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Started By
Message
re: Trump's section 301 tariffs were successful. The data proves it.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:03 am to GumboPot
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:03 am to GumboPot
quote:
ALL taxes are bad. They are used to central plan, full stop.
So is all deficit spending.
But here we are.
Judging from the reaction of the past couple of days, MAGA wants unlimited budgets and no taxes.
You are going to pay through taxes, inflation or both...regardless if you spend way more than you bring in.
0
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:03 am to GumboPot
quote:
ALL taxes are bad
Tariffs prop up inefficient producers. They will make products more expensive to consumers. They lower your standard of living. They are central planning 101 and give the govenment the ability to pick "winners and losers" like Trump did in China. Trump vowed to put tariffs on all Chinese imports then proceeded to do a nice "carve out" for Apple's iPhone which didn't see the tariffs.
Watch Milei in Argentina who chooses freedom and free markets over central planning. He has vowed to get rid of all tariffs, both import and export, by next year. It will be a real time "case study".
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:05 am to frogtown
quote:
Tariffs prop up inefficient producers. They will make products more expensive to consumers. They lower your standard of living. They are central planning 101 and give the govenment the ability to pick "winners and losers" like Trump did in China. Trump vowed to put tariffs on all Chinese imports then proceeded to do a nice "carve out" for Apple's iPhone which didn't see the tariffs.
This is the textbook example of why tariffs are awful long term solutions. They create massive inefficiencies and open up black market opportunities. 
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:12 am to frogtown
quote:
Tariffs prop up inefficient producers. They will make products more expensive to consumers. They lower your standard of living. They are central planning 101 and give the govenment the ability to pick "winners and losers" like Trump did in China. Trump vowed to put tariffs on all Chinese imports then proceeded to do a nice "carve out" for Apple's iPhone which didn't see the tariffs.
How do we combat state owned businesses in China? Subsidize our businesses or take ownership of said businesses like China?
BTW, Apple has diversified there manufacturing base by moving more manufacturing out of China and into India, which is smart.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:13 am to lake chuck fan
quote:
Trump's section 301 tariffs were successful. The data proves it.
This thread is a bat signal for I B Chinaman, who has probably already posted by the time I finish typing this.
Still, it's correct. Even today I see a lot of our resident "Never-Trump" crowd downplaying the effectiveness of the Trump tariffs, but the actual data has been undeniable all along. They worked, and brought manufacturing jobs back to America from overseas.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:15 am to GumboPot
quote:
How do we combat state owned businesses in China?
they were already leaving. Chinese labor costs more than countries like Mexico and the bureaucracy has turned against some businesses in China.
Chinas success put them in jeopardy of losing low level mfg to countries with lower labor costs and less bureaucratic instability.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:17 am to TigerAxeOK
quote:
This is the textbook example of why tariffs are awful long term solutions. They create massive inefficiencies and open up black market opportunities.
Posted by Roger.
This is why using textbook basics isn’t used by economists. There is so many variables and other contributing factors involved in this situation.
quote:
Still, it's correct. Even today I see a lot of our resident "Never-Trump" crowd downplaying the effectiveness of the Trump tariffs, but the actual data has been undeniable all along. They worked, and brought manufacturing jobs back to America from overseas.
This is why Roger isn’t an economist with his completion or micro and macro I.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:17 am to GumboPot
quote:
How do we combat state owned businesses in China?
I really don't care about China.
I am against Trump's use of "universal basic tariffs" which would put tariffs on all imports. It is absolutely one of the stupidiest ideas I have ever heard.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:18 am to frogtown
quote:
I really don't care about China. I am against Trump's use of "universal basic tariffs" which would put tariffs on all imports. It is absolutely one of the stupidiest ideas I have ever heard.
Wow this may be one of the most ignorant posts I’ve seen on this board. Hot take
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:19 am to TigerAxeOK
quote:
crowd downplaying the effectiveness of the Trump tariffs,
I't just costs me money. I am not competing with unskilled Chinese for work.
It cost you money too, but it might take a few years for you folks to understand why.
I am about to buy the hell out of some Chinese glass for firearm optics though and save thousands by not buying American.
I bet 80% of the people in this thread posting have the same chinese products. Tools, and optics.
This post was edited on 3/11/24 at 9:21 am
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:22 am to RogerTheShrubber
I'm not a fan of tariffs. But I hate state owned business and welfare payments more. If used properly, yes tariffs can be used to protect businesses and keep business running and people off the welfare roles. One way or the other the American tax payer is paying for it. Might as well get a little production out of it by protecting business. If improperly used (see Smoot-Hawley) they can have very negative unintended economic consequences. But this goes for ALL taxes, not just tariffs.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:24 am to GumboPot
quote:
. But I hate state owned business and welfare payments more.
But thats what tariffs are, just welfare paid for by the American Consumer to help woke American corporations.
Its not the big corporations that suffer. Its the consumer.
This post was edited on 3/11/24 at 9:24 am
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:24 am to frogtown
quote:
I am against Trump's use of "universal basic tariffs" which would put tariffs on all imports.
Trump said this? How does this work in context of Trump's USMCA? Are we tariffing Mexico and Canada? Europe?
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:26 am to TigerAxeOK
quote:
Still, it's correct. Even today I see a lot of our resident "Never-Trump" crowd downplaying the effectiveness of the Trump tariffs, but the actual data has been undeniable all along. They worked, and brought manufacturing jobs back to America from overseas.
No meaningful revival in manufacturing jobs occurred during his presidency. And the cost of his tariffs was borne almost entirely by American businesses and consumers.
These tariffs were a cheap act of political theater and a complete economic failure.
But they did help China, so maybe that was his plan all along??
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:26 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Its not the big corporations that suffer. Its the consumer.
Tariffs shift the tax burden however slightly from income tax payers to consumers of products from tariffed countries. That includes people that avoid income taxes.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:27 am to GumboPot
quote:
Trump said this?
It is in his 2024 economic plan.
"Trump's proposed 10% tariff plan would 'shake up every asset class,' strategist says. The former president, and overwhelming favorite to secure the Republican nomination for the 2024 race, plans to impose a 10% tariff on all imported goods."
Just Google it.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:27 am to GumboPot
quote:
One way or the other the American tax payer is paying for it. Might as well get a little production out of it by protecting business.
Its not sustainable for China.
IHere is the way I see it. If the Chinese want to subsidize American consumers, frick yeah...I will take it every day.
Its not sustainable, which is why you see economic issues in China now. Their economics dont work.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:30 am to RogerTheShrubber
So TDS cases like you bitched the tariffs would drive up prices and now when it actually made prices fall you take a victory lap? Never change antiTrumpers. Like children, you aren’t expected to make sense.
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:33 am to frogtown
His proposal is economic punishment from China. I’m sorry your TEMU spending will be affected.
Are you not in favor of tariffs in general or only specific ones? Should we not tariff cheap Chinese goods that flood our market? Electric vehicles?
quote:
Trump, who is again seeking the Republican nomination for president in the 2024 election, has signaled that he would double down on stronger tariffs if elected, calling for a universal 10% tariff on all imports into the U.S. and revoking China's most-favored-nation trading status. That status, granted in 2001, allows China to receive the lowest World Trade Organization tariffs on many goods that are excluded from punitive tariffs.
Are you not in favor of tariffs in general or only specific ones? Should we not tariff cheap Chinese goods that flood our market? Electric vehicles?
Posted on 3/11/24 at 9:34 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
IHere is the way I see it. If the Chinese want to subsidize American consumers, frick yeah...I will take it every day.
Conservative hot take haha
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