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Message
re: Why Louisiana Stays Poor
Posted on 12/9/18 at 8:19 pm to PointsInCase
Posted on 12/9/18 at 8:19 pm to PointsInCase
quote:
Louisiana's problem is that it doesn't have enough money to support the basic needs of its population
Louisiana’s problem is that it has too many people reliant on it for their basic needs. Cf. Texas demographics.
WRT your claim that our education problems are a function of money, I completely disagree. Our education problems are a function of the culture. No number of hi-tech gadgets and software licenses can overcome culture.
Plenty of kids get a great education every year in Louisiana schools. The common denominator I would wager is stable family units and parents who actually parent their kids. Doesn’t matter if you’re writing on a smart board or a chalk board, 2+2 still equals 4.
Posted on 12/9/18 at 8:21 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
oh boy
"Based on data from more than 600,000 participants, all told, psychologists Stuart Ritchie and Elliot Tucker-Drob have arrived at a rough estimate of how much an added year of education lifted participants’ IQ scores, on average: between 1 and 5 points."
LINK
quote:
those demographic issues are exactly why LA is doomed and has little future
we have too many people with the lower class mentality. they have been used to give political power to people who only use them for the power. those politicains are kleptocrats who have pushed out businesses and corporations by trying to rob them blind.
we can't lure anything other than lower-level industries due to our uneducated and unskilled population. we have to "pay extra" for those even. i'm no fan of this crony capitalism from a purely ideological perspective, but everyone is doing it. if we stop, how will we recruit new businesses to LA?
Bad demographics may be tough to overcome, but if there's any solution, it's definitely better education. Also, when talking about "bad" demographics, it's not just the poor, urban dwellers that bring Louisiana down. Many middle-class (and even upper middle-class) predominantly white areas in Louisiana have below par schools. The majority of high paying jobs in the modern world will require advanced education and based on the current state of things, Louisiana will fall further behind.
It's fine to use tax credits to lure companies in, but they aren't going to stay if there's nothing else here for them. We need to find a balance, but I think a tilt toward education is the wiser choice.
This post was edited on 12/9/18 at 8:25 pm
Posted on 12/9/18 at 8:23 pm to WesternChauvinist
quote:But the reason the parents don't care about education is because they aren't educated themselves. It's a vicious cycle. Lack of education has greatly influenced Louisiana's culture. These are not disparate concepts that function inside a vacuum.
Plenty of kids get a great education every year in Louisiana schools. The common denominator I would wager is stable family units and parents who actually parent their kids. Doesn’t matter if you’re writing on a smart board or a chalk board, 2+2 still equals 4.
Posted on 12/9/18 at 8:35 pm to PointsInCase
quote:
But the reason the parents don't care about education is because they aren't educated themselves.
Disagree wholeheartedly. Neither of my parents advanced beyond a high school education. I have a terminal degree in my field. I didn’t get there without their sacrifice and determination that I not be limited in life as they believed themselves to be. I would have chosen to smoke dope, frick girls and play video games as a teenager if I didn’t have parents who were in my life making sure I went to school, did my homework and knew who I was involved with at every stage of my minority. One does it have to have an education to raise kids with pride and respect. One just has to do those things. The cultural zeitgeist today is to shun involved parenting by a mother and father.
Posted on 12/9/18 at 9:18 pm to PointsInCase
quote:
Bad demographics may be tough to overcome, but if there's any solution, it's definitely better education. Also, when talking about "bad" demographics, it's not just the poor, urban dwellers that bring Louisiana down. Many middle-class (and even upper middle-class) predominantly white areas in Louisiana have below par schools. The majority of high paying jobs in the modern world will require advanced education and based on the current state of things, Louisiana will fall further behind.
It's fine to use tax credits to lure companies in, but they aren't going to stay if there's nothing else here for them. We need to find a balance, but I think a tilt toward education is the wiser choice.
demographics by state.
Demographics have little overall to do with our problems. States of similar demographics still have strong business communities.
The biggest problem is simply the lack of industry outside of O & G. Quit treating LA likes it's a haven of white collar jobs.
This post was edited on 12/9/18 at 9:20 pm
Posted on 12/9/18 at 9:32 pm to PointsInCase
Tell me about the bubble you lived in when you grew up in New Orleans.
