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Message
re: How Finland built the best education system in the world
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:52 am to Bench McElroy
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:52 am to Bench McElroy
Finland has some pretty wild ancient history. They also have some pretty interesting isolated genetics.
0
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:52 am to Bench McElroy
Vocational track
Or
Academic Track
We need this. Our 'everybody should go to college' attitude is silly.
Or
Academic Track
We need this. Our 'everybody should go to college' attitude is silly.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:53 am to Bench McElroy
Most of our students have never even heard of Finland.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:54 am to CoachChappy
quote:
There are; however, there is no denying that homogeneous societies get to have all kinds of cool shite.
Trust me, I'm not denying this. But I'll wish in one hand and shite in the other.
quote:
however, we are trending toward this style of education. Slowly, we are moving back away from the college for everyone approach.
I sure hope so. When I was running the farm, I tried to talk to local schools to see if I could get interested students to come by and learn if they had an interest in agriculture, biology, or ecology, but they turned me down.
We really need more apprenticeships.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:55 am to TrueTiger
quote:
Vocational track
Or
Academic Track
We are implementing this in Louisiana now, but we wait until junior year for the split to happen. IMO it could happen as early as 5th grade
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:56 am to HempHead
quote:
I am in complete agreement AM but I'm pretty sure it's the Prussian model.
Correct. I edited.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:57 am to therick711
quote:
Finland's plan: Outsource all national security functions to the US, use their money only on education.
It's not a money thing. There is no lack of finances in the U.S. public education system.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 10:58 am to Antonio Moss
I would love to see the test scores of first and second generation Fins who were educated in America.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:00 am to bird35
quote:
I would love to see the test scores of first and second generation Fins who were educated in America.
Ironically, there is very little standardized testing in Finland. Standardized testing is an incredibly poor method for evaluating an education system.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:02 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
It's not a money thing. There is no lack of finances in the U.S. public education system.
Nor in our healthcare. Almost like there is a systemic/organizational/distributive problem rather than a fiduciary one.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:03 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
Ironically, there is very little standardized testing in Finland
If any. Many other countries do not even give their children tests in the classroom until 5th grade or later. They check for understanding inside the regular classroom and document it. It's more of a portfolio of work than a bunch of tests. This places less stress on the students where they can focus on learning instead of passing a series of tests.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:05 am to goldennugget
quote:
The entire nation mostly being one race cant hurt
Yes, the US should never look to western Europe for a model. They're welfare state supremes, but it's a lot easier with a population less than 6 million for the entire country.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:08 am to Bjorn Cyborg
Probably not much different. I know plenty of white trash that does just as bad as minorities in school.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:08 am to HempHead
Education in America sucks for a plethora of reasons. I think for starters, teaching isn't looked upon as a very favorable career path. Teachers don't make much money and aren't well respected outside of their own profession. I think just browsing this board gives you a general idea of the attitude people have towards school teachers.
Teachers are seen as incompetent, lazy, and whiny. They have no support from society at large who usually just look at their vacation days and say, "you get 2 weeks vacation for Christmas, shut up!" They cannot discipline children because mom and dad cannot possibly believe little Johnny is a trouble maker and it must be the mean teacher being unfair.
The best and brightest among us do not want to grow up to be teachers. Teaching is what you go into if you're comfortable living on a middle class wage with plenty of free vacation time.
This does attract people to the profession who really have no business being a teacher. Anyone with a hint of public speaking ability can stand up in front of a classroom of kids and give a lecture, but it takes skill to promote learning and to take command of a classroom. Instead, you have teachers falling into a very familiar routine of speaking for an hour, assigning homework, then checking the home work the next day. Then that is actually an example of a teacher at least putting in some effort. For a wide variety of reasons, you also end up a lot of the time just watching movies or busy work because the teacher either doesn't know the subject enough to teach it or doesn't care enough.
The government continues to pass regulation and judge teacher expertise on the results of standardized test scores despite the people making these laws having little to no experience teaching school and no knowledge on how to effectively educate children.
Common Core was not a bad idea per say, but it was a poorly planned rush job that needs serious revision because it is not working as intended.
We should look at countries like Finland and totally re-evaluate how we approach education in this country. Unlike what that article seems to indicate, I do not believe we should run from technology. SmartBoards and such are great learning tools, and we should look for new ways to incorporate technology into teaching. Tablets, Smart Phones, Youtube, social networks, etc are great teaching tools that are underutilized.
Teachers are seen as incompetent, lazy, and whiny. They have no support from society at large who usually just look at their vacation days and say, "you get 2 weeks vacation for Christmas, shut up!" They cannot discipline children because mom and dad cannot possibly believe little Johnny is a trouble maker and it must be the mean teacher being unfair.
The best and brightest among us do not want to grow up to be teachers. Teaching is what you go into if you're comfortable living on a middle class wage with plenty of free vacation time.
This does attract people to the profession who really have no business being a teacher. Anyone with a hint of public speaking ability can stand up in front of a classroom of kids and give a lecture, but it takes skill to promote learning and to take command of a classroom. Instead, you have teachers falling into a very familiar routine of speaking for an hour, assigning homework, then checking the home work the next day. Then that is actually an example of a teacher at least putting in some effort. For a wide variety of reasons, you also end up a lot of the time just watching movies or busy work because the teacher either doesn't know the subject enough to teach it or doesn't care enough.
The government continues to pass regulation and judge teacher expertise on the results of standardized test scores despite the people making these laws having little to no experience teaching school and no knowledge on how to effectively educate children.
Common Core was not a bad idea per say, but it was a poorly planned rush job that needs serious revision because it is not working as intended.
We should look at countries like Finland and totally re-evaluate how we approach education in this country. Unlike what that article seems to indicate, I do not believe we should run from technology. SmartBoards and such are great learning tools, and we should look for new ways to incorporate technology into teaching. Tablets, Smart Phones, Youtube, social networks, etc are great teaching tools that are underutilized.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:10 am to Bench McElroy
Tell me how much Finland spends on education per-pupil, then explain me why we should be spending more. Especially in early education which the fins just don't even bother with.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:11 am to BulldogXero
The biggest problem with the US educational system is that we just throw money at it. More money is spent on the kids in special ed and that are at risk than the everyday normal student. It's a joke and one of the reasons I got out of teaching.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:12 am to Bench McElroy
What % of Finnish society contributes positive tax amounts to the government?
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:13 am to therick711
quote:
Finland's plan: Outsource all national security functions to the US, use their money only on education.
Been saying that for years.....
All these countries that are touted as being advanced on multiple fronts are able to heavily invest on infrastructure, etc with the savings from their somewhat nonexistent defense budgets
How much have they saved on our backs?
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:17 am to thejudge
I love to bash Europe as much as the next guy, but Finland isn't in NATO.
Posted on 2/6/17 at 11:19 am to TrueTiger
quote:
Vocational track
Or
Academic Track
We need this. Our 'everybody should go to college' attitude is silly.
This. Absolutely needed. I'd even support regular school ending at 16 and years 17-18 being more hands-on training and field-specific classes.
Personal finance absolutely needs to be required for every student in their last year, too.
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