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re: Last night I told my father-in-law that he is basically an idiot for encouraging boosters

Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:17 am to
Posted by LemmyLives
Texas
Member since Mar 2019
12807 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:17 am to
quote:

she didn't care if the stuff she posted was false as long as it supported her view on a given subject.


She said the quiet part out loud.
Posted by La Place Mike
West Florida Republic
Member since Jan 2004
30850 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:20 am to
quote:

For you older men on here, stop being a creature of habit, and be a creature of cognition and critical thinking.



Okay so now I should advocate for the Vax?
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
134962 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:21 am to
quote:

he is basically an idiot for encouraging boosters...for our family.

...he refuses to listen to the counter-arguments/facts
Far be it for someone on a message board to give you family advice, but there may be a better approach.

Simply address the fact that ANY medical intervention, including vaccination, carries attendant risk. So the benefit needs to substantially exceed risk.

In the case of the boosters, the benefit is questionable. There is some benefit, but it's limited, and even more limited for young healthy individuals.

Through November CV19 boosters targeted Omicron (BA.1) along with original CV19 strains. But by the time the booster hit the public, the predominant circulating strain was no longer BA.1 (or BA.2 or BA.3). The predominant circulating strains were BA.4/BA.5. The 'new' BA.1 booster was fairly ineffective vs those.

But wait!
This month, a BA.4/BA.5 booster finally came available!
Great news, right?
Nope.

AS did BA.1, BA.4/BA.5 ran their course, are nearly gone, and have given way to new BQ strains.

Far and away the most prevalent CV19 strains (~85%) now are BQ.1/BQ.1.1.

It remains to be seen if the "new" (but already outdated) Dec2022 booster will be effective at all vs currently circulating CV19. The BA.1 booster your FIL was likely referring to, barely touches the BQ.x strains.

Perhaps rather than refer to the guy as an 'idiot,' just ask if he's aware of vax ineffectiveness vs current CV19 strains, and ask if he's aware of standard (rare but existent) vaccination risks such as Guillain-Barré.
Posted by JJJimmyJimJames
Southern States
Member since May 2020
18496 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:30 am to
quote:

He's probably listening to his doctor, which is what everyone should do. What counter arguments did you offer him?

doctors are FAR from sacrosanct.

My last doctor chose to move ME to a new associate of his because the nurses of his were not able to operate or read a sphygmomanometer correctly. They read it, I told them it was inaccurate. They read it again and it was down 20 points. I told them again it was still inaccurate. His first reaction was to prescribe a second BP prescription for me to take and to come in in two weeks.

I told him that I was quite positive my blood pressure was steps lower than his reading. I believe his triage nurse was using a cuff that was too small.

I didnt take the scrip - after two weeks I came in - THEY HAD NEW CUFFS (I hadnt told them about them) - BP was fine - he said the medicine worked... I told him I hadnt even gotten it filled.

New doc (!!!!) did the same thing - reading suspect (by me again); took it again and BP was as I said. marvelous!

Doctors are far from the reliable wonderful health all stars they (and most people) think they are. If you are reasonable you can do great health improvements on your own. Use the good doctors - know yourself and your health.. do the right thing if you dig and find they won't

The problem is that doctors learn THE DOGMA of DOCTORING of the years from which they were trained. Some of those periods also taught cold separation from aspects of the patient.
Posted by VolcanicTiger
Member since Apr 2022
5933 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:38 am to
quote:

The problem is that doctors learn THE DOGMA of DOCTORING of the years from which they were trained. Some of those periods also taught cold separation from aspects of the patient.

Being a doctor used to be more like being a chef. Now it's more like being a line cook following the standard recipe.

They aren't hired by the patients, they're hired by private equity or other non-doctors who make decisions based on economics and not on science. Oh, they open the valves and let some science seep in from time to time, but this is what happens when you have businessmen sniffing out where the high profit margins are and inserting themselves into the stream and polluting everything downstream.
This post was edited on 12/29/22 at 10:47 am
Posted by hayden7cub
Mississippi
Member since Mar 2019
386 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:38 am to
Let him know about my father, who had no cardiac issues. He got the booster last year on the Tuesday before Thanksgiving and had a massive heart attack on that Friday and died.

No F-ing way I’d be pushing that concept.
Posted by TGFN57
Telluride
Member since Jan 2010
6975 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:40 am to
All of us old folks will just roll with not being stupid.
Posted by Rohan Gravy
New Orleans
Member since Jan 2017
20275 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:49 am to
quote:

I'm generally talking about retirees - age 65 or older.



Maybe you should reevaluate your own thinking.


Or evaluate for the first time.
Posted by JJJimmyJimJames
Southern States
Member since May 2020
18496 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 10:54 am to
quote:

Maybe you should reevaluate your own thinking.

