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re: WWL 870 at noon today has 1031 Canal Development explaining Hard Rock collapse

Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:42 am to
Posted by Hobnailboot
Minneapolis
Member since Sep 2012
6094 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:42 am to
This one really gets me. I can deal with the potholes and getting paid half as much to have twice as much fun. But this whole Hard Rock ordeal just seems like the absolute intersection of greed, corruption, and incompetence.
Posted by Covingtontiger77
Member since Dec 2015
12269 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:45 am to
Question for all the outraged:


What is your solution to this?


The building collapsed in an historic district wherein if you implode it, you will likely cause severe damage to other buildings in the area.

If you take it down piece by piece you also risk further collapse an damage.


So I’m thinking that a little prudence in developing a plan of such sensitivity is a necessity and an over abundance of caution is warranted.


The workers killed is tragic. The worker being exposed to view is horrific and unfortunate.

But again- you can make a bad situation worse if not done as carefully as possible.

The outrage and the marching on city hall is a mob mentality and a hyper reaction by people that don’t know the nuances of what exactly goes into removing this building and the ramifications of what can happen if the plan goes wrong.


Do you people really think the Kailas family, the GC, and the city want this worker’s legs dangling over Canal St?

Don’t you think if they could safely extract the guy(s) they would send in a team to do this?

Don’t you think if simply going in and imploding the building would solve this issue they would not have done so already?


Perhaps it’s a complicated issue that needs experts from many professionals in order to figure out what exactly needs to be done.


Perhaps

This post was edited on 1/28/20 at 10:46 am
Posted by fightin tigers
Downtown Prairieville
Member since Mar 2008
79851 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:46 am to
No one has an answer. They just believe it should have been done faster.

Most haven't put together anything more complicated than an ikea shelf though.
Posted by HT713
Galations 4:16
Member since Jan 2011
10028 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:48 am to
same. I've lived in a bunch of places, and greed/incompetence/fraud/crumbling infrastructure are not singular to nola, not even a little bit.

but it's been 15 fricking weeks since this thing came down, and their is ZERO sense of urgency about it. I drive pas it every day and just shake my head in disgust.

this feels like a precedent-setter, imho. Imagine if, 108 days after the OKC fed city bombing, the building was still just sitting, there hardly touched.
Posted by Covingtontiger77
Member since Dec 2015
12269 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:49 am to
quote:

o one has an answer. They just believe it should have been done faster. Most haven't put together anything more complicated than an ikea shelf though.



Exactly.



There had been and is always that friction between labor and “big business.” The masses calling for a knee jerk response don’t know what they are talking about.

Again- NO ONE WANTS THE GUY’s LEGS DANGLING OVER CANAL STREET!!


Posted by HT713
Galations 4:16
Member since Jan 2011
10028 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:51 am to
quote:

What is your solution to this?



frankly: better communication

if the reason they're not already working on getting it fixed is because they feel they don't know how, they need to communicate that clearly and openly.

right now the perception (which may or may not be the reality) is that nothing is happening with it while fault is determined.

Posted by Hobnailboot
Minneapolis
Member since Sep 2012
6094 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:52 am to
I dont think that's where the outrage is coming from. I think, in general, people feel that incompetence led to the initial collapse. Everything that's happened since then is just more fuel on the fire. To see the Developer come out and claim that he's not responsible put people over the edge.
Posted by fightin tigers
Downtown Prairieville
Member since Mar 2008
79851 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:53 am to
quote:

this feels like a precedent-setter, imho. Imagine if, 108 days after the OKC fed city bombing, the building was still just sitting, there hardly touched.



The cause of the failure was known, demolition was still tied up in courts holding up the destruction.

No surrounding buildings.

Half the height, which sort of matters.

Bodies were left in the building until after demolition.

Had the budget of the federal government.
Posted by Covingtontiger77
Member since Dec 2015
12269 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:53 am to
[quote] Imagine if, 108 days after the OKC fed city bombing, the building was still just sitting, there hardly touched.[/


Question: Is the federal govt going to indemnify everyone if they go in and just implode this thing haphazardly and multiple hundred year old buildings collapse as a result?


If that’s the case, please call the City and the developer ASAP to let them know you got Trump to sign off on just blowing the thing up and the Feds will take care of all of the fall out.

This ain’t tinker toys or the popsicle model you make/ made at camp.
This post was edited on 1/28/20 at 10:55 am
Posted by HT713
Galations 4:16
Member since Jan 2011
10028 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:55 am to
quote:

Everything that's happened since then is just more fuel on the fire. To see the Developer come out and claim that he's not responsible put people over the edge.




bingo. to see this collapse in a vacuum and ask people for patience is one thing, but zoom out and look at the attitude around the city regarding infrastructure, corruption, greed, etc

tell ya what, when bitch-arse jeff parish sends me a red light ticket for going 23 in a 20, NOBODY stands around and navel-gazes about who's responsible or what's to be done, they want their money ASAP

people are tired of the ones in power playing by a different set of rules than the working class
Posted by fightin tigers
Downtown Prairieville
Member since Mar 2008
79851 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:56 am to
quote:

To see the Developer come out and claim that he's not responsible put people over the edge.



