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re: When the Going Gets Tough, the Electric go Petrol
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:07 am to concrete_tiger
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:07 am to concrete_tiger
quote:Are factoring that every car HAS to go that gas station to get gas, but every EV has the option to charge from home? I'm guessing you didn't factor that into the equation.
If a gas station has 12 pumps, the scenario assumes 12 charger stations. You can add as many as you want, but cars take physical space in a parking lot, so you'll have to start stacking cars, I guess?
Because you can charge from home, the dependance on charging at a public space is way lower for an EV.
quote:72 is the largest currently, I believe.
How many chargers can you have in one spot, anyway?
quote:I do
o you drive?
quote:I don't because I don't go to gas stations, but again, are you factoring that only a small fraction of EVs actually need to charge publicly compared to basically 100% of gas cars needing to utilize a gas station?
Have you seen the 100 cars that rotate all day in and out every 10 minutes at a station like Buc-ees? And these cars can drive very far on a tank of gas. You'll need to triple the access to "pumps" to avoid long lines.
quote:I agree that it shouldn't be mandated.
We keep talking about "future state," but the libs want to push us in this direction now. We don't have the infrastructure to support converting more than a small percentage. I am okay with that.
1
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:12 am to CptRusty
quote:Yep, that's how I look at it.
The only time you'd be stopping at a public charging station is if you're on a long road trip. A typical gas stop w/restroom etc. is probably at least 20 minutes, if not it's close, and there's no reason to think that charge times will not continue to improve.
We take a yearly family snow skiing trip that's about 650 miles. We make 3 stops to charge at 20 minutes per stop, so charging adds 60 minutes to our trip.
Sure, if you're one of those folks who don't stop to eat or go to the bathroom, sure you can make that same trip with probably 1 stop for 5 minutes in a gas car, so the EV would add 1 hour to the trip, that's pretty significant.
But for me, with a family and 2 young boys(9 years old) and a wife who needs bathroom breaks lol...we're going to need to stop at the very least 2 times and one of those will be to eat, so even in a gas car, we'd need 30-60 minutes total to make a couple of stops.
So are we really adding any time to our trip in an EV with three 20 minute stops? If so, the additional time is really negligible at that point.
This post was edited on 5/25/21 at 11:14 am
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:13 am to antibarner
quote:.
I'm not the only one that thinks fuel cell technology is feasible, care to explain why that is?
because there's a sucker born every minute.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:14 am to CptRusty
Suckers with big bucks that know more than you
This post was edited on 5/25/21 at 11:23 am
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:16 am to antibarner
quote:
Suckers with big bucks that know more than you.
they're not the suckers. They're selling to suckers.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:19 am to CptRusty
Hyundai and Cummins for starters. I'll take their word over yours . You keep advocating for plug in tinker soy toys. 
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:27 am to shel311
quote:
Are factoring that every car HAS to go that gas station to get gas, but every EV has the option to charge from home? I'm guessing you didn't factor that into the equation
Again, where is your home electricity coming from?
Where I live, Alabama Power generates electricity to hundreds of thousands by burning coal.
Not saying that won't change, but for the foreseeable future charging stations and a good chunk of home electricity will be powered by fossil fuels.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:30 am to antibarner
I'm sure the fuel cell revolution is right around the corner. But since you want to go down the road of appeal to authority, then maybe you can tell Elon Musk he was wrong when he called fuel cells "mind bogglingly stupid", "staggeringly dumb", and "simply not possible to succeed".
Mr. Musk has created a company from scratch that has already revolutionized the automotive industry. Oh and in his spare time he revolutionized space travel with reusable rockets.
You've repeatedly demonstrated that you aren't equipped to be having this conversation. I've been nice about it, but the fact of the matter is you completely lack a basic understanding of thermodynamics. I'd have to educate you for a few hours just for you to comprehend why you're wrong, and I don't have any desire to do that.
Mr. Musk has created a company from scratch that has already revolutionized the automotive industry. Oh and in his spare time he revolutionized space travel with reusable rockets.
You've repeatedly demonstrated that you aren't equipped to be having this conversation. I've been nice about it, but the fact of the matter is you completely lack a basic understanding of thermodynamics. I'd have to educate you for a few hours just for you to comprehend why you're wrong, and I don't have any desire to do that.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 11:51 am to Perfect Circle
quote:How is this relevant to that piece of the discussion and that poster trying to equate wait times to charge in public to gas pump availability? I fail to see the relevance.
Again, where is your home electricity coming from?
Posted on 5/25/21 at 12:39 pm to EA6B
I agree. And I will not own a electric truck or car until technology is much improved. But I also think electric of some form is the future and it should be invested in and improved. But forcing this issue right now amor making gas running vehicles taxes harder or flagged in some way as I have read on here that UK has started doing for antiques and older cars is complete BS. Should not be taxed or have to buy a new car if you bought vehicle previously.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 2:12 pm to CptRusty
Elon Musk is a brilliant man, it's true. But infallible he is not.
LINK
Sometimes even Musk gets it wrong. Those companies I mentioned are investing in the technology. Now if it were not possible don't you think they would realize it? You have showed arrogance and little else when I presented evidence that there were large corporations that shared my views concerning the technology.When someone is losing an argument the usual tactic is to attack the opposing presenter. We will see who is right.
