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re: Florida Judge Blocks Governor Ron DeSantis’s 15-Week Abortion Ban

Posted on 6/30/22 at 2:54 pm to
Posted by xxTIMMYxx
Member since Aug 2019
17562 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 2:54 pm to
Time to write up a law
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
26653 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 2:55 pm to
quote:

The judicial branch runs our country.

Only because, as Chief Justice Roberta pointed out this morning in WV v EPA, the legislative branch is refusing to do so.
This post was edited on 6/30/22 at 2:55 pm
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
99127 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:00 pm to
quote:

Exactly. So if a minor doesn't have that right pursuant to the SCOTUS, then the legislature can impose restrictions consistent with SCOTUS interpretations


Not exactly.

SCOTUS held there is no constitutional right to abortion (not under "right to privacy"; due process, etc.) under the US Constitution.

States can recognize such a right as they choose.

Florida appears to have done so (I say "appears," because there is no express right in the constitution, only that the "right to privacy" for a minor does not prevent the Legislature from passing a law requiring parental notification). It is implied from the other provision.

So, then the question becomes, can this implied right be regulated/restricted?

That will have to be decided under Florida law; however, I would imagine that the Florida SC will look to Roberts' concurrence in Dobbs for some guidance (he would have maintained Roe [right to privacy] but upheld the Mississippi law [15 weeks]).
Posted by lsufball19
Franklin, TN
Member since Sep 2008
65077 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:10 pm to
quote:

(not under "right to privacy"; due process, etc.)

right to privacy isn't in the constitution either, which was also addressed in the Dobbs ruling

quote:

Roe, however, was remarkably loose in its treatment of the constitutional text. It held that the abortion right, which is not mentioned in the Constitution, is part of a right to privacy, which is also not mentioned.


quote:

Finally, after all this, the Court turned to precedent. Citing a broad array of cases, the Court found support for a constitutional “right of personal privacy,” id., at 152, but it conflated two very different meanings of the term: the right to shield information from disclosure and the right to make and implement important personal decisions without governmental interference. See Whalen v. Roe, 429 U. S. 589, 599–600 (1977). Only the cases involving this second sense of the term could have any possible relevance to the abortion issue, and some of the cases in that category involved personal decisions that were obviously very, very far afield.


quote:

When Casey revisited Roe almost 20 years later, very little of Roe’s reasoning was defended or preserved. The Court abandoned any reliance on a privacy right and instead grounded the abortion right entirely on the Fourteenth Amendment’s Due Process Clause. 505 U. S., at 846. The Court did not reaffirm Roe’s erroneous account of abortion history. In fact, none of the Justices in the majority said anything about the history of the abortion right. And as for precedent, the Court relied on essentially the same body of cases that Roe had cited. Thus, with respect to the standard grounds for constitutional decision making—text, history, and precedent—Casey did not attempt to bolster Roe’s reasoning.


quote:

Because the Court properly applies our substantive due process precedents to reject the fabrication of a constitutional right to abortion, and because this case does not present the opportunity to reject substantive due process entirely, I join the Court’s opinion. But, in future cases, we should “follow the text of the Constitution, which sets forth certain substantive rights that cannot be taken away, and adds, beyond that, a right to due process when life, liberty, or property is to be taken away.” Carlton, 512 U. S., at 42 (opinion of Scalia, J.). Substantive due process conflicts with that textual command and has harmed our country in many ways. Accordingly, we should eliminate it from our jurisprudence at the earliest opportunity.


quote:

States can recognize such a right as they choose.

Florida appears to have done so

What Florida did was essentially codify the interpretation the SCOTUS has had with respect to the right to an abortion in their own state constitution. With the Dobbs ruling, laws consistent with the SCOTUS' current interpretation of those rights has been turned upside down.
Posted by squid_hunt
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2021
11272 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:15 pm to
quote:


This is obviously a coordinated fall back plan the left has had cooked up waiting to unleash.

Yeah, while all the mealy mouthed super conservatives on here have been mumbling around the dicks in their mouths about federal something something no standing. Been saying this for a week. SURPRISE!
Posted by UAinSOUTHAL
Mobile,AL
Member since Dec 2012
4830 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:21 pm to
They don't know when to stop pushing they should have taken their 15 weeks and been happy. The whole reason Roe was overturned was because they pushed to hard in Mississippi. If they had just left that law alone Roe would still be the law. They can never just stop. They are going to push this to the legislature and good chance you get a full ban there.
Posted by Original Corn Pop
The public pool
Member since Nov 2020
547 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:25 pm to
quote:

That will have to be decided under Florida law


As it should be. Fwiw, this is how things will play out now; if the FLORIDA Supreme Court ultimately declares that law to be in violation of the FLORIDA Constitution then they need to amend it. SCOTUS didn't outlaw abortion, it said it is governed by state law.
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
42941 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:27 pm to
quote:

More judicial activism. frick these clowns
So, Florida had an abortion law, but Roe prevented its implementation. As such, no judicial challenge to that law would have been ripe while Roe remained in place.

