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1
Posted on 3/12/25 at 8:49 pm to baldona
quote:
If you live like someone in 1975, 1985, or hell even 1995 it’s pretty damn cheap actually.
But this isn’t anywhere close to the truth when it comes to housing.
You can’t live like someone then because housing is so much more expensive.
This post was edited on 3/12/25 at 8:50 pm
Posted on 3/12/25 at 8:58 pm to BarberitosDawg
quote:Ours was 1980 and I believe it was $64,000. We got bond money at 11.5% (2 below prime for first time home buyer). I don't remember having a huge down payment like your 30%. No way we could have done that as we had been married only a year or so. Both had decent jobs not a lot in savings.
My first home after marriage in 1979 was a fixed 30 year at 13.4% interest 30% down.
Posted on 3/12/25 at 9:00 pm to Jdash13
quote:No I didn’t. I financed 120k. A 1400 mortgage was no joke in those days.
And you paid less than 80k for your house. Stop comparing apples and oranges
Posted on 3/12/25 at 9:02 pm to HubbaBubba
quote:
The problem is, people are not willing to start at the bottom and work their way up.
Nice try. They will just tell you that you don’t understand how bad things are now for those starting out. But you are 100% correct. We started in a 10x52 mobile home and alternated red beans and white beans most nights. Half a pound of beans with half a pound of sausage one night with half a pound of the other with half a pound of salt meat the next. And then rotated. For a treat we would make smothered potatoes with the cheapest beef I could find cut into tiny strips so it wouldn’t be too tough. Head of cabbage, one pound of ground meat and a can of green beans too. Eat on that shite for three nights. They don’t understand sacrifice and scraping by. They should be able to eat out twice a day and afford whatever they want. They should be able to have an SUV to carry the kids around. Not the single cab standard shift we drove with the car seat in the middle that the other would have to pull back to hit 4th gear.
25 years later, after lots of sacrifice, we worked our tails off and now live a very comfortable life and have progressed in our careers (both dropped out of college) to where we will be able to retire well before we make 60. Our current home is much like you described. And we STILL live our life based on what we need, and not necessarily on what we want. My truck is 14 years old with 300k miles. I could buy a new one tomorrow if I wanted and not even notice it as it relates to our expendable income. But there is no need. There is no want.
I have kids just starting out. And amazingly, they don’t seem to struggle like so many complain about. Maybe it’s because we taught them how to live based on needs. Not on wants.
Posted on 3/12/25 at 9:08 pm to HubbaBubba
quote:
Why would I be a loser that expects his pay to be the same 26 years later?
In 1975 I was earning about $3.25 an hour. LOL.
In 2001 I was earning $165k annually
I'm guessing they were referring to someone starting in that same place today, not you personally. That makes more sense imo.
Some stats for perspective, your starter wage is the equivalent to $18.65/hr today. If you were full time that's approx $39k per year. And the US median income is $39,982.
Take from that what you will but I do genuinely hope the median American can do better than a garage apartment
Posted on 3/12/25 at 9:59 pm to BarberitosDawg
quote:
This generation is going to have to learn to suffer and save. Not a new concept. My first home after marriage in 1979 was a fixed 30 year at 13.4% interest 30% down. We got through it small flat roof to save money on construction and small bedrooms on large lot compared to today. Suffering in an honest debt builds a family.
The median price of a home was roughly 2x the median income. Today, it’s 6.5x the median income.
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:10 pm to dgnx6
quote:
But this isn’t anywhere close to the truth when it comes to housing. You can’t live like someone then because housing is so much more expensive.
It’s incredibly sad how out of touch a lot of you guys are. I own rental homes, they are all in C+ if not B or B+ neighborhoods. None of them are worth more than $250,000.
Move out of Nola and some of the big cities, but there’s absolutely loads of homes under $300k in mid size cities like Pensacola, Mobile, Chattanooga, etc Just because they aren’t in wealthy areas doesn’t mean they are ghettos, get the frick out with this bullshite ghetto nonsense.
You guys are on Zillow and expecting everyone to be an engineer or business owner. 2 parent household that are working avg jobs like HVAC tech and admin assistant can easily afford a home today.