Posted on 12/9/18 at 9:49 pm to WesternChauvinist
quote:
I would have chosen to smoke dope, frick girls and play video games as a teenager if I didn’t have parents who were in my life making sure I went to school, did my homework and knew who I was involved with at every stage of my minority.
I chose to smoke weed and frick girls while having two involved parents...so far it has all worked out!
Posted on 12/9/18 at 10:00 pm to Kino74
quote:
Problem is with that is Louisiana spends more on education than many states.
State education expenditures per state
And all that spending is just wasted dollars.
California spends just as much as Louisiana and they're just as fricked.
Which is why there are a million private schools in California.
Families gave up on public eduction a long time ago. Nobody wants to send their kids to school where they have to walk through metal detectors and their son is doing Multiplication tables tests in Math at the 8th grade.
This post was edited on 12/9/18 at 10:02 pm
Posted on 12/9/18 at 10:28 pm to PointsInCase
quote:
It's due in large part to corporate welfare
So, NOT utterly corrupt local and state governments?
(Because, it's mostly utterly corrupt local and state governments.)
Posted on 12/9/18 at 11:27 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
(no message)
This post was edited on 10/15/20 at 8:31 am
Posted on 12/10/18 at 12:08 am to PointsInCase
quote:all 3 of these statements are debatable. there is no consensus on iq because there is no consensus on how to measure it. does the test measure native intelligence or developed skill(s)? no person has the ultimate authority in the matter. the pendulum swings one way or the other based on the cultural climate. for now, it is swinging towards the latter which means people are starting to say iq can change but the heart of the matter is testing; who gets to decide what the test is aimed at.
IQ is a combination of nature and nurture, but it definitely increases with education. It's a common myth that it doesn't.
quote:wrong. in this day and age, people can find free education. churches all over baton rouge are offering free skills classes, esl, tutoring, etc.
The stupidity is due to lack of education
quote:BINGO. as i have said multiple times, my wife has personally seen kids go home and have the culcha undo what the teachers are teaching because that knowledge is "wypipo."
a culture that does not embrace education, knowledge, and progress
there is nothing stopping scotlandville residents from banding together and improving their community. absolutely nothing. yet, they went all in with the heinously evil tbr to stop the st george initiative because heaven forbid they lose someone's else's revenue stream.
quote:this is all red herring. it's culture, not the education system. the education system is without a doubt good enough for students to improve their situation.
Lack of education begets more lack of education. Additional funding isn't going to solve everything overnight, but it's a start in the right direction. Better qualified and higher paid teachers, administrators, and higher ups (e.g. school board president) can do wonders for a school district. Whether it's more dollars per student or just educational reform in general, something will need to be done to fix Louisiana's education related woes.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 12:16 am to PointsInCase
quote:still wrong and this has been refuted several times in this thread now. there is no need to keep repeating it.
Bad demographics may be tough to overcome, but if there's any solution, it's definitely better education
quote:link?
Many middle-class (and even upper middle-class) predominantly white areas in Louisiana have below par schools.
quote:talk to the 3 zip codes in b.r. where 99% of violent crime happens.
they aren't going to stay if there's nothing else here for them
quote:"tilt towards?" what does that even mean? the schools and districts are having to deal with a no win scenario - anti education sentiment. no "tilt" is going to fix that. st george breaking off from b.r. would be the best thing to ever happen to north b.r. it would force them to sink or swim instead of continually living on life support.
I think a tilt toward education is the wiser choice.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 12:29 am to PointsInCase
quote:
Regardless of how you describe corporate welfare, Louisiana's problem is that it doesn't have enough money to support the basic needs of its population.
The state has plenty of money to cover the basic needs of the population.
quote:
Functional, low tax states, such as Texas, don't give freebies to corporations without expecting anything in return...
Industrial Property Tax Exemption only occurs when when state is getting something in return.
quote:
and these states realize how important education is to the modern American dream.
Texas deconsolidated school districts to better align with their communities. Louisiana Legislature said this can’t happen.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 2:54 am to PointsInCase
quote:bc those middle class kids aren't in those schools...
Many middle-class (and even upper middle-class) predominantly white areas in Louisiana have below par schools.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 7:21 am to chalmetteowl
Many of suburbs of Houston ISDs spend 2K less per student than EBR and get amazing results.
Many groups from Louisiana have come and checked out the TX school system.
Only 2.6% of the children in Houston, Dallas, San Antonio, and Austin attend private school.
