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re: Was the Montreal Screwjob A Work or A Shoot?

Posted on 5/21/18 at 3:17 pm to
Posted by Big Balls
Texas
Member since Nov 2014
846 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 3:17 pm to
quote:

we are still talking about it 20+ years later.


This. And this was the birth of Vince's on-air persona. Before that he was just a commentator and Jack Tunney played owner and CEO. Whatever it was, it was the best thing to happen to WWE at a time when they needed it most.
Posted by oleyeller
Vols, Bitch
Member since Oct 2012
32611 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 3:28 pm to
shawn knew!!! he lied!!! vince got punched in the face. Him and shawn sucked each other off, the end
Posted by Pecker
Rocky Top
Member since May 2015
16674 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 3:35 pm to
I've never watched more than a combined 10 minutes of professional wrestling in my life, but I just awared myself of the Montreal Screwjob on da wikipedias.

quote:

The Montreal Screwjob (also called the Montreal Incident;[1][2][3] French: Le Coup Tordu de Montréal) was an infamous and controversial legitimate professional wrestling incident in which World Wrestling Federation (WWF, now World Wrestling Entertainment/WWE) owner Vince McMahon and WWF employees covertly manipulated the pre-determined outcome of the match between Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels at the 1997 Survivor Series. The pay-per-view (PPV) event was held on November 9, 1997, at the Molson Centre in Montreal, Quebec, Canada. The manipulation – a "shoot screwjob" in professional wrestling parlance – occurred without Hart's knowledge and resulted in Hart, the reigning WWF World Heavyweight Champion, losing the title to Michaels in Hart's last match with the WWF before departing for rival promotion World Championship Wrestling (WCW). The "screwjob" is generally believed to be an off-screen betrayal of Hart, who was one of the WWF's longest-tenured and most popular performers at the time.

Hart won the WWF World Heavyweight Championship at SummerSlam in August 1997. A week prior to Survivor Series, Hart, who had performed for the WWF since 1984, signed a contract to perform with WCW beginning in December 1997. McMahon sought to prevent Hart from leaving the company as the champion, but Hart was unwilling to lose the title to Michaels – with whom he had a long feud both on-screen and off – at Survivor Series in his home country. Hart, Michaels, and McMahon came to an agreement where the Survivor Series match would end with a disqualification, which under normal rules would result in Hart retaining the title. Hart would then lose or forfeit the title at a later date. However, McMahon decided without Hart's knowledge that Michaels would win the title at Survivor Series. Accounts differ as to who exactly was involved in the plan and the extent of their involvement. The plan was executed when match referee Earl Hebner, on direct order from McMahon, ended the match as Michaels held Hart in the Sharpshooter submission hold, Hart's signature finishing move, even though Hart had not submitted. Michaels was declared the victor by submission and crowned as the new WWF World Heavyweight Champion.

The Montreal Screwjob has garnered a notorious legacy both on-screen and off, and was partly chronicled in the documentary film Hitman Hart: Wrestling with Shadows (1998). The far-reaching impact of the incident led to its adoption as a theme in matches and storylines of the WWF's "Attitude Era" and the creation of the character, "Mr. McMahon", the evil boss. Many wrestling fans, and several within the business, believe the entire incident was an elaborate work executed in collaboration with Hart. Nonetheless, Hart was ostracized from the WWF while McMahon and Michaels continued to receive angry responses from audiences for many years in Hart's home country of Canada. Hart and McMahon later reconciled, and Hart was inducted into the WWE Hall of Fame on April 1, 2006. On the January 4, 2010 episode of WWE Raw, Hart, in his first appearance on live WWE television since the Montreal Screwjob, had a lengthy on-screen discussion with Michaels about the Montreal Screwjob and other events in their past, and agreed to call a truce, bringing closure to the incident after more than 12 years.[4][5] Both men sat side-by-side and discussed the incident in detail for a 2011 WWE Home Video release.[6] Longtime industry writer Mike Johnson referred to their 1997 Survivor Series bout as "arguably the most talked-about match in the history of professional wrestling".[7]


Posted by Bard
Definitely NOT an admin
Member since Oct 2008
60257 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 3:52 pm to
Massive shoot. You can tell by HBK's reactions both during the match and when watching the Brett Hart documentary that was being made at the time.
Posted by Havoc
Member since Nov 2015
39566 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 3:58 pm to
Shoot that started out as a work.
Posted by pioneerbasketball
Team Bunchie
Member since Oct 2005
139098 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 4:42 pm to
Wrestling with shadows
Posted by Northshore Saint
Loranger, LA
Member since Feb 2013
1864 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 4:42 pm to
It was a shoot. Sad thing is it didn't have to come down to that if Bret would've just agreed to drop the title at Survivor Series or before that. Vince was afraid, and for good reason, that Bret would show up on Nitro with the WWF belt.