SCOTUS overturns Roe.

Within days, Floridians file suit seeking a determination that the Florida statute violates the Florida constitution.

Florida court says "Everyone stay where you are until we get this sorted out."

How is that "judicial activism" in your mind?
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
26653 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:27 pm to
quote:

How is that "judicial activism" in your mind?

Not everyone took civil procedure or con law, baw.

I find that a huge amount of angst regarding legal proceedings on here come from ignorance of the process more than anything else.
This post was edited on 6/30/22 at 3:31 pm
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
42941 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:28 pm to
quote:

Yep, pretty much any of these cases should have been tossed immediately...
Why?

SCOTUS said the US Constitution does not guarantee abortion rights, as of a week ago.

New suit alleges that the STATE Constitution guarantees those rights. This is NOT an issue addressed in Dobbs.

Why should that case be "tossed immediately?"
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
42941 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:31 pm to
quote:

More judicial activism.
quote:

Yep, with no consequence to the "judges", absurd.

Pretty sure that Florida state court judges are elected and must face re-election every few years.

If their constituents don't like their rulings, the constituents can remove them.

Sounds like a "consequence" to me.
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
111608 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:35 pm to
Sorry, all y’all worshippers of Molech.

The day SCOTUS ruled was the 9/11 for hos.

Deal with it.
Posted by lsufball19
Franklin, TN
Member since Sep 2008
65077 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:35 pm to
quote:

Pretty sure that Florida state court judges are elected and must face re-election every few years. If their constituents don't like their rulings, the constituents can remove them.


All state court judges are elected everywhere. Most state COA judges and state supreme court justices are appointed by governors. It's not as simple as constituents simply voting for the judges who are the ones who will set legal precedent in their states. State Court judges won't be deciding whether laws are constitutional under their state laws.
This post was edited on 6/30/22 at 3:50 pm
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
42941 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:36 pm to
quote:

I find that a huge amount of angst regarding legal proceedings on here come from ignorance of the process more than anything else.
I said it yesterday.

75% of the downvotes on legal discussions are from people basically saying "I don't understand a word of what I am reading, but I don't like it."
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
111608 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:37 pm to
quote:

I find that a huge amount of angst regarding legal proceedings on here come from ignorance of the process more than anything else.


A lot of angst comes from the fact that law schools are little neo Marxist factories. And the judges aren’t ruling on merits but rather what they want the outcomes to be.

We can dance around those facts as long as anyone would like to. They remain facts.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
26653 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:37 pm to
quote:

State COA judges and state supreme court justices are appointed by governors.

This is not true, at least in Louisiana.

quote:

All state court judges are elected everywhere. State COA judges and state supreme court justices are appointed by governors. Constituents can't simply vote out the judges who are the ones who will set legal precedent in their states. State Court judges won't be deciding whether laws are constitutional under their state laws.


Not sure how you can make both of the bolded sentences in the same statement.
Posted by lsufball19
Franklin, TN
Member since Sep 2008
65077 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:38 pm to
quote:

Yep, pretty much any of these cases should have been tossed immediately...

Dobbs didn't make abortion illegal. It ruled that their is no constitutional right to abortion and, rather, an issue for individual states to decide. If a lawsuit is filed challenging a state's laws, then no it shouldn't be immediately shot down because of the Dobbs ruling. That's exactly what Dobbs said should happen.
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
111608 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:38 pm to
quote:

75% of the downvotes on legal discussions are from people basically saying "I don't understand a word of what I am reading, but I don't like it."


Bold words from the legal mind that couldn’t define homicide.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
26653 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:40 pm to
quote:

A lot of angst comes from the fact that law schools are little neo Marxist factories. And the judges aren’t ruling on merits but rather what they want the outcomes to be.

Won't get any argument from me there either. All of the above can be true.
Posted by Y.A. Tittle
Member since Sep 2003
101662 posts
Posted on 6/30/22 at 3:40 pm to
quote:

All state court judges are elected everywhere. State COA judges and state supreme court justices are appointed by governors.


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