A brand new home? Probably not, but why is your median household buying a brand new up to date home?
ETA: oh and my post above about the E-4 and dental hygienist I’m guessing she makes $65k? Their home was a brand new home , $532k. Builder laid the 3% down btw. They put 0% down. He’s an E-4 with a wife and 2 kids, that military housing allowing ain’t too bad…
I never said it was smart. It’s dumb as hell. But my point was they have maybe 2 years of post hs training between them and are pulling in $130-150k and easily can buy a nice as hell house.
This post was edited on 3/12/25 at 10:15 pm
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:19 pm to baldona
The issue is you have to go where the jobs are. Yes, you can get cheaper houses out of big cities - no shite
But if you are an accountant, banker, lawyer, marketing, engineer etc you are limited in where you can live and hold a job. We are, for better or worse, a white collar country at this point. Decades of the feds offering loans to anyone with a pulse to go to college, along with Boomers telling their children its the only way they can get a leg up in the world
I think yall are over simplifying this - yes people need to have more moderate expectations of where they should be in life (if you are 25, 30, you should not expect to live in the same house as a 40 year old), but at the same time it is much harder for someone 25 today to start building wealth than it was for a 25 year old years ago.
Middle management jobs are on their way out, its a great job market for high performers but most of the workforce is not high performer - its a bell curve
People need to vote the commies out of their local offices, and let people build. Housing would be so much cheaper if developers didnt have to upcharge customers for the mandatory affordability units, and if zoning weren't so restrictive. Large property taxes dont help either
But if you are an accountant, banker, lawyer, marketing, engineer etc you are limited in where you can live and hold a job. We are, for better or worse, a white collar country at this point. Decades of the feds offering loans to anyone with a pulse to go to college, along with Boomers telling their children its the only way they can get a leg up in the world
I think yall are over simplifying this - yes people need to have more moderate expectations of where they should be in life (if you are 25, 30, you should not expect to live in the same house as a 40 year old), but at the same time it is much harder for someone 25 today to start building wealth than it was for a 25 year old years ago.
Middle management jobs are on their way out, its a great job market for high performers but most of the workforce is not high performer - its a bell curve
People need to vote the commies out of their local offices, and let people build. Housing would be so much cheaper if developers didnt have to upcharge customers for the mandatory affordability units, and if zoning weren't so restrictive. Large property taxes dont help either
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:25 pm to GeauxBurrow312
quote:
But if you are an accountant, banker, lawyer, marketing, engineer etc you are limited in where you can live and hold a job. We are, for better or worse, a white collar country at this point. Decades of the feds offering loans to anyone with a pulse to go to college, along with Boomers telling their children its the only way they can get a leg up in the world
No shite Sherlock, wow how ignorant are you?
You think these people are median income folks! lol, no!
Median household income is $80,000. Very very few of the above with 2 incomes whether that be roommates or a couple are making under that.
Come on, do better
This post was edited on 3/12/25 at 10:26 pm
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:28 pm to baldona
I have a low to mid level manager that works in my office in Destin, and she is making under $65,900. She is in the process of buying a brand new townhome for $355,000 in south Walton.
She is mid 20s. No college degree. Hard worker. Decently smart. No amazing future.
Again, the OP is full of shite.
She is mid 20s. No college degree. Hard worker. Decently smart. No amazing future.
Again, the OP is full of shite.
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:34 pm to baldona
You are not factoring in housing cost for the locations of those jobs. A decent 1 bed in Chicago will cost you $250k, a decent 1 bed in New York will cost you $670k
The majority of those jobs are in those mega cities. You can use glassdoor to look up city averages, people are not making that much relative to where they live.
Median for a software engineer in California is $160k, but thats take home of about 110k. Hardly living the good life in a place where the median 1 bed costs 1.2 million
The majority of those jobs are in those mega cities. You can use glassdoor to look up city averages, people are not making that much relative to where they live.
Median for a software engineer in California is $160k, but thats take home of about 110k. Hardly living the good life in a place where the median 1 bed costs 1.2 million
This post was edited on 3/12/25 at 10:35 pm
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:35 pm to RiverCityTider
I'm doing great, I don't care about the rest of you
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:44 pm to The Baker
quote:people like to cherry pick numbers in order to try to show that somehow it's horrible now and nobody loves numbers and statistics more than I do. But I'm also a fan of watching actions.
