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Started By
Message
2
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:47 pm to cajunangelle
quote:
Despite Americans' widespread ignorance as to what is happening in these cases, they don't like the president "defying" judges. Such as cynical, dangerous game
As i said yesterday in one of the many "The DEMs keep taking the 20 side of the 80/20 issues", this can easily flip around on them into a 95/5 issue with only MAGA in the 5, if the admin starts ignoring court orders.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:48 pm to JimEverett
quote:
What?
The plain language of the Proclamation makes clear that you are wrong. Nowhere do it say the government is going to round up anyone of Venezuelan origin and deport them. When did we just start making shite up to say?
again it's right here...yall really should just take a minute and research this topic. I get yall want the 200 out here, but this really is opening up the door to deport innocent people. LINK
quote:
"Whenever there is a declared war between the United States and any foreign nation or government, or any invasion or predatory incursion is perpetrated, attempted, or threatened against the territory of the United States by any foreign nation or government, and the President makes public proclamation of the event, all natives, citizens, denizens, or subjects of the hostile nation or government, being of the age of fourteen years and upward, who shall be within the United States and not actually naturalized, shall be liable to be apprehended, restrained, secured, and removed as alien enemies. The President is authorized, in any such event, by his proclamation thereof, or other public act, to direct the conduct to be observed, on the part of the United States, toward the aliens who become so liable; the manner and degree of the restraint to which they shall be subject
mind you in this case that terrorist group is not a nation or government, so the Venezuelans would have to be pushing this. So that nation or government would be Venezuela. So anyone who is Venezuelan could be rounded up and deported
This post was edited on 3/19/25 at 3:50 pm
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:49 pm to cajunangelle
The problem for the Dems, is Trump will play their game and appeal.
He will win some and lose some in court, but in the court of public opinion, he is winning big time.
Once he gets a definitive ruling on the Alien Enemies Act, he will either go full force with it to deport as many as he can quickly, or, if he loses, he will pivot and deport as normal.
Yet, the public will think it is ridiculous that gang members sent here should have rights to regular deportation proceedings.
This is a political win for Trump.
He will win some and lose some in court, but in the court of public opinion, he is winning big time.
Once he gets a definitive ruling on the Alien Enemies Act, he will either go full force with it to deport as many as he can quickly, or, if he loses, he will pivot and deport as normal.
Yet, the public will think it is ridiculous that gang members sent here should have rights to regular deportation proceedings.
This is a political win for Trump.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:50 pm to LSUFAITHFUL2
quote:
Just because it wasn’t invoked on 9/11 doesn’t mean it couldn’t have been.
I don't think it could have been. Legally, at least.
quote:
The statute doesn’t require an active war.
Not 100% clear.
Even the cases discussing the statute all are built around the presumption of propriety of the wars because they were all declared.
There is no ruling analyzing the statute outside of clearly-defined, declared wars.
quote:
Pearl Harbor is what precipitated the use of the AEA during WWII and not a single foreign soldier stepped foot in Hawaii.
Did we declare war prior to invoking the AEA?
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:51 pm to deathvalleytiger10
quote:
Yet, the public will think it is ridiculous that gang members sent here should have rights to regular deportation proceedings.
This is a political win for Trump.
Right because republicans and Maga's are doing a good job of making this only about the 200 (unverified if all were terrorists) instead of what power the act actually grants
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:51 pm to GamecockUltimate
thats not the citation I asked for (probably because it doesnt exist), but you have managed to make an incredible case for using the act against Tren de Aragua.
predatory incursion? Check
threatened against the territory of the US? Check
foreign nation or government? Check. TdA is directly linked to the Maduro regime and were sent here at his direction.
not naturalized? Check
predatory incursion? Check
threatened against the territory of the US? Check
foreign nation or government? Check. TdA is directly linked to the Maduro regime and were sent here at his direction.
not naturalized? Check
This post was edited on 3/19/25 at 3:55 pm
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:52 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Did we declare war prior to invoking the AEA?
