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re: Nebraska: Women overwhelmed with joy and in tears, after abortion ban bill fails
Posted on 5/1/23 at 9:53 am to AggieHank86
Posted on 5/1/23 at 9:53 am to AggieHank86
quote:
BEcause it is the trait that separates us from plants and amoebas.
I thought we were meat sacks.
1
Posted on 5/1/23 at 9:54 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Yet we kill our young, they nurture them.
Plants and amoebas don’t nurture their young.
And you think the animal kingdom isn’t full of creatures that kill their offspring for various reasons?
Posted on 5/1/23 at 9:55 am to DavidTheGnome
quote:Well, his position is basically "My invisible friend says so." Not much discussion to be had on that point.
When one lacks an understanding or argument it seems this becomes the preferred debate style. Play 20 questions with the other person and keep asking question after question rather than stating anything and hopefully you’ll be able to find a hole and then "gotcha"!
Posted on 5/1/23 at 9:58 am to DavidTheGnome
quote:
And you think the animal kingdom isn’t full of creatures that kill their offspring for various reasons?
Exactly how many animal species kill their offspring BEFORE they are born ON PURPOSE... ZERO
Posted on 5/1/23 at 9:58 am to Flats
quote:Absent cognition, yes. Basically indistinguishable from any other meat sack on the planet.
I thought we were meat sacks.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:02 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Well, his position is basically "My invisible friend says so." Not much discussion to be had on that point.
Funny story. I don't believe in god. I haven't been to church in 20 years, and that was to get married. Our kids have never been to church.
If I named 100 people that we know, I would wager less than 10 go to church any more.
But I do know that 99% of those folks think abortion as a means of birth control is immoral.
It doesn't take an invisible deity to understand this.
It goes against nature. It is inhuman. The same women that celebrate murdering the unborn likely also protest chicken farms. So, you see where they place human life in their worldview.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:03 am to SOSFAN
quote:
Exactly how many animal species kill their offspring BEFORE they are born ON PURPOSE... ZERO
You don’t know that. I don’t either. I’m sure some biologists out there would know but alas, who cares? Or are you saying it’s somehow worse to do it in the womb before they finished forming into whatever creature we are discussing rather than after it finishes and is born? So somehow abortion at 10 weeks is worse than "aborting" a three year old?
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:04 am to AggieHank86
quote:I want to know where this "value" comes from. You think that humans with sapience should not be murdered but those without sapience are fair game to do to whatever we want. Right? Isn't "sapience" the determining factor for you whether or not human life has value and should be protected vs. destroyed?
Are you a Jain?
I just want to know what is special about sapience that objectively imbues humanity with value (and adds protection of life) compared to plants or amoebas.
This post was edited on 5/1/23 at 10:12 am
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:07 am to DavidTheGnome
quote:I don't need to play "20 questions". I'm asking questions to highlight the inconsistency in Hank's position. I'm not searching for a "hole"; the hole is already there in the arbitrary standard that he's using. I'm just trying to show him and others (mostly others, since he already knows his position is bad but sticks with it anyway) that his position holds no weight precisely because it is arbitrary, and therefore irrational.
When one lacks an understanding or argument it seems this becomes the preferred debate style. Play 20 questions with the other person and keep asking question after question rather than stating anything and hopefully you’ll be able to find a hole and then "gotcha"!
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:10 am to AggieHank86
quote:My position is that if you reject "my invisible friend", then you have no basis for objective moral reasoning, and therefore it is no more "immoral" to kill a sapient human being than one that lacks sapience. I'm trying to highlight that your arbitrary standard of sapience doesn't objectively confer value to humanity just because you have settled on that particular arbitrary line in the sand for your own shallow reasoning.
Well, his position is basically "My invisible friend says so." Not much discussion to be had on that point.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:10 am to FooManChoo
Without it what is it you’re worried about saving? Just because it’s human? Although in the case of an embryo not a fully formed human indeed with no consciousness or what you would call a soul?
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:11 am to DavidTheGnome
quote:
So somehow abortion at 10 weeks is worse than "aborting" a three year old?
Good so you agree that murdering a child, at any stage, is horrible.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:16 am to DavidTheGnome
quote:An "embryo" is a living human being. When we go down the path of picking and choosing which living human beings we can kill based on our whims and desires, we have no basis for condemning someone doing that to adult human beings in the name of population control, or a purified race of humans, as examples.
Without it what is it you’re worried about saving? Just because it’s human? Although in the case of an embryo not a fully formed human indeed with no consciousness or what you would call a soul?
Either living human beings have inherent value or they don't. I believe they do because they are made in the image of God, and He is the one that imbues humanity with value (we cannot lawfully destroy what belongs to Him, ultimately, without His permission), therefore we cannot arbitrarily pick and choose which human lives we want to take. And if we reject the notion that there is a God who grants value, then there is no objective value to human life, and we can decide what value (or no value) we want to give to any human at any stage of development or age that we want, including killing 3 year-olds who annoy us or take up too much of our resources, or adults that don't think like we do, look like we do, or act like we do in any way we want.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:17 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Absent cognition, yes. Basically indistinguishable from any other meat sack on the planet.
What's special about cognition? Rats are cognizant.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:18 am to tigerbait3488
quote:
Not a good looking woman in the group
It’s always seems, at least with the public abortion protest/celebration groups, that abortion wouldn’t be much of a concern with them because they’re so ugly and undesirable.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:30 am to burger bearcat
I wish I could tell her that once she gets pregnant and is responsible for the life conceived inside her and her rights are not the most important issue. Obviously, the rights of the innocent child supersedes any rights the female claims.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:36 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Basically indistinguishable from any other meat sack on the planet.
Except we kill ours before they have a chance at life outside the womb.
The future war will between people with human emotion and intuition vs you people.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:48 am to FooManChoo
quote:
I don't need to play "20 questions". I'm asking questions to highlight the inconsistency in Hank's position. I'm not searching for a "hole";
Ok
quote:
the hole is already there in the arbitrary standard that he's using. I'm just trying to show him and others (mostly others, since he already knows his position is bad but sticks with it anyway) that his position holds no weight precisely because it is arbitrary, and therefore irrational.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:51 am to FooManChoo
quote:
An "embryo" is a living human being.
Except it’s not. Not fully. There’s no consciousness and while developing into a full fledged person it’s not there yet.
Posted on 5/1/23 at 10:53 am to SOSFAN
quote:
Exactly how many animal species kill their offspring BEFORE they are born ON PURPOSE... ZERO
And that's worse than killing offspring while they're actually out of the womb?
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