LINK
quote:
Elon Musk’s SpaceX rocket blows up: Successes and failures of a billionaire
Sometimes even Musk gets it wrong. Those companies I mentioned are investing in the technology. Now if it were not possible don't you think they would realize it? You have showed arrogance and little else when I presented evidence that there were large corporations that shared my views concerning the technology.When someone is losing an argument the usual tactic is to attack the opposing presenter. We will see who is right.
This post was edited on 5/25/21 at 2:23 pm
Posted on 5/25/21 at 2:18 pm to Clames
quote:
Because charging/discharging and providing batteries with feedback is responsible for the vast majority of the improvements made. People who actually know this stuff vs you who do not, get this fact.
We are talking about the range of electric vehicles and the projected increase of that range. You have conveniently ignored addressing the improvement in EV range by discussing a supposed lack of increase in the energy density of a specific type of battery. Ironically you ridiculed me for linking Quora yet have zero sources for any of your claims.
quote:
t's exactly the same chemistry as the cells found in consumer products for the last two decades
There is more to a battery than its chemical composition that will ultimately affect its conservation of charge and energy output.
quote:
You are rebutted.
Because you said so? Where's the source for your claims?
quote:
I'm quite secure kid, you are just the typical low-info type that parrots things without actually knowing anything.
So you waited until the end to bring out the personal attacks.
Children resort to name calling when they feel insecure.
quote:
EV homers that pat themselves on the back every time a thread like this is posted.
So because I don't agree with your odd anti-EV beliefs I am an EV homer? I clearly stated that range is still an issue, especially for a truck. I'm not buying an F150 lightning because the range doesn't make sense for towing a boat or going on a road trip. The technological trends however suggest that these problems will be resolved and I look forward to the day that I can buy an affordable EV truck with great range and quick charging.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 2:29 pm to antibarner
Yea, be sure to let me know when the fuel cell revolution begins.
Posted on 5/25/21 at 2:33 pm to antibarner
LINK
Here's the numbers, crunch them yourselves. As I have contended, technology does not stand still.
quote:
The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) supports the research and development of a wide range of technologies to produce hydrogen economically and in environmentally friendly ways. View the hydrogen production pathways graphic to learn more about the time frames and production scales for these technologies.
Here's the numbers, crunch them yourselves. As I have contended, technology does not stand still.
This post was edited on 5/25/21 at 2:35 pm
Posted on 5/25/21 at 2:48 pm to antibarner
which numbers am I supposed to "crunch" from that article?
Regardless, you want to talk numbers, so here let's talk numbers:
Regardless, you want to talk numbers, so here let's talk numbers:
Posted on 5/25/21 at 4:44 pm to CptRusty
Going by your numbers, fuel cells are far more efficient than conventional vehicles. As you say, technology will not stand still, and we can expect energy loss numbers will only improve.
You have to improve range, charge times, battery life, battery size and weight, power sources, etc.
The only thing my method has to improve is fuel production. That will happen. The link talks about just that. The actual vehicles exist and the concept is sound. Better range, power and even cleaner, this is from the link
LINK
You have to improve range, charge times, battery life, battery size and weight, power sources, etc.
The only thing my method has to improve is fuel production. That will happen. The link talks about just that. The actual vehicles exist and the concept is sound. Better range, power and even cleaner, this is from the link
quote:
The company’s other project is green hydrogen.
Why green hydrogen? Because it is the only other alternative, besides green ammonia, to solving the planet’s fossil fuel crisis.
Hydrogen, which is used in power cells, has a lot of advantages over standard batteries like lithium…
• Hydrogen-based fuel cells are carbon-free.
• Batteries need to be recharged, but fuel cells continue generating power as long as they continue getting hydrogen fuel.
• Fuel cells are more scalable, and they can power giant installations and super-powerful engines like those of jet planes. More on that in a second…
• Fuel cells are reliable and silent.
Global industry leaders are working on big hydrogen projects… like Rolls-Royce…
This leader in jet engine design has already spent billions of dollars in research and development...and has over 800 patents approved in an effort to produce
next-generation jet engines.
LINK
This post was edited on 5/25/21 at 6:54 pm
Posted on 5/26/21 at 6:24 am to antibarner
I love it when innovative companies and the free market set out to prove arrogant soydrinkers wrong...snicker. 
quote:
Hyperion XP1 is a hydrogen-powered hypercar with over 1,000 miles of range, 1,500 horsepower, 2.2 seconds to 60 mph, top speed of 221 mph… and a recharge time of four minutes.
This post was edited on 5/26/21 at 6:34 am
Posted on 5/26/21 at 8:03 am to Tridentds
quote:
If you feed a water tank with a 1/4" line and the dump valve is 1" how much longer do you think you will be able to get water from that water tank?
Maff... it always works.
If you feed a 1/4" line into a 1" line it will last longer than if you didn't feed it with anything is what he was saying. Not fixing the issue and making it a fully sustainable solution but making it just go further.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:15 am to antibarner
quote:
Just 300 Hyperion XP-1 hypercars are being produced and, while the firm has not revealed how much it costs, we expect that the price will be lofty.
I wonder what the definition of "lofty" is?
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