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re: Why do people care about the Popes political views
Posted on 4/14/26 at 5:04 pm to Murph4HOF
Posted on 4/14/26 at 5:04 pm to Murph4HOF
0
Posted on 4/14/26 at 5:29 pm to CID 310
It’s the true church, we all know it we just play games.
The pope has been consulted for hundreds of years. The Nuremberg trials don’t happen without the papal sign off ordered by the President of the United States of America
The pope also has over 1B soliders and I am telling yall right now if he declared a crusade you wouldn’t believe your eyes at the guys willing to sign up for it.
The pope has been consulted for hundreds of years. The Nuremberg trials don’t happen without the papal sign off ordered by the President of the United States of America
The pope also has over 1B soliders and I am telling yall right now if he declared a crusade you wouldn’t believe your eyes at the guys willing to sign up for it.
This post was edited on 4/14/26 at 5:31 pm
Posted on 4/14/26 at 10:39 pm to Champagne
quote:My denomination is one of the oldest in the U.S.. It's smaller because not most Christians are not fans of exclusive psalmody and acapella singing, in particular. Folks like their hymns and contemporary music, as well as their pianos and rock bands. We've remained faithful, though. We've also grown by almost 50% in the last year or so, with an influx of families and younger singles coming in from broader evangelicalism and Catholicism, in particular.
You need to consider YOUR church's history and how even today there are only about 8,000 of your congregation practicing in the whole USA.
quote:I miss plenty of opportunities. I also don't jump into every topic right away but try to contribute in specific ways.
You never miss an opportunity to attack Catholics, their Pope and their Church around here.
You should also note that I never initiate the topics. While I'm happy to chime in here and there, I'm not going out of my way to start it.
quote:It's not why I'm here, but I do appreciate the opportunities to expose the false teachings of Rome that lead so many to perdition through a false "gospel" of works-righteousness.
Everybody around here knows your schtick by now - anti-Catholicism is why you are here.
As I've told you many times now, I'm here to provide a Christian worldview to politics and current events, and to share the gospel of Jesus Christ with the lost. I also engage in apologetics to show people that the Christian faith is reasonable and defensible. Maybe one of these times you will believe me when I say that.
Posted on 4/14/26 at 10:45 pm to StrongOffer
quote:Not really, at least not for the last thousand years when the Pope expanded his authority from the Church to the State. It's really just been since Vatican II that Catholics have felt comfortable trashing the Pope as if he's nothing special. That's not how his office has been treated prior.
They are historical.
quote:I agree to an extent, but a lot of what he's discussing has to do with faith and morals. He's talking about the morality of war and immigration, not merely taking a political stance. Your fellow Catholics also seem to think that's the case when they stick up for him.
And political views are neither of what you just listed.
quote:Yes and no. I provided the Catechism reference where it says that says Catholics owe him religious faith even when he isn't speaking infallibly. In centuries past, everything he said had impact and influence. I'm glad Catholicism has changed in this regard (in spite of constant assurances that she doesn't change), however.
Catholics have never been mandated to submit to every opinion the Pope has.
quote:Again, he's speaking on faith and morals most of the time when he's talking about political issues. When he condemns treatment of illegal immigrants, he's talking about it from a moral perspective. Same for when he's speaking about war and conflict.
I can respect him without agreeing with him on matters other than faith and morals.
I get how frustrating it must be to have the Vicar of Christ and successor to St. Peter not living up to his titles with his words and works, but perhaps that should make you question what you've been told by the fallible men that are binding your conscience.
Posted on 4/14/26 at 10:50 pm to wfallstiger
quote:
2 people you should never trust:
A preacher telling you how to vote, and
A politician telling you how to pray
Posted on 4/14/26 at 10:51 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
My denomination is one of the oldest in the U.S
What denomination is that?
