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Message
re: Abortion as a political issue
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:32 am to SDVTiger
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:32 am to SDVTiger
quote:
This is why morons lile Pedofogger and his fellow bot team were beyond wrong that Desantis would win in a landslide with his national abortion ban
perpetual adolescence is a curse on this country
1
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:33 am to Pettifogger
The truth always hurts
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:35 am to JackaReaux
quote:
It’s too late for all the waffling bullshite. Trump has stated many times that it should be decided at the state level
And that’s where it will stay. The overturning of R v W not only ended the nationwide legality of abortion, it also ruled out banning abortion at the federal level. It’s stupid that abortion is an issue for anyone in a federal election at this point.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:35 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Yes. The GOP would be doing much better the past 20+ years if they didn't let the Evangelicals hijack social issues.
"If only the GOP completely dropped the social conservative portion of conservatism they'd be doing great" is such a bizarre take.
You guys could have just taken over the LP 20 years ago and perhaps it would be viable today.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:35 am to SDVTiger
quote:
Im not a boomer or a liberal
Very confused progressive.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:37 am to SDVTiger
quote:
The truth always hurts
acknowledging the existence of truth is a start
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:41 am to SDVTiger
quote:
Im not a boomer or a liberal
You act like a boomer.
But you are definitely a liberal, if not a leftist.
You openly admit that you wish the GOP would abandon conservatism, because you think the GOP can win if it does.
You sound like all the RINO squishes I deal with on the regular at my county level Republican Party
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:42 am to burger bearcat
Abortion should be 100% totally legal. Why make her spend time in jail when she will burn in hellfire for all of eternity? 
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:45 am to Pettifogger
quote:
"If only the GOP completely dropped the social conservative portion of conservatism they'd be doing great" is such a bizarre take.
Not if the discussion is winning elections.
And they don't have to drop it fully, just be smart. Like what Youngkin did in 2021.
If the GOP was associated with a ban after 20 weeks and exceptions for rape/incest/mother's safety, they'd be crushing this cycle. Instead, they're associated with full bans with no exceptions, b/c the Evangelicals are allowed to set the discussion terms nationally.
quote:
You guys could have just taken over the LP 20 years ago and perhaps it would be viable today.
That's basically what happened to me 19 years ago
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:46 am to burger bearcat
quote:
But you are definitely a liberal, if not a leftist.
HOW DOES IT FEEL, SD?
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:49 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Not if the discussion is winning elections
So become the Democrat Party-lite?
Why even have an opposition Party?
And to be clear, it really isn't about winning election, its about winning the issues. I really am not sure why I would or should care about Party allegiance for no other reason than Party allegiance?
It's about winning on the issues. You don't offer any solutions to win on the issues that are important to conservatives other than somehow dropping the issues? You don't make sense, but I kmow you think you are smart in your own head.
This post was edited on 8/27/24 at 11:50 am
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:52 am to burger bearcat
I'm for abortion in the first 9 weeks. But it's not a deal breaker with me for an all out ban.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:52 am to burger bearcat
quote:
So become the Democrat Party-lite?
Even accepting your biased framing, is that worse than irrelevancy?
This goes back to a question that none of the Evangelical-types wanted to answer yesterday.
Will there be more or fewer abortions if the Democrats win more elections?
quote:
You don't offer any solutions to win on the issues that are important to conservatives other than somehow dropping the issues?
Who said drop the issue? I have said multiple times the path is offering reasonable policy compromises on the issue to make the DEMs the extreme parties and gain moderate support.
A 15-20 week ban isn't "dropping" abortion
Allowing exceptions for rape, incest, and the mother's health isn't "dropping" abortion.
It's the absolutists who frick up these reasonable compromises and get the GOP associated with their extreme bullshite.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 11:55 am to burger bearcat
quote:
It's about winning on the issues.
Social conservative issues aren’t real issues. They are boogeymen to keep the religious right watching commercials on Fox News. The economy, border security, and our national debt are actual conservative issues.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 12:14 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
And they don't have to drop it fully, just be smart. Like what Youngkin did in 2021.
Trump is caving more than Youngkin did, and likely to no significant impact.
The reality is that but for P25 and other narratives on abortion, the completely beholden media would have been pushing some other dynamic this cycle and we'd be mostly in the same spot.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 12:15 pm to Esquire
quote:
Social conservative issues aren’t real issues. They are boogeymen to keep the religious right watching commercials on Fox News. The economy, border security, and our national debt are actual conservative issues.
counterpoint: the culture war is the real war
Posted on 8/27/24 at 12:21 pm to Pettifogger
quote:
Trump is caving more than Youngkin did, and likely to no significant impact.
What's Trump public statements on his preferred week ban? Or the common exceptions?
quote:
The reality is that but for P25 and other narratives on abortion, the completely beholden media would have been pushing some other dynamic this cycle and we'd be mostly in the same spot.
Media fatalism
Posted on 8/27/24 at 12:32 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Not if the discussion is winning elections.
And they don't have to drop it fully, just be smart. Like what Youngkin did in 2021.
If the GOP was associated with a ban after 20 weeks and exceptions for rape/incest/mother's safety, they'd be crushing this cycle. Instead, they're associated with full bans with no exceptions, b/c the Evangelicals are allowed to set the discussion terms nationally.
'
You're using extreme logic and a little bit of utilitarianism in a vacuum. You're watching what happens when Republicans "adopt" views of Democrats, but really vice versa in real time - Taxes on Tips and the Border wall. Look how they couch the "Border bill" anyway.
You can't beat the media in this instance. Even everything you propose either/both 1) The Republicans will be labeled as Nazis for not allowing 24 months! or 2) The Progressive media will create another boogeyman that the right will have to, in your opinion, compromise on to win
It will never end, so why start that game and lose your morals in the process.
I guarantee will not let this move work.
This post was edited on 8/27/24 at 12:33 pm
Posted on 8/27/24 at 12:35 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
You can't beat the media in this instance.
More media fatalism
quote:
It will never end, so why start that game and lose your morals in the process.
Political policies are not the same thing as individual morals
quote:
I guarantee will not let this move work.
We have literally seen the opposite occur...even recently in 2022.
Abortion is a loser topic for Republicans, because they've allowed extremists to define their position nationally.
Posted on 8/27/24 at 12:40 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Abortion is a loser topic for Republicans, because they've allowed extremists to define their position nationally.
It is perceived as a losing topic because they are shitty at articulating the premise of the argument and how to penetrative the zeitgeist with their side of the argument. It's a mix of laziness and stupidity.
You have to define what the issue is and why you are fighting for it. This is why it needs to start with defining personhood and going from there.
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