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Started By
Message
re: ATF to rule AR/AK braces as AOW. Update in OP
Posted on 10/27/20 at 8:47 am to civiltiger07
Posted on 10/27/20 at 8:47 am to civiltiger07
Look, I am as suspicious as anyone of this agency, and I think their rules are silly, but when you see people using braces like a stock(like I would really like to do) you have to realize there isn't enough difference from an SBR for them to have a different status. Now, having said that, the SBR rule is dumb as frick.
2
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:02 am to AlxTgr
quote:
Look, I am as suspicious as anyone of this agency, and I think their rules are silly, but when you see people using braces like a stock(like I would really like to do) you have to realize there isn't enough difference from an SBR for them to have a different status. Now, having said that, the SBR rule is dumb as frick.
But they were allowed under the rules, millions in circulation, and now they want to change the rules
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:04 am to wickowick
quote:OK?
But they were allowed under the rules, millions in circulation, and now they want to change the rules
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:09 am to AlxTgr
Well, if they enact these rules, you would be a felon overnight unless you pay the tax stamp and wait the months to be approved by the ATF.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:14 am to wickowick
I know. I mean, all of that is obvious.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:18 am to wickowick
quote:
But they were allowed under the rules, millions in circulation, and now they want to change the rules
This is where the problem lies with them. They say something is legal and then after millions of people bought them they come back and say it's illegal. And from what I can tell, they are not giving a grace period like they did with the bumpstocks. If you own one you are a law abiding citizen turned felon overnight. If they came out and said they are not allowed from the get go I wouldn't have a problem with it.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:28 am to jdavid1
And therein lies the much larger problem that this won’t stop at bump stocks or braces. The ATF can do whatever it wants unchecked at the moment and I don’t see that stopping. They’re like a damn psychotic, bipolar ex girlfriend stalking you
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:43 am to jimbeam
The entire agency system needs to be blown up.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:45 am to jimbeam
quote:
They’re like a damn psychotic, bipolar ex girlfriend stalking you
This is perfect.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 9:53 am to civiltiger07
For those saying it’s only a stamp and a few bucks.
It also puts your firearm and you on a specific list. You won’t be able to easily sell it or gift it to your kids. Then, if they decide to place further limitations or completely outlaw the item, then they show up on your doorstep and demand you turn it in. Calling it an AOW is the first step to taking what was a lawful purchase all they way to confiscation and prosecution.
It also puts your firearm and you on a specific list. You won’t be able to easily sell it or gift it to your kids. Then, if they decide to place further limitations or completely outlaw the item, then they show up on your doorstep and demand you turn it in. Calling it an AOW is the first step to taking what was a lawful purchase all they way to confiscation and prosecution.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 10:01 am to Bigsampson
Also what do you do with the brace? As even off the fire arm they can prove constructive intent... so you fill out the papers and just have a weapon with bare buffer tube sitting around for almost a year before you can attach the stock. I guess on the plus side once it is a sbr you can ditch the brace and use a real stock
Posted on 10/27/20 at 10:13 am to 03GeeTee
quote:
AOW is only a $5 stamp if you’re purchasing one on a form 4. It’s still $200 for an AOW stamp if you build one yourself with a form 1.
So if you own an AR Pistol already with a brace, you have to disassemble the pistol, fill out a form 1 and send them the $200 and wait for approval correct?
This post was edited on 10/27/20 at 10:14 am
Posted on 10/27/20 at 10:30 am to BayouBengal51
That is what I gather.. so dumb it would be less painful if the ATF could get these thing approved inside of a month. Hell I would have a closet full of nfa toys if that were the case. I just refuse to wait 6+ months to use something I have already paid for in full.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 10:50 am to bayoudude
quote:
That is what I gather.. so dumb it would be less painful if the ATF could get these thing approved inside of a month. Hell I would have a closet full of nfa toys if that were the case. I just refuse to wait 6+ months to use something I have already paid for in full.
The ATF is so stupid: "Today it's legal and ok by us. Tomorrow though, we slept on it and now you are a felon!"
You purchase a completely legal product and now its a criminal offense because one agency overnight decides to change it's opinion.
This post was edited on 10/27/20 at 10:52 am
Posted on 10/27/20 at 10:53 am to bayoudude
Form 1s are done in a month now
Posted on 10/27/20 at 10:56 am to jimbeam
Wouldn’t the aow distinction still prohibit the use of a stock but would allow a vertical fore grip?
This post was edited on 10/27/20 at 10:57 am
Posted on 10/27/20 at 11:12 am to bayoudude
I believe so
Posted on 10/27/20 at 11:12 am to civiltiger07
So someone tell me how this works as a normal citizen.
ATF changes an interpretation. I followed all the laws and regulations at time of purchase but now I don't meet the new standard because I don't have a tax stamp.
How does the ATF go about notifying the public of this rule change? Many times courts have placed the burden on the regulatory agency for this process, stating that a person cannot be deemed a criminal if they have not been made aware of a new law that applies to a previously legal action. ATF can't claim to have a registry (even though we assume they do), so how do they fulfill their notification obligation to the right people? If they do mainstream marketing, it will bring public awareness to their overreach, and I've got a good feeling that there are more anti-government people ready to go up against them that may not even be typical defenders of the 2A.
ATF changes an interpretation. I followed all the laws and regulations at time of purchase but now I don't meet the new standard because I don't have a tax stamp.
How does the ATF go about notifying the public of this rule change? Many times courts have placed the burden on the regulatory agency for this process, stating that a person cannot be deemed a criminal if they have not been made aware of a new law that applies to a previously legal action. ATF can't claim to have a registry (even though we assume they do), so how do they fulfill their notification obligation to the right people? If they do mainstream marketing, it will bring public awareness to their overreach, and I've got a good feeling that there are more anti-government people ready to go up against them that may not even be typical defenders of the 2A.
Posted on 10/27/20 at 11:35 pm to bayoudude
Question...
Why pay $200 to make it an AOW? Why not just pay to make it an SBR for the same price? More options right?
Why pay $200 to make it an AOW? Why not just pay to make it an SBR for the same price? More options right?
Posted on 10/28/20 at 6:38 am to finchmeister08
I think the AOW tax is $5.
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