Posted on 4/14/26 at 11:23 pm to CID 310
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RE: The US Military and the Catholic Church
As any reader of my threads knows, I have been thinking a lot about the problems in the Catholic Church recently and, interestingly, I think they are a lot like the problems the Department of Defense faced before Trump was inaugurated and made it the Department of War.
The other thing that got me thinking about this is that I live in one of the very most conservative (politically) dioceses in the USA, yet my bishop felt the need to publish a lengthy screed on why we all need to support illegal aliens and oppose their deportation (without ever once using the term “illegal alien,” mind you, or even recognizing the obligation such people have to follow US laws).
How is that possible?
Well, it’s because the Church is a strictly hierarchal organization, with a rigid “command structure.” In such organizations, those who model the thoughts of the chain of command above them advance, and those who do not are left behind.
So my bishop got to be a bishop by thinking and acting like the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops and the US cardinals, and not thinking and acting like the faithful Catholics in his diocese.
ALL hierarchal organizations are like this.
The Department of War was no different. Years of adherence at the very top to DEI, the use of insane ROE that sacrificed the lives of our troops so as to proffer some mistaken view of virtue, and a focus on politicization of the highest ranks means that multiple generations of officers and senior NCOs modeled that behavior. If they did not, they did not advance.
Now Pete Hegseth and his team, thankfully, are slowly but surely cutting out this rot and returning our military to its intended purpose of closing with and destroying our enemies.
But here’s the thing—we Americans are able to do this because ultimately the President, the SecWar and the entire chain of command are accountable to the VOTERS, and we have the ability to transform things through the ballot box.
The Catholic Church, however, is beholden to a College of Cardinals (they elect Popes) who all became cardinals just like my bishop became bishop—by toeing the line and modeling the behavior of their superiors. Thus, we have been burdened with Francis and then Leo.
For the Church, there is no laity ballot box as there is in the US government, so a transformational movement led by the flock becomes almost impossible.
We Americans figured out how to undo the rot in our nation’s military. I don’t know how faithful Catholics can undo the rot in the Church.
It’s both infuriating and depressing. The only thing we Catholics have to hang our hats on is that Jesus himself promised that the “gates of Hell” would never prevail against His Church.
Posted on 4/14/26 at 11:34 pm to BeeFense5
quote:
Why does Trump care so much?
Why are people like you so ignorant. Trump was REPLYING to the retard pope. Try to keep up dumb arse.
Posted on 4/14/26 at 11:55 pm to FooManChoo
quote:I like you and would if you attempted to make a good-faith argument. You have a huge blind spot when it comes to the Catholic Church and are too stubborn to listen to what Catholics actually believe. Even in your rebuttal to me, you continue to not want to grasp that Catholics don’t think the Pope is infallible in every opinion he has. That doesn’t mean we don’t respect him or think he’s special. Catholics should never think the Pope isn’t to be respected.
Maybe one of these times you will believe me when I say that.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 12:03 am to StrongOffer
quote:
Pope is infallible in every opinion he has.
Infallible acceptable errors are forgetting to pay for your dry cleaning.
What most recent popes have done since JPII are way, way, more fallible than that. I suppose since standards are so low for most cardinals, etc., it's not unexpected that his level of toxic empathy fits right in.
I believe that one of the problems is there is a difference between the level of processing between well off American Catholics and most of the Catholic flock, in third world countries. It feels like you're all Catholic, but it means two entirely different things. Hispanic Catholics, it's welfare and compassion at all costs, to whomever needs to bear those costs.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 12:04 am to lurking
quote:The Reformed Presbyterian Church of North America (RPCNA). Dates back to the 1700's, when the Scottish Covenantors planted churches in America.
What denomination is that?
Posted on 4/15/26 at 12:11 am to StrongOffer
quote:Thank you, but I am most certainly arguing in good faith, or at least believe I am. I go out of my way to represent the true teaching of the RCC, to the best of my knowledge, based on much study of it.