In Baton Rouge and New Orleans it's over 26.4%.
Many groups from Louisiana have come and checked out the TX school system.
Only 2.6% of the children in Houston, Dallas, San Antonio, and Austin attend private school.
In Baton Rouge and New Orleans it's over 26.4%.
This post was edited on 12/10/18 at 9:26 am
Posted on 12/10/18 at 7:29 am to PointsInCase
quote:
Louisiana's problem is that it doesn't have enough money to support the basic needs of its population.
because too high of a % of our population is a drain
they offer very limited economic output and require massive wealth redistribution, taking away economic output of others
quote:
Louisiana's population is not educated enough to work in many high paying fields. Part of the reason Google and IBM (and many other companies in many other fields) don't set up shop in Louisiana is because we don't have enough human capital, due in large part to our awful public education system.
education systems are as good/bad as the students and parents of the children
quote:
Functional, low tax states, such as Texas, don't give freebies to corporations without expecting anything in return...and these states realize how important education is to the modern American dream.
Texas is ruled by ISDs to keep education local and funded by the parents of the children attending. have you seen how hard the major metro areas in LA fight this? just look at the current EBR/St George fight that's been going on for 5+ years
Posted on 12/10/18 at 7:47 am to PointsInCase
quote:
"Based on data from more than 600,000 participants, all told, psychologists Stuart Ritchie and Elliot Tucker-Drob have arrived at a rough estimate of how much an added year of education lifted participants’ IQ scores, on average: between 1 and 5 points."
IQ is lost by pathological use of your brain. the lower class mentality rewards this pathological behavior. no amount of education is going to fix it, and it ruins the lives of the poor kids who do have the IQs to do something with their lives
quote:
Bad demographics may be tough to overcome, but if there's any solution, it's definitely better education.
this is impossible due to the family/culture of poor areas as well as federal oversight of "disabled" children
assume we magically had new schools and great teachers. how are these students going to maintain that education when their parents can't help them with work? how are they going to develop when everyone around them will incentivize other behaviors other than homework and studying?
and our educational system has been built to protect bad behavior kids while distributing a disproportionate amount of funds to them. we push potential success stories aside and try to save lost causes (and i can't imagine the success rate is that high). this is largely influenced by federal issues but you see the "Savior" meme in statewide policy as well
these 2 issues in conjunction effectively destroy any education for the vast majority of poor kids in this state and there is nothing we can do to legislate our way out of it (from a statewide perspective). as the population scales tip more to their side, it decreases the resources and chances of non-poor.
quote:
Also, when talking about "bad" demographics, it's not just the poor, urban dwellers that bring Louisiana down. Many middle-class (and even upper middle-class) predominantly white areas in Louisiana have below par schools.
i did not bring up race or urban/rural split. the lower class mindset is everywhere in LA and across all races
quote:
The majority of high paying jobs in the modern world will require advanced education and based on the current state of things, Louisiana will fall further behind.
that's an issue of population, not policy
if we were given free reign away from federal oversight and PC/SJW laws, i could increase our education population. people would be very upset, though, after children are removed from their home/culture to get away from toxic parents and troublemakers with IEPs are sent to their own special schools (to allow the good kids a chance to better themselves and not be beholden to the bad kids)
quote:
It's fine to use tax credits to lure companies in, but they aren't going to stay if there's nothing else here for them
well we're targeting jobs that our population can do
Posted on 12/10/18 at 7:49 am to PointsInCase
quote:
But the reason the parents don't care about education is because they aren't educated themselves. It's a vicious cycle.
that governmental policy can't fix
how can you expect a kid to go home with questions about Trig or Calculus when his/her parents can't do basic algebra?
quote:
Lack of education has greatly influenced Louisiana's culture
no. our culture has rejected education for generations. that's why our educational rankings are so shitty. we are a state with a huge (and growing) population who reject education, so why do we expect anything other than shitty scores?
Posted on 12/10/18 at 8:02 am to PointsInCase
quote:
Louisiana's problem is that it doesn't have enough money to support the basic needs of its population
Louisiana has pleanty of money! Have you not been paying attention.
What it doesn’t have is good allocations of money. Louisiana is like an upper middle class person who is always complaining how broke it it and has to eat Mac-n-cheese every night while it has a Land Rover in the driveway of their 500k McMansion.
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