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Posted on 11/23/25 at 1:44 pm to Auburn1968
quote:
So a country that is 1/4 the population size of Russia is a strategic threat?
Russians can be paranoia crazed. Tell him there is a monster under his bed.
I mean, they are now....
Now that the Russians have gone and turned them into blood enemies for a century, the dummies.....
Posted on 11/23/25 at 1:53 pm to CitizenK
Russia really is running out of tanks
Posted on 11/23/25 at 2:19 pm to Leopold
quote:
quote:
So a country that is 1/4 the population size of Russia is a strategic threat?
Russians can be paranoia crazed. Tell him there is a monster under his bed.
I mean, they are now....
Now that the Russians have gone and turned them into blood enemies for a century, the dummies.....
Stalin already achieved turning Ukrainians into blood enemies when he liquidated and starved millions of them. That was in the 1930's so it is still in living family memory.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 2:53 pm to Auburn1968
quote:
quote:
Zhuravlyov argued that Washington’s objective was to preserve Ukraine as a permanent strategic threat to Russia.
So a country that is 1/4 the population size of Russia is a strategic threat?
Russians can be paranoia crazed. Tell him there is a monster under his bed.
China believes the U.S. uses South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, the Philippines, Malaysia, and even Vietnam as strategic threats to "contain" them.
Dictators are crazy... plus, they need an enemy and a threat or the con on their own people doesn't work.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 4:21 pm to Auburn1968
quote:
So a country that is 1/4 the population size of Russia is a strategic threat?
I mean you've got people here saying Ukraine is this massive strategic interest to the US
Posted on 11/23/25 at 4:30 pm to VolSquatch
quote:
I mean you've got people here saying Ukraine is this massive strategic interest to the US
They gave up their nukes based on our promise to guarantee their independence. It's not a good look to renege on such momentous promises.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 4:33 pm to Auburn1968
quote:
They gave up their nukes based on our promise to guarantee their independence. It's not a good look to renege on such momentous promises.
I understand that part, but not really what I'm talking about.
Multiple posters have gone on record saying how important Ukraine is strategically. To me it's obviously not. Obama actually publicly said it wasn't.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 4:55 pm to Auburn1968
Posted on 11/23/25 at 5:14 pm to VolSquatch
quote:
Obama actually publicly said it wasn't.
Obama needed Putin's cooperation for his Iran nuclear deal.
Behind the scenes, Obama had the Pentagon begin restructuring the Ukrainian Special Forces and military and had the CIA start restructuring the Ukrainian intelligence agencies. That's a big reason why they were ready when Russia invaded.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 5:19 pm to Lee B
Barack Obama's Response to Crimea was MUCH Stronger Than You Think
When examined fully, President Obama sent lethal weapons to Ukraine, oversaw Ukrainian mass mobilization, and provided NATO training for the Ukrainian Army to not collapse in 2022.
His style was not to be a blustery blowhard giving away every move.
When examined fully, President Obama sent lethal weapons to Ukraine, oversaw Ukrainian mass mobilization, and provided NATO training for the Ukrainian Army to not collapse in 2022.
His style was not to be a blustery blowhard giving away every move.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 6:35 pm to Lee B
President Trump's message two months ago:
The irony is that he said that patience was needed, and then he got tricked by Witkoff and Vance into demanding that Ukraine sign a Russian-created deal within a week.
Well, now they have a deal. Zelensky and company were smart enough to know that it doesn't really matter what's on this paper that was just agreed to.
What will now happen is that Russia will completely refuse to stop fighting, they will insist on retaking all of the Donbas, and Trump will look like a chump again, and he'll get mad at Russia and up the sanctions and maybe give Ukraine some Tomahawk missiles.
Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here. The irony is that he said that patience was needed, and then he got tricked by Witkoff and Vance into demanding that Ukraine sign a Russian-created deal within a week.
Well, now they have a deal. Zelensky and company were smart enough to know that it doesn't really matter what's on this paper that was just agreed to.
What will now happen is that Russia will completely refuse to stop fighting, they will insist on retaking all of the Donbas, and Trump will look like a chump again, and he'll get mad at Russia and up the sanctions and maybe give Ukraine some Tomahawk missiles.