Or evaluate for the first time.
so you are suggesting that younger people get their first clue?

hmm... I agree.
Posted by LSUA 75
Colfax,La.
Member since Jan 2019
4616 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 11:42 am to
I was 70 when the “vaccine” came out and never even considered taking it.My rationale: 1) mandates didn’t apply to Congress and that made me suspicious,
2) I knew about Pfizer and Bextra,didn’t trust them,
3)was a nurse for 35 years and learned not to trust anything new that the medical world came up with.

I generally tried to avoid vax conversations,I never asked anyone if they were vaxxed.But they would ask me and when I told them no,it was on.I would reiterate to them that they certainly fit the criteria as espoused by Dr. Robert Malone so they should take it.
Didn’t satisfy most of them,they would get pissed that they couldn’t talk me into it. Really caused some strained relationships and they really got pissed when they got Covid anyway despite being vaxxed and boosted.

Thing about people in my age group is they have great faith in the medical field and Drs.Also tend to trust MSM and would lap up all the fear porn and the propaganda that ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine were poison.

Even some older Drs.fell for it,2 Drs.I knew and respected that were retired were aghast that I wouldn’t take the vax.

Posted by the_truman_shitshow
Member since Aug 2021
2759 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 11:48 am to
quote:

VolcanicTiger


Knowing all of this is true, how does one coexist with the jadedness that comes with knowing?
Posted by LSUA 75
Colfax,La.
Member since Jan 2019
4616 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 11:56 am to
Virology and epidemiology..

I have been doing quite a bit of reading about viruses.It is mind boggling to me how complicated all that is.
People like Dr. Robert Malone and Geert Vanden Bossche have pHD’s in this,I can’t imagine.
Posted by VolcanicTiger
Member since Apr 2022
5933 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 12:58 pm to
quote:

Knowing all of this is true, how does one coexist with the jadedness that comes with knowing?
For me I just wave my degree in Microbiology in their face. I know it's not a big deal, but it's enough to derail their logic. The truth is that I have a few theories about life in general, one being that the more of an expert one is, the less inclined they are to be honest. Climate change experts cannot be trusted because they're invested in proving climate change, not disproving it.

tl;dr - You can't trust experts to be honest, and you can't trust honest people to be experts.

Even if an expert is being honest, you cannot distinguish them from the liars. Everyone has bias, so all you can do is be patient with people or ditch them.
Posted by bird35
Georgia
Member since Sep 2012
13387 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 1:03 pm to
From what Doctors can tell from the “Science and Data” they are allowed to see the age where the vaccine and boosters are do more good than harm is 65 years old and older.

Sounds like your FIL should take his vaccine and you and your kids should avoid it.

This opinion comes from Dr. Drew Pinsky’s podcast.



Posted by oogabooga68
Member since Nov 2018
27194 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 1:07 pm to
quote:

I have a few theories about life in general, one being that the more of an expert one is, the less inclined they are to be honest.


Thank you for saying this.

I've argued til I'm blue in the face that in regards to Covid, we aren't arguing with the Covidians EXPERTISE, rather their HONESTY.

When confronted with concerns about these Vaccines, the Covidians will often engage in some word-salad/TechnicalMedical bullshite in an effort to derail any questioning of their "unquestionable" opinions.

These Medical Professionals are going out of their way to destroy the credibility of the Medical Profession.
Posted by Liberator
Revelation 20:10-12
Member since Jul 2020
9071 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 2:22 pm to
quote:

Knowing all of this is true, how does one coexist with the jadedness that comes with knowing?


All cynicism is 100% justified. Big Goob and Big Med-Pharm traumatized the world into playing Russian Roulette.

We're long past the quaint days of automatically trusting our MD and "healthcare" system. Previous presumptions and assumptions are all out the window (for nearly every past "trusted" institution.)

Due diligence, personal research and knowledge is now a requisite responsibility. (You can't help those who refuse your wisdom and knowledge. Been there, done that as well, my friend.)
Posted by Liberator
Revelation 20:10-12
Member since Jul 2020
9071 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 2:29 pm to
quote:

Oh, they [docs] open the valves and let some science seep in from time to time, but this is what happens when you have businessmen sniffing out where the high profit margins are and inserting themselves into the stream and polluting everything downstream.


Nice up and in smoke.

I've noticed Dentists have also begun shooting for the "high profit-margin" cha-cha as well. Beware.

Posted by LSU82BILL
Fort Lauderdale, FL
Member since Sep 2006
10829 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 2:34 pm to
Maybe instead of calling him a name, you should have just said something to him politely while reminding him that you are a world reknown epidemiologist?
Posted by the_truman_shitshow
Member since Aug 2021
2759 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 2:38 pm to
quote:

you are a world reknown epidemiologist


Never claimed to be one chief.
Posted by tigerbaiter
Member since Dec 2006
616 posts
Posted on 12/29/22 at 2:41 pm to
If he's been a good pediatrician otherwise, I would just ignore that particular bit of advice. if he pushes the issue, I'd find another pediatrician.
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