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Started By
Message
re: United's dragged passenger hires high-powered Chicago personal injury lawyer
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:38 am to LSU alum wannabe
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:38 am to LSU alum wannabe
quote:
Correct me if wrong, but these aren't vacationing United staff who are flyiing standby and bumping people. These are crew that are needed elsewhere. Delaying them causes a domino effect that touches hundreds of people on multiple flights.
Several other ways to get crew from Chicago to Louisville. United was too lazy/cheap to use any of the other options. Also pretty sure after the whole thing transpired they were delayed anyway to the point where a shuttle could of gotten them to Louisville faster
1
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:38 am to dukke v
quote:
why was he taken off the plane???????
Because it would have cost more money to make other travel arrangements for their crew.
Or so United thought at the time
.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:39 am to VerlanderBEAST
It seems flight crews are unionized and have rules regarding transport - so actually driving is maybe not allowed (dumb as shite but I read that somewhere). Still plenty of options to avoid this though.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:40 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:
Oversold Flight means a flight where there are more Passengers holding valid confirmed Tickets that check-in for the flight within the prescribed check-in time than there are available seats.
Yea, you need to take a deep breath and re-read my argument. You just made it for me. If you want to argue whether or not the check-in time had passed before boarding was complete, or whether the flight was official oversold once the decision was made, or when the gate agent got the memo then fine.
IMO, when the decision was made to include the crew (by all indications before check in) the flight was oversold.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:40 am to AwesomeSauce
quote:There is a definition for "Overbooked' in the contract, why do you keep talking about "implies"???
Overbooked implies 70+ seats booked on a 70 seat plane. Oversold covers overbooked, but also in this case where less seats were available than originally planned.
quote:Again, there's a definition, no semantics involved
it's in the code of carriage that they can deny boarding in an "oversold" situation.
quote:
Oversold Flight means a flight where there are more Passengers holding valid confirmed Tickets that check-in for the flight within the prescribed check-in time than there are available seats.
Pretty sure that prescribed check-in time is covered here:
quote:
Check-In Time Limits - UA has the right to cancel reservations (whether or not confirmed), deny boarding and/or refuse the acceptance of checked baggage of any Passenger who fails to present himself/herself within the applicable check-in or loading gate time limits for Passengers and/or Baggage.
Domestic flights, except those departing Guam:
For Passengers who do not need to check baggage, Passenger must complete the purchase of the ticket(s), check-in and obtain a boarding pass at least 30 minutes prior to scheduled departure.
EXCEPTION: At the following airports, Passengers must complete check-in at least 45 minutes prior to scheduled departure: Baltimore, MD and San Juan, Puerto Rico.
For Passengers who do need to check baggage, Passenger must complete the purchase of the ticket(s), check-in, obtain a boarding pass, and complete baggage check-in at least 30 minutes prior to scheduled departure.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:41 am to AwesomeSauce
So they retroactively oversold the plane after all the paid passengers boarded?
Even if that argument held up in court it would be a PR nightmare because it would cause people to switch to another airline.
Even if that argument held up in court it would be a PR nightmare because it would cause people to switch to another airline.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:42 am to Choupique19
quote:
But if several policemen are telling me I must leave an area I will comply whether I think they have the right to do that or not, and then I can fight that argument in a more peaceful way at a later date.
quote:If he agreed to leave the plane, that could be argued as giving up his rights since he agreed, thus beginning a losing battle for him to protest it afterward.
Some people have 0% chance of ever getting roughed up by authority and power because they know not to fight a losing battle.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:43 am to shel311
So, unless overbooked vs not enough seats due to United having to get their crew to the next job is a technicality that the courts would listen to, its seems to me that the contract is rather clear...
quote:
Boarding Priorities - If a flight is Oversold, no one may be denied boarding against his/her will until UA or other carrier personnel first ask for volunteers who will give up their reservations willingly in exchange for compensation as determined by UA. If there are not enough volunteers, other Passengers may be denied boarding involuntarily in accordance with UA’s boarding priority.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:43 am to Choupique19
quote:
Some people have 0% chance of ever getting roughed up by authority and power because they know not to fight a losing battle.
