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re: How are you remembering Union Soldiers that died in the Civil War

Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:21 pm to
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:21 pm to
quote:

You can't follow a train of thought, you just reply to one line retorts when left to your own devices. Hell, you were the one who quoted the ruling, share with the class where it disallowed all the "tenth amendment crap."


The ruling referred to the Secesh as insurrectionists. If any 10th amendment argument were even offered, it was rejected.

Well! You heard about the Prize Cases today! Now you can pretend that they never happened.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
53469 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:26 pm to
quote:

After 20+ years of rantin'and ravin' on the internet the SECRANT poliboard is the only one where people say: "less knowledge please."


No no no no.

Don't misunderstand.

It's not that you provide citations that reinforce the substance of your assertions.

It is that citations ARE all of the substance of your assertions. You bring nothing so the table, including apparently reading comprehension abilities to understand if what you are citing supports what you are saying.

Making the entirely of your portion of the discourse to be useless babble filling up bandwith.

And you say you've been at it for 20+ years? Good lord man.
This post was edited on 5/29/17 at 3:30 pm
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
53469 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:29 pm to
quote:

The ruling referred to the Secesh as insurrectionists. If any 10th amendment argument were even offered, it was rejected.



TIL turn of phrases used in overly generalizing events over a 90 year period into two sentences in 2017 has relevance to language used in legal precedent more than 150 years ago.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:30 pm to
quote:

You say you'd rather die than live? I call absolute bullshite.


Do you plan on not dying? Ever?

"The shortest and surest way to live with honor in the world is to be in reality what we would appear to be; all human virtues increase and strengthen themselves by the practice and experience of them.” - Socrates

Dying for what you think is right - yes that is a thing.

Could I do it if faced with imminent death? No idea.

Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
38457 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:32 pm to
The dude is a joke. He moves the goal post, then when you counter him, he gets on Google and Wikipedia. Then after 15 minutes of searching, he comes back and tries to act like he knows what he's talking about.

I've asked him several times what first hand accounts he's read. What journals. All he quotes is Wikipedia.

All he does is spew diarrhea out of his mouth and act holier than thou. He is the lowest of low when it comes to passing off rational arguments or holding intellectual conversation.
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
38457 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:35 pm to
quote:

Do you plan on not dying? Ever?


Moving goal post again eh?

quote:

The shortest and surest way to live with honor in the world is to be in reality what we would appear to be; all human virtues increase and strengthen themselves by the practice and experience of them.” - Socrates


Acting holier than thou? Check.

quote:

Dying for what you think is right - yes that is a thing


the pussy way out.

quote:

Could I do it if faced with imminent death? No idea.


I'll give you a hint.

You'd pull the trigger killing an innocent man before your commander could finish his sentence if it saved your own life.
Posted by el Gaucho
He/They
Member since Dec 2010
59213 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:35 pm to
If the union soldiers could've seen what the us has become today after following liberals for so long (Lincoln was a liberal globalist), they would've turned around and helped the good guys take Washington
Posted by Doc Fenton
New York, NY
Member since Feb 2007
52698 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:38 pm to
quote:

It's absolutely retarded and it's a fricking shame that so many have died for bullshite dressed up in propaganda... and Memorial day is just more propaganda and a way to act like horrible sacrifices were somehow glorious and meant something. Because the alternative is to admit reality... and reality sucks.


If you cynically believe in nothing, then it's easy to get the false impression that reality sucks.

But to come here on Memorial Day so that you can tell people that all military sacrifices are meaningless? That is truly contemptible. It's contemptible because it's a lie.

You don't have to agree with every war that the U.S. waged, or even to prefer an honorable death to life. Nonetheless, it's a mockery of reality to think that the U.S. didn't bring stability and good things to the world through the sacrifices of its military. And it's an even bigger mockery of reality to make a blanket assertion that the freedoms we enjoy would be possible without the commitments made by citizens to join the military and willingly risk death for the good of the country, however mistakenly their civilian leaders might happen to define it at the time.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:38 pm to
quote:

The ruling referred to the Secesh as insurrectionists. If any 10th amendment argument were even offered, it was rejected.

TIL turn of phrases used in overly generalizing events over a 90 year period into two sentences in 2017 has relevance to language used in legal precedent more than 150 years ago.


It is your position, you find it.

