are college educated.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:17 pm to Ag Zwin
Ive heard the same from many business owners, small and big .
its why business tend to locate their HQs in the same metro area where they can recruit the most people reside near good schools and economies.
the motivated smart kids in those poor areas leave as soon as possible because they realize there's no opportunities and less employees around compared to the cities. they get bigger buck for their buck somewhere else. its hard to educate good ones and even harder to keep them around.
I think the challenges for rural whites vs urban minorities is different though
its why business tend to locate their HQs in the same metro area where they can recruit the most people reside near good schools and economies.
the motivated smart kids in those poor areas leave as soon as possible because they realize there's no opportunities and less employees around compared to the cities. they get bigger buck for their buck somewhere else. its hard to educate good ones and even harder to keep them around.
I think the challenges for rural whites vs urban minorities is different though
This post was edited on 12/29/24 at 2:18 pm
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:20 pm to Ag Zwin
quote:
was depressing AF to put job postings out there and get almost nothing but laborers and restaurant staff, and most of these being 30+ years old. I mean, I get that there is a built in challenge to find the people we are looking for, but it just boggles my mind how many people reach full adulthood and have invested NOTHING in themselves to develop marketable skills.
Is this a failure in the population or a failure in our current education system and macro economic environment?
-companies use immigration to fill in for cheaper “entry level” which are the stepping stones for careers
-the cost of education and living is so expensive college graduates almost have to go straight into whatever jobs they can find to make money and grind to stay afloat…being a server or bartender can make you more money than entry level jobs these days. and then once you’re in that cycle it’s hard to break out as you need income coming in to pay bills and loans
-our education system isn’t training in skills needed, a huge mismatch. shouldn’t there be programs for the jobs you’re offering straight out of HS? or subsidize in demand jobs with loans and not ones that can’t.
it’s all related IMO, and it all comes down to government involvement in College, the Department of Education being useless and funneling kids to colleges with no skills, and the youngest generation getting hammered with inflation and need to stay afloat
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:26 pm to Thundercles
quote:
I'm interested in your point but I'm curious how it relates to Vivek. I felt like Vivek was talking more about lazy white collar employees, and your issues seem focused on the lack of a prepared blue collar workforce.
Solid post, and I get exactly what you are saying about the drive. When I made the weekly commute, it was depressing AF to drive through these dying towns.
As for the quote above, I guess I see it as two sides of the same coin. People who have too little grit and ambition, even if that’s a product of having a message drilled into them year after year.
It’s like when people the age of my boys (mid 20’s) piss and moan about how hard life is for them, and how easy it was for me. I remember having a BSME from A&M and and MBA from Texas, with my first job being overseas, with a wife who also had a masters in a health field, and we still scrimped and struggled. Never did we feel like it was “easy”.
Now, the complaints about this are being posted on $1,000 phones with $60 monthly bills, or on computers with $80 home internet (and multiple streaming subscriptions).
I am sympathetic to the fact that college has become a huge ripoff, and that needs to be fixed. At the same time, though, both my boys are free of college debt (one free ride through his first Masters, one that has stepped back until he knows he needs it), and both have more money in their accounts than I did at their age.
At the end of the day, I see this a HUGELY a factor of unrealistic expectations.
This post was edited on 12/29/24 at 2:29 pm
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:27 pm to TBoy
quote:
And we attack college education for Americans while importing people from abroad solely because they are college educated.
Those people are not coming here to study Lesbian Dance Theory.
Posted on 12/29/24 at 2:31 pm to Ag Zwin
You're right. And Vivek was mostly right.
Do you know why Indians are such a hot button issue with the people who are looking at race (lots of this board) in the H1B issue? Because H1B Indians are the single most successful ethnic group in America.
The reason that there are so many Indians coming is that, among certain ethnic groups IQs and educational attainment are extremely high. They are not convenience store and hotel owners. These are the people we recruit. They are also the only people out of 1.8 billion that Indian tech companies want. Despite the huge demand in India, those tach office environments (not support, lol) are often cutthroat.
he reason that these particular Indians apply so frequently is that WE DO NOT COMPETE. Ask them honestly, and the will be completely frank in telling you that most Americans simply do not have the will to put in the work to excel. They are paid infinitely better than in India and advancement is fricking easy for them. It's the same for the Koreans and Chinese parents who push their kids to success. Asian income in the US is double black income and nearly 130% of white income, and they have almost zero crime.
Americans are literally mocked for doing the same thing.
Do you know why Indians are such a hot button issue with the people who are looking at race (lots of this board) in the H1B issue? Because H1B Indians are the single most successful ethnic group in America.
The reason that there are so many Indians coming is that, among certain ethnic groups IQs and educational attainment are extremely high. They are not convenience store and hotel owners. These are the people we recruit. They are also the only people out of 1.8 billion that Indian tech companies want. Despite the huge demand in India, those tach office environments (not support, lol) are often cutthroat.
he reason that these particular Indians apply so frequently is that WE DO NOT COMPETE. Ask them honestly, and the will be completely frank in telling you that most Americans simply do not have the will to put in the work to excel. They are paid infinitely better than in India and advancement is fricking easy for them. It's the same for the Koreans and Chinese parents who push their kids to success. Asian income in the US is double black income and nearly 130% of white income, and they have almost zero crime.
Americans are literally mocked for doing the same thing.
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