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When did Republican=conservative / Democrat=liberal start?
Posted on 12/11/17 at 7:55 am
Posted on 12/11/17 at 7:55 am
Both are mearly factions of each party. It's so inaccurate but this board has ran with that ideal for years.
You guys know, not all on the GOP are conservative. In fact few would be true conservatives.
Same for they other side.
Bernie. Yeah that's a liberal. Dragonlady, not as much.
Left =/= liberal
Right =/= conservative.
Why is this false narrative pushed.
I'll start the first downvote, because that shite means nothing....
You guys know, not all on the GOP are conservative. In fact few would be true conservatives.
Same for they other side.
Bernie. Yeah that's a liberal. Dragonlady, not as much.
Left =/= liberal
Right =/= conservative.
Why is this false narrative pushed.
I'll start the first downvote, because that shite means nothing....
This post was edited on 12/11/17 at 7:56 am
Posted on 12/11/17 at 7:56 am to Napoleon
quote:
Both are mearly factions of each party
Democrats have not be liberal for a while. Modern Progressives are totalitarian shite bags.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 7:58 am to Napoleon
I think I it really started around 1964 with Goldwater vs LBJ and accelerated as the far left of the Dems took off.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:00 am to Napoleon
neither conservative nor liberal has any real meaning anymore
they have both just become monikers for what we hate about the "other side"
they have both just become monikers for what we hate about the "other side"
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:03 am to Napoleon
It's more complicated than that. Bernie isn't a liberal. How can a liberal want the government taking over huge swaths of the economy and creating thousands and thousands of addition govt regulations on people and industry? Regulations on car efficiency, washing machine efficiency, light bulbs etc. Ridiculous.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:05 am to Napoleon
well this I know:
democrats <> conservative
so there's that
democrats <> conservative
so there's that
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:24 am to Salmon
That's how I see it, especially on here.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:25 am to teke184
I think it was the Democratic party's embrace of civil rights for blacks and racial desegregation / racial equality.
That drove conservatives and Conservatives away from the Democratic party and associated "Democrat" with liberal / progressive. The Civil Rights Movement was a liberal movement pushed by liberals and primarily populated by liberals.
Northerners such as the three young civil rights workers who were murdered in MS traveled to the South to support the racial equality movement and to conservative Southern Democrats were "meddling Liberals". To be in favor of racial desegregation was to be "liberal". And it is during this time that Conservatives began using the pejorative label "Lib-n*gger lovers".
That drove conservatives and Conservatives away from the Democratic party and associated "Democrat" with liberal / progressive. The Civil Rights Movement was a liberal movement pushed by liberals and primarily populated by liberals.
Northerners such as the three young civil rights workers who were murdered in MS traveled to the South to support the racial equality movement and to conservative Southern Democrats were "meddling Liberals". To be in favor of racial desegregation was to be "liberal". And it is during this time that Conservatives began using the pejorative label "Lib-n*gger lovers".
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:25 am to Jake88
Washing machine efficiency regulations started under W.
Fwiw.
Fwiw.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:38 am to Napoleon
quote:
Bernie. Yeah that's a liberal
Bernie isn't a liberal. He is a leftist.
A liberal is someone like Dave Rubin
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:47 am to Napoleon
FDR and the New Deal and reinforced by LBJ and the Great Society. Both conglomerations of socialist policies.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 8:55 am to Napoleon
For almost a century, the Democratic Party was a coalition of factions, many of which had almost nothing in common. In 1948, both Strom Thurmond and Henry A. Wallace bolted from the Democratic Party and ran 3rd Party campaigns. Thurmond ran as a Dixiecrat, which was the most conservative platform in that election, and Wallace ran on the Progressive Party ticket.
After the 1948 election, the conservative Dixiecrats were never again solid Democrats. By 1964, the Dixiecrats were Goldwater supporters and SC, GA, AL, MS and LA voted for Barry. With this departure, the Democrats became the party of labor unions, progressives and minorities.
After the 1948 election, the conservative Dixiecrats were never again solid Democrats. By 1964, the Dixiecrats were Goldwater supporters and SC, GA, AL, MS and LA voted for Barry. With this departure, the Democrats became the party of labor unions, progressives and minorities.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:04 am to Napoleon
First, the definition of the words "liberal" and "conservative" had to be hijacked to pretty much focus on the social version.