You can start here:

"The most far-reaching effect of the Prize Cases was to uphold the president's claim to extensive emergency powers. The precedent set in the Prize Cases may have discouraged legal challenges to other acts of President Lincoln during the war, including suspension of free speech and press, the Conscription Act, and the Emancipation Proclamation. The Prize Cases established the theory that the president had extraordinary powers to preserve the nation and that he could exercise them legally. Furthermore, the Court had ruled that the Union had full powers as a belligerent but that the Confederacy could claim no such powers. The Court accepted the paradox that the Union could exercise all power which would come with an international war, but that it could also exercise sovereign power over the area in rebellion."




Read more: Prize Cases - The Captured Ships - War, Court, Property, and Powers - JRank Articles LINK

It is not really how cemented in fable you neo rebs are - the sources are there. Just because you never heard of them is not germane.
This post was edited on 5/29/17 at 3:40 pm
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
38457 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:44 pm to
Omg. Did you just link an article not from Wikipedia?!

You've graduated from 5th grade into middle school. Now you're going to the source articles cited at the bottom of the Wikipedia page.

Keep up the good work! In a few short years you'll be able to frame arguments without the need of Google or Wikipedia.

Maybe one day you'll even graduate to first hand accounts, personal journals, memoirs, and scholastic journals.

I look forward to the day that we can have an intellectual conversation without you needing to change the goal post and search the internet for your arguments.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:45 pm to
quote:

Do you plan on not dying? Ever?

Moving goal post again eh?


You don't plan to die?
Posted by Doc Fenton
New York, NY
Member since Feb 2007
52698 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:45 pm to
If the Union Soldiers of the 3rd New York Infantry could see the music we listen to today, I'm certain they would try to teach us how to sing with a better big, fat hook: LINK.

"Oh who am I kidding? That hook is fire. The whole track is absolutely lit."
Posted by SavageOrangeJug
Member since Oct 2005
19758 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:46 pm to
I said that earlier, you fricking idiot. I told you what day they did it on. Is the equivalent of German Memorial Day. Quit acting like you just discovered something new.

Is there a place you liberals go to take a test? Do you have to be a complete fricking idiot to be a liberal? Do you have to prove it bypassing the idiot test before you're allowed to become a liberal, or are you born with it?
This post was edited on 5/29/17 at 3:46 pm
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
38457 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:51 pm to
quote:

You don't plan to die?


really? Seriously?

Nope. I'll never ever die. I'm going to live forever. I plan on living for eternity. I'll sell my soul to the devil for that gift.














Posted by bmy
Nashville
Member since Oct 2007
48203 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:55 pm to
quote:

But to come here on Memorial Day so that you can tell people that all military sacrifices are meaningless?


Not all of them. this is a thread about Confederate and Union soldiers and a dash of Nazis
Posted by Doc Fenton
New York, NY
Member since Feb 2007
52698 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:55 pm to
Fair enough!
Posted by cwill
Member since Jan 2005
54755 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:56 pm to
This obvious troll thread will never die.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 3:58 pm to
quote:

Dying for what you think is right - yes that is a thing

the pussy way out.






Rank: Brigadier GeneralOrganization: U.S. Army
Company: Division: 4th Bomber Wing
Born: 14 October 1908, Manila P.I.Departed: Yes
Entered Service At: Mountain Lakes, N.J.G.O. Number: 22
Date of Issue: 02/28/1947Accredited To:
Place / Date: Germany, 24 December 1944



L to R: Col. Vandeventer 385th BG, Col. Castle 94th BG, B.G. LeMay First Bomb Division

CASTLE, FREDERICK W.

Citation
He was air commander and leader of more than 2,000 heavy bombers in a strike against German airfields on 24 December 1944. En route to the target, the failure of 1 engine forced him to relinquish his place at the head of the formation. In order not to endanger friendly troops on the ground below, he refused to jettison his bombs to gain speed maneuverability. His lagging, unescorted aircraft became the target of numerous enemy fighters which ripped the left wing with cannon shells. set the oxygen system afire, and wounded 2 members of the crew. Repeated attacks started fires in 2 engines, leaving the Flying Fortress in imminent danger of exploding. Realizing the hopelessness of the situation, the bail-out order was given. Without regard for his personal safety he gallantly remained alone at the controls to afford all other crewmembers an opportunity to escape. Still another attack exploded gasoline tanks in the right wing, and the bomber plunged earthward. carrying Gen. Castle to his death. His intrepidity and willing sacrifice of his life to save members of the crew were in keeping with the highest traditions of the military service."

Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
38457 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 4:01 pm to
Damn you're dense.

I give up. You just are that damn stupid.

Ps. You're no good at false equivalence. Which really isn't surprising when you factor in your lack of debate skills and absolute need of Google and Wikipedia to tell you your arguments.

