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Started By
Message
re: Rand will vote to BLOCK Trump ED on border funding.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:38 pm to Jjdoc
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:38 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
Nope. He is showing you his open boarder side.
That is part of the Libertarian platform.
Boy, you nailed it. Much of libertarianism is dangerous and irresponsible. Much is a bunch of self righteous smugness that refuses to admit how dangerous it is.
0
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:40 pm to boosiebadazz
quote:
Most honest folks can acknowledge this is not what the NEA was enacted for.
What are you basing that claim on?
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:41 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:And this is a realistic possibility, unless Congress gets off its arse and FIXES the botched abortion of a statute that is the NEA.
When the next Democrat announces a "Gun Emergency, Health Emergency and Climate Emergency" to institute socialist policy, I'll enjoy your reaction.
GOP gives the Dems the votes it needs to override THIS (upcoming) Trump veto, in exchange for a SERIOUS revision to the NEA.
This president and future Dem presidents are ALL precluded from violating the separation of powers.
Everyone wins.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:41 pm to boosiebadazz
quote:
used it as a naked power grab like Trump is doing right now.
What are you basing that claim on?
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:42 pm to RogerTheShrubber
An easier way to explain the stance is this. If Rands decision herre and this vote stopped Trump and also enacted rules to prevent this from being used by any President in the future, I’d stand with him.
But pretending, in the current state of the Democratic Party, that these “principled” and diversified opinions will somehow rub off on them is laughable.
But pretending, in the current state of the Democratic Party, that these “principled” and diversified opinions will somehow rub off on them is laughable.
This post was edited on 3/3/19 at 1:45 pm
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:43 pm to Dick Leverage
Presidential power is awesome when it's on our side, it sucks when the other fella is in office.
But people never learn the lessons, that too much power is a bad thing.
But people never learn the lessons, that too much power is a bad thing.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:43 pm to Loserman
quote:He and his dad would PROBABLY have tried to get better language to avoid abuse by a POTUS, but would have voted for the Act itself ... which was originally intended to LIMIT the non-statutory emergency powers that the Executive had claimed for itself over the preceding 50 years (since Wilson).
A bigger question is on how would he have voted when Congress granted the National Emergency declaration power?
The Pauls likely would have seen it as a small step in the right direction.
This post was edited on 3/3/19 at 2:20 pm
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:44 pm to bamarep
I hope he sleeps better at night knowing that is part of the reason illegal immigrants flood our country and steal jobs, steal benefits, and increase crime. They are a burden on our progress and should be treated as such.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:44 pm to bamarep
quote:And that's a good thing
This is why Rand will always be Rand.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:45 pm to AggieHank86
quote:Not a chance.
but would have voted for the Act itself ...
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:45 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
The "conservative" approach to the border is much more akin to Ronald Reagans position than Trumps. I would much rather see proper enforcement of actual laws we have than billions spent on a border
The issue with that is the sheer amount of people forcing themselves through the border. It's overwhelming the system.
Then you have the people on the left now offering billions to fight Reagan's attempt.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:45 pm to Caplewood
quote:Depends upon how you define that term.
Libertarians are ultimately pro open borders
We support the free flow of labor, but most of us are just fine with background checks and excluding them from governmental benefits, etcetera.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:46 pm to Chocolate Jesus
quote:Trump will veto. Sans 9 more votes, the Senate is powerless to stop it.
I hope he sleeps better at night knowing that is part of the reason illegal immigrants flood our country
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:46 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
Perhaps that there is no "emergency," as that term is used in the NEA
What are you basing that claim on?
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:47 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Why did he have to declare a national emergency?
It would appear to get military help to speed up the process.
quote:
Where's the money coming from?
From LawFare
How Congress and President Obama Made Trump’s Wall Possible
quote:
Throughout the 2016 election, Donald Trump campaigned for president on the promise that he would build a wall along the southern border. Six weeks after his election in November 2016, Congress overwhelmingly passed a statute—codified as 10 U.S.C § 284—that authorized the secretary of defense to support the “construction of roads and fences and installation of lighting to block drug smuggling corridors across international boundaries of the United States.” On Dec. 23, 2016, a month before leaving office, President Obama signed the 973-page bill into law without any objection to this provision.
It's a misconception here that he used a single NE in order to get funds. He did not. He took 3 separate actions.
quote:
Specifically, the president identified up to $2.5 billion under the Department of Defense funds that were designated for counterdrug activities. This provision does not turn on the declaration of a national emergency pursuant to 10 U.S.C. § 2808, which the president also invoked in a proclamation issued the same day.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:48 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
What's more important, safety of citizen, sovereignty of the country, laws, common sense
quote:
Said every burgeoning dictator ever.
Since Obama spoke about those very things he was, by your definition, a burgeoning dictator...
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:48 pm to themunch
quote:Do these people even LISTEN to themselves?quote:Not for this we do not. It is too important to leave a bumbling Congress to do this.
it needs to go through congress.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:48 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Presidential power is awesome when it's on our side, it sucks when the other fella is in office. But people never learn the lessons, that too much power is a bad thing.
Agreed. So leverage it now. They did. Break'em. Then once they realize the err of their ways, have the democratic house write legislation to limit from that point forward. The pass it on to Senate. THAT's how to play that game.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:49 pm to rds dc
quote:BINGO.
Congress has two options here. They can also vote to block future actions they don't agree with or they can pass legislation to restrict the President when it comes to future EDs. Unless they take action to do the second, then this is all just BS peacocking.
Posted on 3/3/19 at 1:50 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
AggieHank86
While Roger was not involved in the conversation, you were.
You know damn well there were 3 separate actions by Trump.
CONGRESS ALREADY SIGNED IT... OBAMA SIGNED IT
quote:
Why did he have to declare a national emergency?
It would appear to get military help to speed up the process.
quote:
Where's the money coming from?
From LawFare
How Congress and President Obama Made Trump’s Wall Possible
quote:
Throughout the 2016 election, Donald Trump campaigned for president on the promise that he would build a wall along the southern border. Six weeks after his election in November 2016, Congress overwhelmingly passed a statute—codified as 10 U.S.C § 284—that authorized the secretary of defense to support the “construction of roads and fences and installation of lighting to block drug smuggling corridors across international boundaries of the United States.” On Dec. 23, 2016, a month before leaving office, President Obama signed the 973-page bill into law without any objection to this provision.
It's a misconception here that he used a single NE in order to get funds. He did not. He took 3 separate actions.
quote:
Specifically, the president identified up to $2.5 billion under the Department of Defense funds that were designated for counterdrug activities. This provision does not turn on the declaration of a national emergency pursuant to 10 U.S.C. § 2808, which the president also invoked in a proclamation issued the same day.
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