Absolutely agreed. Some people think the law should be enforced, others think it's not worth the headache or getting beat up.
Rolling over is always easier than asserting your rights.
If you're ever arrested, waive all rights to your property, make sure to not ask for a lawyer, consent to all searches, waive your fifth amendment rights, and plead guilty to all charges.
Not doing that means you could run the risk of not complying.
ETA:. Tell your story to Jeremy Mardis. I am sure he's sympathetic to your cause.
This post was edited on 4/12/17 at 10:48 am
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:43 am to Lou Pai
quote:
Fine, not overbooked in terms of selling more tickets than there are seats. But oversold vs. the requirements of the airline, which as others have said, have a domino effect of potentially hundreds of other passengers.
The crew was needed for a 7am Louisville flight the following day, this whole issue started at 3:40pm the previous day. The distance is 350 miles, they had 15 hours or more.
My issue is it is absurd for any company to use physical force to remove someone in that situation, physical force should be the last resort and there is no way this was the last resort.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:43 am to Choupique19
quote:
Some people have 0% chance of ever getting roughed up by authority and power because they know not to fight a losing battle
There are dead people killed at the hands of authority who will disagree with you.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:43 am to AwesomeSauce
quote:They were not checked in before the prescribed check in time, so the oversold/overbooked argument does not apply.
IMO, when the decision was made to include the crew (by all indications before check in) the flight was oversold.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:44 am to teke184
quote:Yes. From what I understand they did so after the prescribed check in time, which goes against their policy
So they retroactively oversold the plane after all the paid passengers boarded?
At the time of the prescribed check in time, the flight was full, not overbooked, as I understand it.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:44 am to NYNolaguy1
But why did they pick HIM?????
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:44 am to Boston911
quote:
You're right, United messed up, BUT, the passenger was in total control of the situation initially. Once he made his decision, he then gave control of the situation to United. Once you give up control of the situation, you've got to expect a reaction, regardless that the reaction may go overboard like this one did. IMO, the passenger owns part of this.
NOPE. You got it backwards. Passenger messed up, BUT, United responded horribly and worse.
If you make a mistake at work, you're at fault. If your boss responds by cursing you out, screaming at you, or physically harming you.. your boss has done far worse.
If you get pulled over for speeding, you're at fault. If the cop decides to slam you onto the ground, taze you, and arrest you.. the cop has done far worse.
The passenger made a poor decision, but United/security guards made a far worse one. They are the ones in charge and in a position of power. They are the ones who are on the clock. They are the ones who are supposed to be trained to react professionally.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:46 am to SaintBrees
quote:
If you get pulled over for speeding, you're at fault
Lol wat?
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:46 am to dukke v
quote:
But why did they pick HIM??
It was based on the people with the least amount of frequent flier miles, number of people in a party, and the likelihood of him flying UAL again.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:47 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
There are dead people killed at the hands of authority who will disagree with you.
No doubt that is a true statement, but I'm sure not going to increase my chances by daring three security personnel to forcibly remove me from a plane.
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:48 am to NYNolaguy1
Is speeding not being at fault? You're at fault.. for speeding.. hence getting pulled over.
However, not worthy of being beat up or tazed. If that were to happen, yes you shouldn't have been speeding, but the cop is ultimately at fault for reacting in that manner.
I don't understand the whole "you did something wrong, you deserve XYZ" when situations like this United one happen. Refusing to leave a seat you paid for does not warrant being beat up.
FWIW, I fly United more than any other airline and will continue to do so. I don't boycott businesses.
However, not worthy of being beat up or tazed. If that were to happen, yes you shouldn't have been speeding, but the cop is ultimately at fault for reacting in that manner.
I don't understand the whole "you did something wrong, you deserve XYZ" when situations like this United one happen. Refusing to leave a seat you paid for does not warrant being beat up.
FWIW, I fly United more than any other airline and will continue to do so. I don't boycott businesses.
This post was edited on 4/12/17 at 10:50 am
Posted on 4/12/17 at 10:48 am to NYNolaguy1
Oh ok.... I don't fly .....
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