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re: Left-Wing News Hired Hitman Charged W/ 2nd Degree Murder Of Patriot

Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:36 am to
Posted by Tiguar
Montana
Member since Mar 2012
33131 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:36 am to
just as it's worth mentioning that Keltner's strike was to the head, it's also worth mentioning it was an open palm strike.

Again, you do not get to draw and shoot someone for smacking you upside the face. As I've stated earlier, jail cells are full of people who got in a fist fight and ended up shooting the other person. This wasn't even a "fight".
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:37 am to
And this is why I want to see the complete footage. I haven't seen what happened just prior to Dolloff putting his hands up.

Keltner's actions and any possible cause for that will be important.

I can speculate, but that wouldn't be useful.
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
139071 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:37 am to
quote:

And he didn't slap him away. He struck him in the side of the head.
Semantics.
Keltner bitchslapped him with an open-hand. It appeared to be a disengagement maneuver with Keltner immediately retreating backwards.

It is certainly the kind of move one would execute to thwart a disarming effort. But who knows.
Posted by Wolfhound45
Member since Nov 2009
127401 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:38 am to
quote:

I've seen a lot of that information, but I don't think any prosecutor would want to touch it.
This thread is a treasure trove. It is not hard to show that Newman and Dolloff were following Keltner after they left the Patriot Muster.

Richardson sealed her own fate as the trailed Elliot taking pictures of him in altercation after altercation.

And the interview that Elliot gave to 9News where (at the conclusion) he says Keltner attacked "our company" and says he worked security is very telling (which is on his LinkedIn).

This whole thing is going to come apart at the seams.
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
128849 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:39 am to
quote:

I would think that it would take more than boredom to cause that.


Being alone isn’t boredom. Losing the person who desired you and was your life partner can throw people into the void. Many of the protesters are people who are clinically depressed and they’re self-medicating by being righteously angry at something or someone.
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:40 am to
quote:

Semantics.


The difference between an aggressive strike and a defensive slap are not semantics in a self-defense claim.
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:41 am to
quote:

It is not hard to show that Newman and Dolloff were following Keltner after they left the Patriot Muster.


The defense will claim that Newman was looking for a story and Dolloff was doing his job.

If it was an easy win, I think we'd be looking at 1st degree.
Posted by Wolfhound45
Member since Nov 2009
127401 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:42 am to
quote:

And this is why I want to see the complete footage.
You won't until the trial. There are gaps in the pictures taken by Helen Richardson (who was taking pictures of the four altercations that Jeremiah Elliot was involved in). That will only be revealed when the Denver Police release the HALO footage.

Here is a compilation of the pictures from Helen Richardson;



See the gap from transition of waist band draw and actually being leveled for aiming and fired? Missing.
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
128849 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:44 am to
Blah blah.

His slap/aggressive strike isn’t going to come close to the definition of “great bodily harm.”
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:46 am to
It doesn't need to.

This didn't happen in a vacuum and it won't be tried in a vacuum.
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
128849 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:46 am to
It does need to.
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:47 am to
I've seen that. Obviously suspicious.

It seems to show a pretty clear picture for a conviction.
Posted by Tiguar
Montana
Member since Mar 2012
33131 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:48 am to
quote:

The difference between an aggressive strike and a defensive slap are not semantics in a self-defense claim.



It kind of is when deadly force was utilized on someone 10 feet away. We aren't arguing whether or not Dolloff was justified in hitting him upside the head with a bat or shooting him after Keltner slapped him and stayed in his face.
This post was edited on 10/16/20 at 11:50 am
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:48 am to
No, it doesn't.
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
44345 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:48 am to
quote:

This was no random event DB. It was a set up.
I do not see ANY reasonable person arguing with the notion that Dolloff/Newman were (at a minimum) shadowing BGM in hopes of getting some juicy footage. I do not think it is unreasonable to posit that they acted in concert WITH BGM to CREATE a juicy confrontation, but we do not yet have objective facts to establish that to be accurate.

But it is a HUGE jump in logic from "hoping for or even orchestrating a confrontation between others" to "affirmative intent for Dolloff to kill someone." That is why the DA did not pursue 1st Degree.

The problem with which so many are struggling is the need to separate THAT from the question of whether Dolloff reacted reasonably in (a) stepping between Keltner and Newman to prevent an altercation, (b) drawing his weapon after he was assaulted by Keltner, and (c) firing his weapon when he saw Keltner raising and aiming a weapon of his own. All in 2-3 seconds.

Many also seem to be ignoring (d) the jury pool and (e) the burden of proof.
Posted by Lightning
Texas
Member since May 2014
3118 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:49 am to
The woman in the pics has a 2015 testimony of her Christian faith and baptism on the web. I don't want to link it because I have no idea of her current relationship or lack thereof with Doloff.

May mean nothing but my experience with Occupy/Antifa/Far Left activists is that they are usually not big on organized religion. Could have been a pairing of two people with opposite beliefs, could be that one or both of them have different beliefs than they did a few years ago. I'm noting it here because I did think his pictures with her look very different than recent pictures of him.
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:50 am to
It kind of isn't when the claim is self-defense against an aggressive individual.

The defense will absolutely use this, and few are going to consider it a negligible distinction when it's brought up repeatedly.
Posted by Tiguar
Montana
Member since Mar 2012
33131 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:51 am to
It doesnt matter if the slap was aggressive if they are no longer a threat after the slap.

Again, you don't get to shoot someone for slapping you upside the head on the street and backing up telling you "do something, pussy"
Posted by Toomer Deplorable
Team Bitter Clinger
Member since May 2020
24857 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:52 am to
quote:

quote:
Michelle Malkin
@michellemalkin
Replying to
@michellemalkin
Just wow. @9news put #denvershooting instigator Jeremiah Elliott on its airwaves tonight so he could pimp his Antifa-supported @gofundme, allowed him to evade q's about his interactions w/media last Saturday & painted him as the victim.


What a random coincidence that 9News and it’s hired muscle were following around BGM all day.....




https://twitter.com/coangelaramirez/status/1317112674195361792
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 10/16/20 at 11:52 am to
quote:

It doesnt matter if the slap was aggressive if they are no longer a threat after the slap.


Sure, if we assume the defense puts forward the argument that he was no longer a threat after he hit Dolloff.
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