Did you expect the developer not to blame the contractor?
Posted by HT713
Galations 4:16
Member since Jan 2011
10028 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 10:57 am to
I'm not saying they should implode, I'm saying they need to do something

literally fricking anything just to give the impression to us taxpayers that this issue is important, or that it matters.


let me ask you this: can you show me anything surrounding the cleanup/recovery of this collapse that's been accomplished in the last 30 days? 45? genuine question
Posted by Hobnailboot
Minneapolis
Member since Sep 2012
6094 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:04 am to
Ultimately the Developer hires the Architects, Engineers, and Contractors right? Should the Developer be totally unaccountable for a failure like this? Pretty sure that's not how it works legally although they may be starting his Criminal Defense in that interview.
Posted by Covingtontiger77
Member since Dec 2015
12269 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:04 am to
ote]people are tired of the ones in power playing by a different set of rules than the working class[/quote]

There it is.


The haves taking advantage of the have nots argument.


Ah jealousy/envy/spite the go to.

Reading about the developer, they appear to be an immigrant family that came over to America to get their piece of the American dream. Looks like they have built a pretty successful life for themselves.

I doubt they said, “hey f-it let’s build the most shoddy hotel we can to save a few bucks. If it falls, it falls what do we care.”

And then when it collapsed they just went, “ oh well, sucks for those workers. Leave the bastards in the building until we get around to it. Their lives don’t matter”


shite happens.

Posted by Hobnailboot
Minneapolis
Member since Sep 2012
6094 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:08 am to
quote:

Reading about the developer, they appear to be an immigrant family that came over to America to get their piece of the American dream.


quote:

shite happens.


Interesting take. Haven't heard that angle yet.
Posted by AutoYes_Clown
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2012
5383 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:11 am to
quote:


The main question that needs answering on this is WHO decided it was time to remove the reshores from the underside of the concrete decks that are now dangling from the structure prior to the load-bearing metal stud members were in place. Once this is confirmed, the entity at fault will be identified.


This may not be the forum and I havent followed this closely:

In my world, this falls under shoring engineering. The temporary formwork itself is fully engineered, reviewed and stamped. Material specification is also controlled by engineering.

So my question is, was there a engineered shoring here? Id imagine that info would be tight lipped under lock and key in a box with an attorney sitting on it.
Posted by HT713
Galations 4:16
Member since Jan 2011
10028 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:18 am to
quote:

shite happens.



thanks for your contributions to keep this state ranked 50th or 49th out 50 in every important category for the last 25 years


quote:

they appear to be an immigrant family that came over to America to get their piece of the American dream. Looks like they have built a pretty successful life for themselves.


quote:

WWL-TV first exposed graft by the original lead developer on the project, Praveen Kailas, in 2012, and based on the station's reporting, federal prosecutors charged Kailas with conspiracy and theft of public funds.

He pleaded guilty and was sentenced to 30 months in federal prison in December 2013. Judge Sarah Vance had harsh words for Praveen's father, Mohan, during the sentencing, stating from the bench that he had let his son take the fall for him.


quote:

In 2014, the city sent demand letters to Kailas for more than $300,000 in unpaid permitting and inspection fees.



what's your connection to this guy, that you're online shilling for him? I live and work in NOLA and it's pretty much universally-accepted that the Kailas family has AT LEAST major fault in this situation. at the very least, the city should never have let he and his family take on such a large project with their sketchy past.
Posted by Hobnailboot
Minneapolis
Member since Sep 2012
6094 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:32 am to
Poor immigrant family just putting in hard work to better themselves and the city of New Orleans. All a big misunderstanding. Carry on Mohan
Posted by HT713
Galations 4:16
Member since Jan 2011
10028 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:57 am to
lmao for real, I actually can't believe that's a sincere argument he's making


he should be a lawyer.

"sir your client got absolutely hammered and ran over a family of 5, how could he possibly walk free?"

"hey, shite happens"
Posted by Ice Cold
Over Macho Grande
Member since Jun 2004
18953 posts
Posted on 1/28/20 at 11:59 am to
quote:

Covingtontiger77
quote:

MAGA USA
quote:

Reading about the developer, they appear to be an immigrant family that came over to America to get their piece of the American dream. Looks like they have built a pretty successful life for themselves.
Does not compute...
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