I like you and would if you attempted to make a good-faith argument.
quote:I fully understand the RCC's teaching on papal infallibility, and that he is only truly infallible when he speaks ex cathedra, or from the chair of St. Peter, when he is making a definitive, authoritative statement on faith and morals. I also know that the RCC claims that Popes have only spoken infallibly in a few different instances, though others are debated.
You have a huge blind spot when it comes to the Catholic Church and are too stubborn to listen to what Catholics actually believe. Even in your rebuttal to me, you continue to not want to grasp that Catholics don’t think the Pope is infallible in every opinion he has.
I've been careful in my statements to ensure I am representing the Catholic beliefs accurately. If I misstate something, feel free to correct me. I've actually learned a lot about Catholic teaching over the years by being corrected by posters on this board, so I'm certainly open to correction about that.
quote:I agree with you that, according to the official teaching of the RCC, that Catholics shouldn't ever think the Pope isn't to be respected. My commentary is really focusing on the common practice these days of disrespecting the Pope, calling him an anti-Pope, and other derogatory names due to disagreements about his statements.
That doesn’t mean we don’t respect him or think he’s special. Catholics should never think the Pope isn’t to be respected.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 12:27 am to CID 310
Pope Leo XIV isn’t just "dabbling in politics" when he addresses President Trump’s tweets or actions regarding Iran; he is fulfilling the fundamental moral mandate of the Petrine office. As the Vicar of Christ, the Pope’s primary duty is to be a prophetic voice for the "Gospel of Peace," which transcends national borders and election cycles. Catholic Social Teaching, particularly the Just War Theory, strictly forbids the kind of "total war" rhetoric—such as threats to eradicate civilizations or target civilian infrastructure—that has appeared in recent social media posts. For a Pope, especially the first American one, to remain silent in the face of rhetoric that risks the lives of millions of innocents would be a dereliction of his duty to protect the "human family" and uphold the sanctity of life.
Furthermore, the Church’s authority to speak on these matters is rooted in the belief that the moral law applies to all human actions, including statecraft and international diplomacy. When Pope Leo calls for an "off-ramp" or labels certain threats as "truly unacceptable," he is applying the Catechism’s requirement that the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. By challenging the "delusion of omnipotence" and focusing on the common good, he is acting not as a partisan operative, but as a shepherd reminding world leaders that they are ultimately accountable to a higher moral standard. In the Catholic view, peace isn't just the absence of war, but the "tranquillity of order," and it is well within the Pope’s rights—and indeed his job description—to point out when modern rhetoric threatens to shatter that order.
To build on that, we have to look at the crucial theological distinction between preemptive and preventative war, which is where the moral "line in the sand" is drawn for the Church.
From a traditional Catholic viewpoint, a preemptive strike is a tragic but potentially justifiable response to an imminent and certain attack—essentially, the enemy’s sword is already mid-swing, and you move to parry. In contrast, preventative war—attacking a nation simply to stop a potential threat that might develop years down the road—is categorically rejected by Just War Theory. The Catechism requires that for a war to be "just," the damage inflicted by the aggressor must be lasting, grave, and certain. Striking someone because they might one day become a threat fails the test of "certainty" and violates the principle of "last resort."
This brings us to the President’s recent rhetoric. If, as the President himself has claimed, Iran has already lost its nuclear capabilities, then the primary justification for military intervention effectively evaporates. If the "threat" is no longer imminent or even developing, there is no "just cause" for the U.S. to maintain a combat presence or threaten further strikes. From Pope Leo's perspective, continuing to push for war when the stated danger has been neutralized isn't "defense"—it's an act of aggression that risks millions of lives for no moral end. By pointing this out, the Pope is simply holding the President to the logic of his own claims, reminding the world that if the peace can be kept, it must be kept.
