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re: Dave Smith and Douglas Murray on Joe Rogan's show
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:29 pm to St Augustine
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:29 pm to St Augustine
quote:
He’s spent his entire career working on and studying both historically and practically geopolitics, migration, pursuing journalist information, etc on a lot of these topics.
So he reads a lot?
This post was edited on 4/11/25 at 3:31 pm
2
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:31 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
A degree from Oxford for starters
A degree in what?
Oops looked it up middle Eastern studies
Just kidding it's an English degree. I guess if I need someone to proofread a paper DM is my guy.
This post was edited on 4/11/25 at 3:36 pm
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:31 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
A degree from Oxford for starters. There really is something to institutions, whether you want to acknowledge it or not.
Yeah, because the problem with the Israel/Palestine issue is that we just haven’t had smart enough people determining who’s “right”.
I’m much more inclined to agree with DMs positions on Israel/Palestine but that doesn’t change the fact that he embarrassed himself in the debate.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:33 pm to PQuin
quote:
Hopefully you watched the episode and will be able to answer my question. With Murray’s experience and expertise, he should have easily been able to shut down all (or even just one) of Dave’s arguments. That simply didn’t happen, so how do you explain that? He basically filibustered the first 45 mins and then proceeded to contradict himself over and over.
I’ve already stated I enjoyed Murray’s answers on Gaza and Hamas. I’d see why you’d like Smith’s more emotional style though based on your posts.
You haven’t really stated anything substantive that smith stated.
Honestly I think Rogan dropped the ball as he didn’t really moderate or even state the debate topic at least on the Spotify episode. It just cut to Murray already speaking.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:34 pm to Robin Masters
quote:
DM clowned himself.
But, but his British accent. He's super smart. The credentialed class told me so.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:34 pm to Alabama Slim
quote:English. Don't underestimate how good of a thinker an English degree from Oxford will make you.
A degree in what?
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:34 pm to bayoubengals88
You fall into the same ridiculous trap that Douglas Murray has.
"Why would Murray ever debate Dave Smith?"
How about because Dave Smith has a valid point of view that seems pretty reasoned out to me.
I'd say that his perspective was explained waaay better that Murray's in this particular instance. And I'm not coming at that from any preconceived bias for or against either guy. I stated that I like and respect both men. (Much less for Murray after this debacle)
And I agree with Dave Smith 100% on his response that "I can say what I want because I'm a free American."
I get Murray's perspective to a degree. He seems to live still in an old-world British aristocracy mindset. There are certain people who deserve this and certain people who don't. It seems to affect his entire worldview.
Here in America, I say frick that perspective. If you say something smart, then you said something smart.
"Why would Murray ever debate Dave Smith?"
How about because Dave Smith has a valid point of view that seems pretty reasoned out to me.
I'd say that his perspective was explained waaay better that Murray's in this particular instance. And I'm not coming at that from any preconceived bias for or against either guy. I stated that I like and respect both men. (Much less for Murray after this debacle)
And I agree with Dave Smith 100% on his response that "I can say what I want because I'm a free American."
I get Murray's perspective to a degree. He seems to live still in an old-world British aristocracy mindset. There are certain people who deserve this and certain people who don't. It seems to affect his entire worldview.
Here in America, I say frick that perspective. If you say something smart, then you said something smart.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:37 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
English. Don't underestimate how good of a thinker an English degree from Oxford will make you.
Oh Jesus christ
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:37 pm to thenza
quote:About what??
How about because Dave Smith has a valid point of view that seems pretty reasoned out to me.
quote:What has Dave Smith said that is so smart? I've listened to hours of Murray on podcasts and read many articles, and a book. I've never known him to be anything other than spot on.
Here in America, I say frick that perspective. If you say something smart, then you said something smart.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:37 pm to Alabama Slim
quote:
So he reads a lot?
In addition to living amongst, meticulously researching, and having achieved success academically…yeah. I guess so.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:38 pm to Alabama Slim
quote:A lot can be learned of him there too.
Oh Jesus christ
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:41 pm to Alabama Slim
quote:
So he reads a lot?
Much of his career has centered on criticism of Islam, and he's traveled Europe and the ME extensively, in addition to observing what's occurred in his native country.
What more could you want, especially when Smith admitted to never having been in the ME?
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:43 pm to GumboPot
quote:
But, but his British accent. He's super smart. The credentialed class told me so.
In light of the last 8 years of Covid and Russia Russia Russia I just can’t imagine the level of poor decision making required to go on to JRE and lead off with “trust the experts”!
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:46 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
English. Don't underestimate how good of a thinker an English degree from Oxford will make you.
Good Lord
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:47 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
A degree from Oxford for starters. There really is something to institutions, whether you want to acknowledge it or not.
What does an English degree have to do with geopolitics?
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:47 pm to Robin Masters
quote:Murray himself has done a phenomenal job battling the "experts" over that time span. But I think we was perfectly justified in being concerned that Rogan has given a voice to these amateur historians. It's irresponsible.
In light of the last 8 years of Covid and Russia Russia Russia I just can’t imagine the level of poor decision making required to go on to JRE and lead off with “trust the experts”!
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:47 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
About what??
He directly quoted Netanyahu stating that his goal was to prop up Hamas in order to keep the Palestinians divided and avoid a legitimate partner for peace.
Murray's response was "That was just one recording."
Again, I like Douglas Murray. Clearly not as much as you. But he has a mental block in his ability to see the other perspective in this matter. That kind of thinking is what leads countries into disastrous courses. It's no different that when George Bush declared "they hate us for our freedoms." It's a simplistic response that, no matter how intelligent a person is, demonstrates a lack of clarity. It's us vs. them shite that anybody can do.
Just look at how most of this board reacts to Trump. Same shite.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:48 pm to St Augustine
quote:
In addition to living amongst
Does Murray live in isreal? Honest question.
quote:
meticulously researching,
Which anyone with internet access can do.
quote:
and having achieved success academically…yeah.
My doctor is a bright guy, I should get his take on geopolitics.
Hell given your criteria I might qualify as a isreal hamas expert.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:49 pm to PQuin
quote:He's put the time in since. You can't disagree with that.
What does an English degree have to do with geopolitics?
Degrees in the humanities are extremely beneficial for developing the intellect. Then you go and use your brain like Murray has done.
Posted on 4/11/25 at 3:50 pm to thenza
quote:So this makes him a smart person?
He directly quoted Netanyahu stating that his goal was to prop up Hamas in order to keep the Palestinians divided and avoid a legitimate partner for peace.
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