re: Was the oct 7th attack by Hamas one of the greatest blunders in military history?

Typically we judge military decisions and actions based on the outcome they achieve in practical terms

Not the perceived context one or more of the involved actors at the time might have been operating under or perceived things to be a certain way.

So that’s what I’m doing here. I’m not dodging or avoiding your question, I simply think it’s irrelevant to what I asked

"Israel" in the bible are the Christians. Not the modern secular state of Zionism. Christians faith is weaponized against them to guilt them in supporting a secular country. That being said. The USA had good enough reasons to attack Iran even without Israels involvement. I am not opposed to being allies with Israel. I am opposed to any criticism of Israel or Jewish specialness being labeled as being "anti-semetic" to silence the criticism.

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I am opposed to any criticism of Israel or Jewish specialness being labeled as being "anti-semetic" to silence the criticism.

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I dont think there should be any "jewish specialness", but jews are largely a good group if you restrict it to the religious ones. Kind of like how everyone in America is a Christian but the only people who attend church are republicans (not counting the abominations of the ABCUSA and its ilk). The criticism of Israel is mostly weak on merit. They get subsidies? So does everyone else in the world. They give us more bang for buck than anybody on return in terms of UN votes and eliminating jihadis

Im not a tinfoiler, AIPAC has too much influence yes, but thats minor in the grand scheme. The millions of muslims flooding Europe are not because of Israel, yet many claim its some grand conspiracy. Why on earth would Jews wants Muslims to overrun every country they live in? Can anyone answer that?

The threat is Islam. Point blank. They are outbreeding us, they are invading Western nations, and they outnumber us. Anyone thinking 10 million people are the existential threat over a billion desert dwellers is insane.

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I’m of the opinion we can walk and chew gum at the same time so to speak on this. Islam is the overall biggest threat to western world I’m in agreement with you, that doesn’t mean we can’t and shouldn’t ask the questions needed when and where applicable critical of Israel.

Which there are quite a few at present

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I think we are past walk and chew gum. Islam is an existential threat. Europe has probably 30 years left before its muslim majority. Israel is happy keeping their little plot of land in the Holy Land, and more than willing to go to war with islam. I care about who is flooding our borders and our ancestral borders.

People can bemoan the joos all they want, we already have fricking Mamdani running the largest city in the country. Every major city in the UK has a muslim mayor.

It was Charlie Kirk who suggested Israel had a stand down order.

He said that Israel is the size of New Jersey… and that you can be anywhere in Israel within a 45 minute helicopter ride.

So why then did it take Israel 7 hours to respond to the October 7th attacks???

It’s not an obsession with Israel to raise serious questions as to event used as the predicate for war.

Stop being obtuse.

You could ask the same of 9/11.

The current bombing in Iran has nothing to do with nuclear talks last week. This is the next stage of a continuous action that began October 7. It has been expertly executed. Yes, Israel is driving the bus, and they know exactly what they are doing.

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It was about how big of a military mistake it was and asking if it is one of the worst ones in history. That’s the subject of the thread.

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And it’s a good question. It does seem to have backfired tremendously. The reason they dd it was to derail the normalization of relations between Saudi Arabia and Israel. They viewed this as a giant step in the wrong direction and, from their perspective, they were right.

The Arab world has largely moved into modernity. They are not just oil sheiks anymore. Kuwait, Qatar, The Emirates and Saudi Arabia all have glistening cities of remarkable commerce. They have too much at stake and just want peaceful relationships so they can focus on making money. But they still have large radical populations high on Islam. That was Hezbollah’s target audience.

When they attacked they did not know that Trump was going to win the election. If Kamala had won they would be sitting snugly right now. They would have taken huge casualties in Gaza, but they would have stopped the Saudi normalization and Iran would still be feeding them money and weapons. And the day of the radical Muslim bomb would be approaching.

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With Mossad agents at every level of Iranian intelligence and military, I wonder how they missed this?

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They didn’t miss it. Netanyahu allowed it to happen. The only way to get to this point in time with the US was to have an event that would draw us in.