Republicans have not been fiscally conservative for over 30 years. They pretty much abandoned that ideal to focus entirely on being socially conservative.
Democrats aren't nearly as socially liberal as other countries (being downright socially conservative is several other first world countries). They are, however, most assuredly fiscally liberal.
These words, however, made it easy to demonize the other side.
Liberals were "changing for the sake of change", trying to "impose that change on others"
Conservatives are "against change for the sake of stagnation", trying to "impose a state non-change on others".
In other words, the two parties flourished because they found new words to demonize the other side. Focus on preaching that hate, instead of offering solutions (which does happen on occasion, but tends to be the exception).
It doesn't help that words get assigned to admittedly moving targets. What would the idea of a "liberal" and a "conservative" mean to a Founding Father? To Lincoln? To FDR? Heck, to Reagan? In our context, or theirs? How far back in the past before a modern day conservative is considered liberal? How about fiscally?
Republicans have not been fiscally conservative for over 30 years. They pretty much abandoned that ideal to focus entirely on being socially conservative.
Democrats aren't nearly as socially liberal as other countries (being downright socially conservative is several other first world countries). They are, however, most assuredly fiscally liberal.
These words, however, made it easy to demonize the other side.
Liberals were "changing for the sake of change", trying to "impose that change on others"
Conservatives are "against change for the sake of stagnation", trying to "impose a state non-change on others".
In other words, the two parties flourished because they found new words to demonize the other side. Focus on preaching that hate, instead of offering solutions (which does happen on occasion, but tends to be the exception).
It doesn't help that words get assigned to admittedly moving targets. What would the idea of a "liberal" and a "conservative" mean to a Founding Father? To Lincoln? To FDR? Heck, to Reagan? In our context, or theirs? How far back in the past before a modern day conservative is considered liberal? How about fiscally?
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:11 am to Napoleon
As long as they have been the relevant parties.
Really, it's meant to distract you from this fact:
Democrat=Republican
Really, it's meant to distract you from this fact:
Democrat=Republican
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:13 am to Salmon
quote:
they have both just become monikers for what we hate about the "other side"
Since I believe in freedom of religion and freedom of speech, I am more liberal than most Democrats and people who claim to be liberal today.
I voted for Trump.
The people who claim to be liberal today are actually nothing like real liberals. Neither are the people who claim to be conservative.
This post was edited on 12/11/17 at 9:18 am
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:31 am to skrayper
Great discussion here really.
I just don't get why we find hotbutton issues to divide rather than trying to find issues we all could collaborate on. I know in politics it's never kumbaya.
It's just so divided now.
I had hoped that this election would split the parties but Cuckery happened on both sides to keep the parties strong.
This us or them sucks.
Whatever happened to being American first?
I just don't get why we find hotbutton issues to divide rather than trying to find issues we all could collaborate on. I know in politics it's never kumbaya.
It's just so divided now.
I had hoped that this election would split the parties but Cuckery happened on both sides to keep the parties strong.
This us or them sucks.
Whatever happened to being American first?
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:32 am to member12
I just never got how Liberal became the catchall for anyone well wasn't conservative.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:37 am to Napoleon
quote:
Whatever happened to being American first?
Remember, it was a Democrat who said, "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country" - the problem is that both sides abandoned this ideal (to differing degrees and focuses, but abandoned all the same).
We, the public, surrendered all the control to the politicians and the lobbyists, and the machinations behind those lobbyists. Lobbyists thrive in an atmosphere of fear, and they will stoke those fears on the sides that will garner them the most money.
What's sad is that our government should neither be capitalist or socialist, but everyone tries to make it one or the other.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:40 am to Napoleon
quote:
Left =/= liberal
Everything you've said so far is incorrect. But I'm not in the mood to do a dissertation. We can start with one simple example.
Give me a law (bill) that a leftist would support and a liberal would oppose.
Posted on 12/11/17 at 9:41 am to skrayper
quote:
"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country" -
This is the motto of every totalitarian state in history.
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