Furthermore, the Church’s authority to speak on these matters is rooted in the belief that the moral law applies to all human actions, including statecraft and international diplomacy. When Pope Leo calls for an "off-ramp" or labels certain threats as "truly unacceptable," he is applying the Catechism’s requirement that the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. By challenging the "delusion of omnipotence" and focusing on the common good, he is acting not as a partisan operative, but as a shepherd reminding world leaders that they are ultimately accountable to a higher moral standard. In the Catholic view, peace isn't just the absence of war, but the "tranquillity of order," and it is well within the Pope’s rights—and indeed his job description—to point out when modern rhetoric threatens to shatter that order.
To build on that, we have to look at the crucial theological distinction between preemptive and preventative war, which is where the moral "line in the sand" is drawn for the Church.
From a traditional Catholic viewpoint, a preemptive strike is a tragic but potentially justifiable response to an imminent and certain attack—essentially, the enemy’s sword is already mid-swing, and you move to parry. In contrast, preventative war—attacking a nation simply to stop a potential threat that might develop years down the road—is categorically rejected by Just War Theory. The Catechism requires that for a war to be "just," the damage inflicted by the aggressor must be lasting, grave, and certain. Striking someone because they might one day become a threat fails the test of "certainty" and violates the principle of "last resort."
This brings us to the President’s recent rhetoric. If, as the President himself has claimed, Iran has already lost its nuclear capabilities, then the primary justification for military intervention effectively evaporates. If the "threat" is no longer imminent or even developing, there is no "just cause" for the U.S. to maintain a combat presence or threaten further strikes. From Pope Leo's perspective, continuing to push for war when the stated danger has been neutralized isn't "defense"—it's an act of aggression that risks millions of lives for no moral end. By pointing this out, the Pope is simply holding the President to the logic of his own claims, reminding the world that if the peace can be kept, it must be kept.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 1:14 am to CID 310
Because he should be not involved in politics. Period.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 7:07 am to FooManChoo
quote:This isn’t coming from Catholics. It’s coming from non-Catholic Christians and “grew up Catholics”.
My commentary is really focusing on the common practice these days of disrespecting the Pope, calling him an anti-Pope, and other derogatory names due to disagreements about his statements.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 7:28 am to SallysHuman
quote:
The Pope... is to represent Christ himself on Earth.
Yes, and Jesus did not preach to governments, political authorities or institutions. His message is for humans with souls.
A Pope should also only message individuals. God did not direct his message to the Roman Empire, he directed it to an individual, Constantine.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 7:29 am to CID 310
I have more of an issue with the pedophilia and cozying up to terrorists. But that's a Hallmark of the left.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 7:56 am to StrongOffer
quote:Here is a post from this thread that comes from someone claiming to be Catholic with a local parish that is speaking critically/disrespectfully of the Pope (saying he doesn’t care what he says).
This isn’t coming from Catholics. It’s coming from non-Catholic Christians and “grew up Catholics”.
There have been many comments like this or much worse from people who claim to be Catholic.
You can say that those people are not really Catholics because true Catholics won’t speak that way if the Pope but will give him honor and respect, but that just isn’t happening with a lot of people who think themselves members of the Catholic Church.
Posted on 4/15/26 at 7:59 am to LuckyTiger
quote:
And I have a problem when he stays quiet as a mouse as Iran slaughters tens of thousands of people in the streets but then comes out strongly anti violence when the US attacks Iran.
It makes him a hypocrite.
It sure does
Posted on 4/15/26 at 8:24 am to CID 310
quote:
Legit answers only
Not Catholic. But did go to a Catholic High School. Some of my friends are still practicing Catholics. One of my best friends, a 25-year veteran, who I recently traveled with in Europe, made it a point to go to mass if available while there. He takes his faith, and being Catholic, very seriously.
Point here is the Catholic Church reports about 1.3 billion Catholics worldwide. The Pope’s opinions attract attention worldwide, making his words significant to governments, media outlets, and voters everywhere. His opposition to war reflects the Church’s commitment to safeguarding human life and promoting peace, which is why Popes regularly address international conflicts, humanitarian issues, and initiatives to end violence.
His statements resonate beyond religious circles—people of all backgrounds recognize their global impact.
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