The answer to that one is no. The AEA was not applied until after war was declared. Hence it fit bill (as you know)
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:52 pm to Major Dutch Schaefer
quote:
DOJ Again Refuses to Give Judge Boasberg Sensitive Information on National Security
How are flight times sensitive national security information? Isn’t this public information?
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:52 pm to GamecockUltimate
You are posting caselaw - I am talking about what is in Trump's Proclamation governing who the government has declared is subject to the AEA.
Venezuelans themselves are not subject to the AEA.
Venezuelans themselves are not subject to the AEA.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:54 pm to GamecockUltimate
quote:
Whenever there is a declared war between the United States and any foreign nation or government, or any invasion or predatory incursion is perpetrated, attempted, or threatened against the territory of the United States
war is one condition, not the only condition. We've covered this already.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:56 pm to Vacherie Saint
quote:
war is one condition, not the only condition. We've covered this already.
Correct, and the factors you "checked" earlier are subject to review to ensure the executive is acting in compliance with the limitations of the statute, just as the status of a "declared war" was reviewed by the cases discussing the Act. That's what's being discussed.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:56 pm to Vacherie Saint
quote:
thats not the citation I asked for (probably because it doesnt exist), but you have managed to make an incredible case for using the act against Tren de Aragua.
predatory incursion? Check
threatened against the territory of the US? Check
foreign nation or government? Check. TdA is directly linked to the Maduro regime and were sent here at his direction.
not naturalized? Check
I didnt, but your mind is pretty made up, and it wouldnt matter what I presented you....you werent changing your mind...even with the text of the actual act or previous cases regarding the AEA.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:57 pm to JimEverett
quote:
You are posting caselaw - I am talking about what is in Trump's Proclamation governing who the government has declared is subject to the AEA.
Venezuelans themselves are not subject to the AEA.
if thats the case then the AEA can't be used. Tren de aragua are not a nation or government. It wouldn't meet the criteria
Posted on 3/19/25 at 3:59 pm to Vacherie Saint
quote:
quote:
Whenever there is a declared war between the United States and any foreign nation or government, or any invasion or predatory incursion is perpetrated, attempted, or threatened against the territory of the United States
war is one condition, not the only condition. We've covered this already.
by any foreign nation or government
you casually left that off the end of your quote. Didnt want you to forget it
Posted on 3/19/25 at 4:00 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:oh please everyone knows this is bullshite lawfare and each of the judges will be out of work in under a year.
As i said yesterday in one of the many "The DEMs keep taking the 20 side of the 80/20 issues", this can easily flip around on them into a 95/5 issue with only MAGA in the 5, if the admin starts ignoring court orders.
you suck dude, you really do.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 4:05 pm to ninthward
quote:
oh please everyone knows this is bullshite lawfare and each of the judges will be out of work in under a year.
Julie Kelly and, I believe, CA agree with me.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 4:06 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
if the admin starts ignoring court orders.
As much as you are rooting for this, all indications, including the words of Trump last night, is that he will appeal rulings and work things through the court system.
Only those, like yourself, that want to see him defeated, think he will ignore the courts.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 4:06 pm to LSUFAITHFUL2
quote:
Pearl Harbor is what precipitated the use of the AEA during WWII and not a single foreign soldier stepped foot in Hawaii.
I would consider Japanese Navy air plains flying over US territory dropping bombs a fair description of an invasion by a foreign government
But it’s a moot point because congress officially declared war against Japan.
It’s actually crazy to argue that we’re actively being invaded by Venezuela, but not ask congress to declare war on venezuela.
This statute expands war power not police power.
Posted on 3/19/25 at 4:06 pm to GamecockUltimate
quote:
Otherwise someone should be held in contempt of court for defying a judges order hours before a court date
Go ahead and hold Rubio in contempt of court and just let Trump pardon him. Or, is the judge going to hold Trump in contempt of court?
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