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re: Cake baker loses appeal... Must bake for all people
Posted on 6/3/14 at 11:05 am to darkhorse
Posted on 6/3/14 at 11:05 am to darkhorse
Troubling on both sides of the issue, let's hope it isn't a trend. If people want to lose profit from customers, then so be it. If the prevailing opinion is that they are wrong for it, they'll fail. I don't see the need for government here.
Trying to be creative, can this be an easy way around it:
Stop making wedding cakes for the public. Wedding Cakes can only be made for members of the "Wedding Cake Club," a private club the baker offers and $5 of their cake purchase goes to Membership dues for the year. Members have to sign a simple agreement outlining what the cake is for. Obviously include some statement about "Wedding cakes are to be used for Christian supported marriages," or something like that. Three statements about marriages and a signature line, just to be "official." Done.
Can private clubs still be, "private?"
Trying to be creative, can this be an easy way around it:
Stop making wedding cakes for the public. Wedding Cakes can only be made for members of the "Wedding Cake Club," a private club the baker offers and $5 of their cake purchase goes to Membership dues for the year. Members have to sign a simple agreement outlining what the cake is for. Obviously include some statement about "Wedding cakes are to be used for Christian supported marriages," or something like that. Three statements about marriages and a signature line, just to be "official." Done.
Can private clubs still be, "private?"
This post was edited on 6/3/14 at 11:06 am
3
Posted on 6/3/14 at 11:16 am to Freauxzen
quote:Only if they are not open to the public, which most bakers would be so they can sell cookies, tarts, cakes and pastries to all-comers. Would not apply to a baker who discriminates based on religion, anyway. Court would toss it.
Can private clubs still be, "private?"
Posted on 6/3/14 at 11:20 am to darkhorse
For me, the baker is discriminating and there is no room for that in a modern society.
Posted on 6/3/14 at 11:24 am to LSUZombie
quote:
the baker is discriminating and there is no room for that in a modern society.
Do you live in a neighborhood with an HOA.
Posted on 6/3/14 at 11:32 am to TrueTiger
quote:Nice veer off the highway. The conversation may as well be...
Do you live in a neighborhood with an HOA.
"The baker is being discriminatory."
"Do you drive a red car or a green car?"
Posted on 6/3/14 at 12:55 pm to TrueTiger
quote:
Do you live in a neighborhood with an HOA
No.
Posted on 6/3/14 at 1:30 pm to Freauxzen
quote:Yes it is.
Troubling on both sides of the issue, let's hope it isn't a trend.
Both sides handled it poorly, as did the court.
Posted on 6/3/14 at 1:59 pm to HubbaBubba
quote:
Nice veer off the highway
ok, a little, but HOAs discriminate against slobs and people with poor taste.
Everyone discriminates every day on one subject or another, from the kind of car you drive to where you buy your clothes.
It just happens to be the case that gaydom is the cause célèbre of the day. In years past is has been race. Who knows what tomorrow will bring.
I just think it is far better to let people sort these things out themselves. It is preferable to using the machinery of the state to bludgeon people who don't share your enlightenment. That approach tends to introduce resentment and resistance.
What great societal 'problem' is being solved here? Show me the long list of bakers who are refusing this service.
There aren't any, only one or two here and there. This is no national crisis.
This is a solution in search of a problem.
This post was edited on 6/3/14 at 2:07 pm
Posted on 6/3/14 at 3:01 pm to TrueTiger
What is a HOA?
Posted on 6/3/14 at 3:07 pm to JEAUXBLEAUX
quote:Home Owners Association
What is a HOA?
Posted on 6/3/14 at 3:15 pm to TrueTiger
quote:And when a black person lives in a town or state where everyone hangs "No Negros Allowed" signs in the window and "Whites Only" on the public water fountains?
I just think it is far better to let people sort these things out themselves.
Should we just let people just sort things out then?
Posted on 6/3/14 at 3:29 pm to udtiger
quote:
It should be up to the individual states
Didn't read the entire thread, but if it's a state law that says you can't discriminate based on sexual orientation, do you support that state's right in that case?
Posted on 6/3/14 at 3:37 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
Stop making wedding cakes for the public. Wedding Cakes can only be made for members of the "Wedding Cake Club," a private club the baker offers and $5 of their cake purchase goes to Membership dues for the year. Members have to sign a simple agreement outlining what the cake is for. Obviously include some statement about "Wedding cakes are to be used for Christian supported marriages," or something like that. Three statements about marriages and a signature line, just to be "official." Done.
It looks like he just stopped making wedding cakes altogether.
LINK
quote:
They’ve gotten so much business from the sales of cookies and brownies, they’ve temporarily stopped making wedding cakes.
I'm sure this ruling will change that from "temporarily" to "permanently."
Posted on 6/3/14 at 3:39 pm to darkhorse
quote:
fricking ridiculous... A private business should be able to choose who it wants to do business with.
Yep
Posted on 6/3/14 at 4:07 pm to DawgCountry
If someone told me that they did not want to serve me b/c I am white, I would just tell them to F off and go somewhere else.
Posted on 6/3/14 at 4:12 pm to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
Didn't read the entire thread, but if it's a state law that says you can't discriminate based on sexual orientation, do you support that state's right in that case?
Sure, the US Constitution does not prohibit individual states from granting GREATER rights than those acknowledged or afforded under the US Constitution. However, to the extent that those "greater" rights result in the infringement of basic rights under the US Constitution (say...by requiring involuntary servitude in violation of the 13th Amendment), then the state law would be void.
Posted on 6/3/14 at 4:58 pm to udtiger
quote:
Sure, the US Constitution does not prohibit individual states from granting GREATER rights than those acknowledged or afforded under the US Constitution. However, to the extent that those "greater" rights result in the infringement of basic rights under the US Constitution (say...by requiring involuntary servitude in violation of the 13th Amendment), then the state law would be void.
Ok because I always hear "its a states' rights issue" unless the person also doesn't agree with the state law.
FWIW, it's the job of federal judges to interpret the US Constitution. What they say is the federal law.
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