Have a great day. May you one day learn how to have an intellectual debate.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 5/29/17 at 4:01 pm to
The Crash of B-17 44-8444 'Treble Four'

The Death of Brigadier General Frederick Walker Castle

In December 1944 Brigadier General Frederick W. Castle was the Commander of the 4th Combat Bomb Wing of the 3rd Air Division, 8th U.S. Army Air Force in England. 4th Bomb Wing headquarters was located at Rougham Field near Bury St. Edmunds, but General Castle lost his life while flying with the 487th Bomb Group at Lavenham. On 24 December 1944 he commanded the 487th Bomb Group and led the Air Task Force in the largest 8th Air Force action of the war. This was 8th Air Force Mission #760, which involved more than 2,000 B-17s and B-24s, including formation assembly ships, war wearies, and almost anything else that could fly and carry a bomb load.9 The mission was to bomb German airfields and supply lines to stem the German offensive in the Ardennes known as the Battle of the Bulge. The 487th Bomb Group's target was the airfield at Babenhausen, Germany.

As Air Leader, General Castle flew in the copilot's position with pilot Lt Robert W. Harriman's lead crew. Their aircraft was Pathfinder B-17G 44-8444 of the 836th Squadron (2G:C). The crew called the aircraft Treble Four after the last three digits of its serial number.13 In the 487th Bomb Group formation, the 838th Squadron was the lead squadron. Treble Four flew in the number 1 position of the lead element. Pilot Lt John H. Edwards and Deputy Air Leader Captain Mayfield R. Shilling flew Pathfinder B-17G 44-8021 in the number 2 position off Harriman's right wing. Pilot Lt Richmond C. Young and copilot Lt Lawrence N. Bross flew B-17G 43-38028 in the number 3 position off Harriman's left wing.4, 15 See the formation flimsy for this mission (Image 13).

Captain Shilling wrote:

I was flying deputy lead to General Castle. Wing and Division assembly was made on time and in perfect weather. The climb was started on leaving the English coast. We reached Belgium at 1130, still climbing. We reached altitude at CP 3 and had just leveled off when we were attacked by fighters, causing the lead aircraft to abort.11

Richmond Young wrote:

About 15-20 minutes before our fighter cover was to rendezvous with us for protection over the target area, the formation was attacked by a large number of German fighters.15

German Messerschmitt Bf-109 and Focke Wolfe Fw-190 fighters attacked the formation just south of Liege, Belgium. The 836th Squadron was the Low Squadron. It lagged behind the rest of the formation, and was attacked by a German Focke Wolfe Fw-190 Sturmgruppe squadron. The Germans attacked in company front formation and decimated the 836th Squadron. The other two squadrons were also attacked. German fighters shot out at least two engines on Treble Four and set the plane on fire. Lt Procopio, the radar navigator, and Lt Rowe, the tail gunner, were wounded.2, 6, 9 Either Lt Harriman or General Castle ordered the crew to bail out. Bombardier Paul Biri did not salvo the bombs because the plane was over troops of the American 1st Army. As Harriman or Castle guided the plane toward an open field away from American infantrymen, another attack caused the right wing auxiliary fuel tank (the Tokyo tank) to explode. The right outer wing was lost and the plane entered a violent right spin at 12,000 feet. The waist and tail sections separated from the aircraft during the spin. Treble Four crashed in an inverted position and the bomb load detonated. Lt Harriman was unable to bail out, and he and General Castle were killed in the crash.2 Eyewitnesses reported that copilot Lt Claude Rowe, the Officer Tail Gunner on this mission, was hit by German strafing in the air after he bailed out. He died at the scene. Radio operator T/Sgt Lawrence Swain fell to his death and was found without his parachute.2, 11 Radar operator Lt Bruno Procopio bailed out and died of his wounds at a military hospital in Liege. Five men survived.2 After Treble Four was shot down, the 487th Bomb Group, commanded by Captain Mayfield R. Shilling, went on to successfully bomb the German airfield at Babenhausen.11 General Castle, Lt Harriman, and T/Sgt Swain are buried at the American Cemetery at Henri-Chapelle, Belgium.1, 7, 8 General Castle was posthumously awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor. His portrait hangs in the Swan Hotel at Lavenham, and in the Mayors' Parlour of St. Edmundsbury Borough Council at Angel Corner, Bury St. Edmunds.5




LINK

Well, it is Memorial Day.
This post was edited on 5/29/17 at 4:06 pm
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