What you “went through” is not even close to what’s happening right now
Between 1960 and the year 2000 the homeownership rate fluctuated between 61 and 65%. Then it Rose a little bit and got as high as about 69% and right now it's hovering at about 65% again
This despite the fact that homes today are 50% larger and come with far more high-end amenities than anything between 1960 and 2000.
So everybody wants me to believe that somehow it's so much harder now but actual real economic activity seems to completely debunk the idea
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:47 pm to Fratigerguy
quote:
started in a 10x52 mobile home and alternated red beans and white beans most nights. Half a pound of beans with half a pound of sausage one night with half a pound of the other with half a pound of salt meat the next. And then rotated. For a treat we would make smothered potatoes with the cheapest beef I could find cut into tiny strips so it wouldn’t be too tough. Head of cabbage, one pound of ground meat and a can of green beans too. Eat on that shite for three nights. They don’t understand sacrifice and scraping by.
anecdotally, while i agree with you because i did a lot of the same, young people today understand that they could try to “sacrifice” …but also understand the reality that even doing all of this they still likely can’t afford a home (especially single or married single income) anytime soon
so they are increasingly saying “frick it, why even try?” and they are living life by eating out more, taking more trips, buying overpriced concert tickets, and engaging in riskier investments like crypto because why not? at worse they are still stuck renting forever anyway but at least they are having fun while young and not living in a trailer eating cabbage and green beans
it might be short sighted to us on outside looking in, but i also don’t really blame them for their choices either
This post was edited on 3/12/25 at 11:16 pm
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:48 pm to RiverCityTider
I should also point out that while median household income is certainly a good number to know in any economy it has its problems over time.
In 1980 more than 60% of households were headed by a married couple. Today that number is under 50%.
By definition this creates a reduction in household income even if salaries remained constant. Because a married couple in one household each making 75k has a household income of 150k. But if they're not married and they live in two different households suddenly that's two different households of 75k household income. Nothing changed except for the living Arrangement but the stat changes
In 1980 more than 60% of households were headed by a married couple. Today that number is under 50%.
By definition this creates a reduction in household income even if salaries remained constant. Because a married couple in one household each making 75k has a household income of 150k. But if they're not married and they live in two different households suddenly that's two different households of 75k household income. Nothing changed except for the living Arrangement but the stat changes
Posted on 3/12/25 at 10:59 pm to baldona
Good for her, but unless her parents or husband are helping out her thats going to be difficult for her.
Assuming she is putting 20% down, she is going to be paying around $2800 a month on that house including insurance/utilities
66k gross is about 54k take home before healthcare
That math doesnt add up
Assuming she is putting 20% down, she is going to be paying around $2800 a month on that house including insurance/utilities
66k gross is about 54k take home before healthcare
That math doesnt add up
Posted on 3/12/25 at 11:03 pm to RiverCityTider
Part of the reason is the average single family home size is much larger
In 1980 it was 1600 sqft.
Now its 2200
In 1980 it was 1600 sqft.
Now its 2200
Posted on 3/12/25 at 11:03 pm to HubbaBubba
quote:
problem is, nobody wants to start at #1 anymore
No...the real problem is #1 is barely attainable for a decent portion of the population. In most markets you aren't even getting a studio for under 1200
Posted on 3/12/25 at 11:07 pm to Loserman
quote:
In 1980 it was 1600 sqft.
Now its 2200
And that 1980 1600 ft house probably had cheap carpet or linoleum for flooring. There wasn't a granite counter in sight. And it had the cheapest flight fixtures they could lay their hands on. Today's median home on the other hand is not only bigger but almost certainly has hard floors in at least half of the house. And granite counters wherever counters exist to include bathrooms. Hell the number of home was with any form of air conditioning has more than doubled and the number with central air has almost tripled!
It's barely even reasonable to say that a 1980 home and a home today are the same product! It will be more accurate to say they are slightly related products that happen to have the same name
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