Posted by Breaux
Member since Nov 2005
4672 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 4:44 pm to
Wrestling is trashy as frick
Posted by cardswinagain
Member since Jun 2013
13483 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 4:46 pm to
Apparently Triple H had a big part in it as well
Posted by ReauxlTide222
St. Petersburg
Member since Nov 2010
92359 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 5:10 pm to
quote:

Work = scripted/planned
Shoot = offscript/unplanned/real
HA, nerds.










Jk
Posted by Tactical1
Denham Springs
Member since May 2010
27179 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 5:18 pm to
It was a shoot.

And as I've gotten older I've grown to understand that Bret Hart did screw Bret Hart.
Posted by Rebel
Graceland
Member since Jan 2005
144673 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 5:28 pm to
It was a work that Brett Hart was unaware of.
Posted by pioneerbasketball
Team Bunchie
Member since Oct 2005
139098 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 9:10 pm to
quote:

And as I've gotten older I've grown to understand that Bret Hart did screw Bret Hart.

This...He had plenty of chances to give it up but couldn't lose in canada
Posted by Korin
Member since Jan 2014
37935 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 9:22 pm to
The older I get, the more I think it was a work. It was such a win/win situation for everyone involved.
Posted by Korin
Member since Jan 2014
37935 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 9:25 pm to
quote:

Massive shoot. You can tell by HBK's reactions both during the match and when watching the Brett Hart documentary that was being made at the time.

Sounds like you got worked into a shoot, brotherdudejack.
Posted by Jiggy Moondust
South Carolina
Member since Oct 2013
1052 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 10:03 pm to
You like wrestling and C2C. You my people.. It was a shoot.

Rumour and innuendo
Posted by cleeveclever
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2008
2046 posts
Posted on 5/21/18 at 10:25 pm to
quote:

This...He had plenty of chances to give it up but couldn't lose in canada


I think it was partly because he'd been played up so heavily as a Canadian hero by Vince for so many years and partly because of his outright disdain for Michael's character and personality at that time.

Brett thought he and Vince were on the same page but Vince was looking out for business. He seems to be pretty good at that and its served him and his company well.
Posted by pioneerbasketball
Team Bunchie
Member since Oct 2005
139098 posts
Posted on 5/22/18 at 12:40 am to
quote:

You like wrestling and C2C. You my people.. 

Posted by Pilot Tiger
North Carolina
Member since Nov 2005
74076 posts
Posted on 5/22/18 at 6:38 am to
quote:

You can tell by HBK's reactions both during the match and when watching the Brett Hart documentary that was being made at the time.
I think HBK was in on it and was acting like he had no idea
Posted by Pilot Tiger
North Carolina
Member since Nov 2005
74076 posts
Posted on 5/22/18 at 6:42 am to
quote:

I think it was partly because he'd been played up so heavily as a Canadian hero by Vince for so many years and partly because of his outright disdain for Michael's character and personality at that time. Brett thought he and Vince were on the same page but Vince was looking out for business. He seems to be pretty good at that and its served him and his company well.
yea and the industry was changing. WCW, with the backing of a major tv network, began their attempts at hording top talent. They were giving huge contracts, guaranteed ones at that, and weren't requiring their talent to be on the road 200 days/year performing at house shows like WWE was.

Vince knew he couldn't keep up and couldn't afford to pay talent like WCW was starting to so he wished Bret good luck but needed him to do a job.

I don't blame Bret for leaving nor do I blame him for not liking the idea of dropping the belt in Canada before he left but Bret should have done the job and done what was best for business. Though you could probably argue that the screwjob angle ended up being best for business although I don't think it was planned that way.
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