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re: Peace in Ukraine ... an exercise in how it might look
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:47 pm to AggieHank86
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:47 pm to AggieHank86
Or, hear me out. Ukraine agrees to the current holdings and then does a JV with America for developing the rare earth metals in Ukraine thusly tying Ukraine’s future security with America’s economic interests. Sounds pretty solid doesn’t it?
0
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:48 pm to LSUFreek
quote:
NATO membership is a deal-breaker for Russia. We didn't want Russia in Cuba. Russia will not agree to NATO bases, specifically US troops with weapons in Urkraine.
This!!!!!
Agree Ukrains best move to stop war and save lives' is this mineral deal. The warhawks are pushing Zalinski in the other direction.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:52 pm to djsdawg
quote:Precisely.quote:There are no guarantees on that ....
A "peace deal" is only as good as it is enforceable. Without NATO membership (or something very much like it), what is the guarantee against future Russian aggression?
The current "offer" is (a) keep the stolen goods and (b) no guarantees of future safety. Basically, it gives Ukraine the choice of being gobbled up now, or being gobbled up at some future date of Russia's choosing.
Neither is a very palatable option.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:55 pm to AggieHank86
Fair enough. And yet, Zelensky was set up as the bad guy. It’s a damned shame.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:56 pm to LSUFreek
How about tossing a zelensky fark our way?
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:57 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
So, you are suggesting American Blue Helmets, without the helmets. Basically, American miners as a tripwire?
Yes, basically. There could be other peacekeeping elements involving Europe, but harming an unarmed American, indirectly or less likely directly, would be a FAFO moment that I don't think either would want to see. Everbody benefits if they both stick to peace agreement: no one dies, money is made, rebuilding begins, valuable minerals are acquired.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 12:59 pm to Jorts R Us
quote:
And that's enforced how?
That's on Russia and Ukraine to craft those terms. I'm sure they can name their incentive that would make it desirable to stop their expansion. Enforcement doesn't always include military action.
This post was edited on 3/3/25 at 12:59 pm
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:01 pm to LARancher1991
quote:
For one big reason majority of the minerals we want is still in Ukraine controlled territory.
This post was edited on 3/3/25 at 1:13 pm
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:05 pm to LSUFreek
quote:
We didn't want Russia in Cuba.
So what? They ended up there anyway. As a matter of fact, Cuba is STILL communist, while Russia is not.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:08 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
all parties agree that Russia keeps what it has stolen
But should Russia pay reparations to Ukraine?
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:14 pm to RolltidePA
quote:
That's on Russia and Ukraine to craft those terms. I'm sure they can name their incentive that would make it desirable to stop their expansion. Enforcement doesn't always include military action.
Sounds very unrealistic
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:15 pm to Harry Boutte
Russia will take what they want. I suspect they want odessa too. Russia will rebuild what they take. Ukraine will be a destroyed rump state. Does this look like what we did to libya? USaid at work again.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:21 pm to LARancher1991
Let the EU add Ukraine as a member if they are feeling froggy.
We immediately sign a deal that keeps us out of any Article 5 war if Ukraine is involved.
EU would have to put up or shut up.
We immediately sign a deal that keeps us out of any Article 5 war if Ukraine is involved.
EU would have to put up or shut up.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:22 pm to texas tortilla
quote:
Russia will take what they want
What kind of a "negotiation" produces that kind of result? The demand on Ukraine is to simply put down their arms and let Russia do what they want?
Is there anyone who really doesn't understand why any nation would not agree to these terms? Do we really expect Ukraine to just roll over?
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:24 pm to AggieHank86
Ukraine isn't a responsible state, especially under little Z, and NATO isn't in their foreseeable future. Sign the deal and deal with Russian aggression later if it happens.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:25 pm to Faurot fodder
quote:
If we get the frick out of NATO, I got no beefs with that.
A few things to point out...
-NATO has been taken over by globalists.
-Globalists are wanting to kick off a WW3. Even if it doesnt happen in Ukraine, they will try again elsewhere.
-They NEED the US to be involved for there to be a WW3.
-We need a clean break from them before they can pull us into a war.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:25 pm to AggieHank86
NATO membership is a non starter. If Ukraine joins over our denying it we should drop out of NATO and tell them to go nuts on each other then sit the whole thing out.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:26 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
What if all parties agree that Russia keeps what it has stolen, but Ukraine gets to join NATO as an Article V guarantee that Russia will not attempt to take another bite at the Ukrainian apple in the future?
So do more of the very thing that’s pissed Russia off for the last 30 years?
Question: would the US be fine with Mexico entering into a military alliance with China and China putting all kinds of military assets in MX?
No? Then why would Russia green light Ukraine being admitted to NATO? That’s a non-negotiable for Russia.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:29 pm to Harry Boutte
I think trump is trying to save as much of ukraine as he can. But, he has no cards.
Posted on 3/3/25 at 1:31 pm to AggieHank86
Z certainly was willing to have a cease fire 3 months into the war. Ukraine and Russia negotiated a ceasefire, Russia would keep the pro-Russian east and Ukraine would agree not to joint NATO.
The west came in and shut it down. Well now it might come to a similar deal after they have lost more territory and many many more lives, and Z is saying the end is far awy and he won't negotiate. Well then how does he plan on winning?
Russia has taken Georgia, pro-Russian Crimea, and now pro-Russian Eastern Ukraine. I'm not saying that is right, but if the US is in there mining, Russia won't go in. Z is stupid to not take this as the US interest is something that will provide security. Ukraine will not be in NATO anytime soon so he needs to take the next best thing.....US on the ground mining.
The west came in and shut it down. Well now it might come to a similar deal after they have lost more territory and many many more lives, and Z is saying the end is far awy and he won't negotiate. Well then how does he plan on winning?
Russia has taken Georgia, pro-Russian Crimea, and now pro-Russian Eastern Ukraine. I'm not saying that is right, but if the US is in there mining, Russia won't go in. Z is stupid to not take this as the US interest is something that will provide security. Ukraine will not be in NATO anytime soon so he needs to take the next best thing.....US on the ground mining.
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