This post was edited on 11/23/25 at 6:38 pm
Posted on 11/23/25 at 6:36 pm to GOP_Tiger
Posted on 11/23/25 at 7:23 pm to Lee B
quote:
China believes the U.S. uses South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, the Philippines, Malaysia, and even Vietnam as strategic threats to "contain" them
Ever heard of the 'containment' strategy?
That's exactly what we're doing, and I'm all for it.
This post was edited on 11/23/25 at 7:24 pm
Posted on 11/23/25 at 7:33 pm to VolSquatch
quote:
I mean you've got people here saying Ukraine is this massive strategic interest to the US
It's enough of one that we've dumped tens of billions of dollars in aid over the past decade or so, some of it even before the invasion. It's enough of one that the damned CIA decided to do some sort of dicey sh!t there over the years.
But understand the distinction that's being made.
We - as in NATO - see Ukraine as a way to block Russian expansion to the West, 'cause, ya know, we were always a little worried about the Russians and what we have largely known to be a murderous, psychotic dictator's plan to pick a fight. We didn't want there to be one, but you never know when they decide to try to take over half of Europe for no reason at all...
But the Russians are worred about the same thing in some ways. The US and NATO doesn't have a very good track record when it comes to staying out of others business, especially when it comes to countries with large natural resources reserves *cough* oil *cough*, so they have their own reasons to see the Ukraine as an 'unreliable partner.'
So, yeah, I've said they are a massive strategic interest, especially in 2025.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 8:00 pm to Leopold
Jake Bro, as usual, has an inciteful take on what's going on with the 'peace plan': This includes:
-The $100,000,000,000 bribe for America that will be in run by Donald Trump.
- The 'Treaty' takes away certain countries abilities to station American jets in countries not named Ukraine, such as Poland. The treaty is an open attempt to weaken certain countries around Russia so that they will have a harder time trying to defend themselves from Russia in a couple of years, something that Poland will never abide by due to their own desire to survive.
- The treaty attempts to force Europe to hand over not only the frozen assets, something that will never happen, but to send another $100B to Russian coffers, something else that will never happen.
- The Russians are probably attempting to force the Ukrainians to sign this treaty in a week because the Russians are genuinely desperate with the Russian winter less than a month away.
-The $100,000,000,000 bribe for America that will be in run by Donald Trump.
- The 'Treaty' takes away certain countries abilities to station American jets in countries not named Ukraine, such as Poland. The treaty is an open attempt to weaken certain countries around Russia so that they will have a harder time trying to defend themselves from Russia in a couple of years, something that Poland will never abide by due to their own desire to survive.
- The treaty attempts to force Europe to hand over not only the frozen assets, something that will never happen, but to send another $100B to Russian coffers, something else that will never happen.
- The Russians are probably attempting to force the Ukrainians to sign this treaty in a week because the Russians are genuinely desperate with the Russian winter less than a month away.
Posted on 11/23/25 at 9:21 pm to Leopold
quote:
defend themselves from Russia in a couple of years
quote:
Russians are genuinely desperate with the Russian winter less than a month away
Yet in a mere couple of years Russia will be ready to take on NATO?
Posted on 11/24/25 at 12:12 am to DMAN1968
Here's the (current) European counter plan. The Russians have basically already rejected it by making more untenable demands but these basic points won't go away.
To repeat, Putin has the tiger by the tail with this war and will not survive any resolution other than complete Ukrainian capitulation. If we always keep this fact in mind, the Russian 'negotiations' get simple.
Here's the problem:
1.) Russia will never accept a Western military presence in Ukraine; and
2.) there is no security for Ukraine without a large Western military presence in Ukraine.
So we're going to be here for awhile longer...
Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here. To repeat, Putin has the tiger by the tail with this war and will not survive any resolution other than complete Ukrainian capitulation. If we always keep this fact in mind, the Russian 'negotiations' get simple.
Here's the problem:
1.) Russia will never accept a Western military presence in Ukraine; and
2.) there is no security for Ukraine without a large Western military presence in Ukraine.
So we're going to be here for awhile longer...
This post was edited on 11/24/25 at 4:48 am
Posted on 11/24/25 at 12:14 am to Coeur du Tigre
Posted on 11/24/25 at 12:37 am to Coeur du Tigre
quote:
Ukraine NATO membership up to NATO
Well...we know Europe isn't serious about ending this war.
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