re: The obesity epidemic

I like Dr. Spencer Nadolsky. He specializes in treating obesity and in lipidology; he's a wealth of info.

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Well according to the autistic doc, actually eating right is impossible so there's no point.

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Give me a link for this, or shut the frick up. I'm waiting.

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Lol, 2% of the population that needs intervention is an utterly massive demographic when we are talking about disease profiles. I'm sorry you can't understand this point.

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Being fat isn't a "disease" in almost every case. You are fat because you choose to be fat, not because a virus attacked you

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I would have painstakingly tried to communicate my point

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You've evidently been trying to do that, and failing miserably.

I literally just said I think we agree, yet you are still name-calling like a toddler that didn't get their way.

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Being fat isn't a "disease" in almost every case. You are fat because you choose to be fat, not because a virus attacked you

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Again, if you are talking about a population of just obese people who need intervention, you are talking about a demographic higher than the estimated prevalence of people diagnosed with T2DM each year. I don't know how to make you understand the utter scale of what you are invoking, but it's clear to me you aren't on the ground seeing this day-to-day, nor do you have any appropriate background material to even contextualize this. You can't seem to conceive of the scale of a point you yourself made, and refuse to see what I'm talking about.

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I literally just said I think we agree, yet you are still name-calling like a toddler that didn't get their way.

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Well first, I love name-calling. I've been doing it on the internet since I got it in the year of our lord 1997. Secondly, you keep suggesting that I said things when I know I didn't say them, and then don't produce anything when I ask for proof. That's asking for a name-calling and a pussy-thumping.

There’s really nothing complex about it. People make shite complex to keep jobs and make money

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There’s really nothing complex about it. People make shite complex to keep jobs and make money

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Shut up.

aromatase inhibiters...
blueberries, garlic, broccoli, turmeric, white button mushrooms many others
there are supplements zinc, grape-seed, selenium others

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crazy4lsu

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So are you saying there is an epidemic of metabolic disease in the obese population? Metabolic disease as in issues with how many calories they burn? I ask because there was a paper that Layne and Alan posted and Alan did a review in that shows this is not nearly as common as once thought.

BTW the doctor hulk talked about is an amazing resource, him and his brother who is also a doc, and if you are involved in this as you portray you should absolutely reach out.


And like HFP said, Mingo is usually right about 99% of the time on nutrition stuff and is very much like Lyle Mcdonald in that although he is right, sometimes he comes off as an a-hole. I don't think he really did at first in this thread but people jump on him quickly and assume. He is very much of the believe, as am I, that for 99% of obese people it's simply a matter of will power and staying vigilant. The problem with compliance long term is people look at diet as a short term thing, it can't be. It's very much like alcoholism in that you always have to be weary and mindful of it.



Ok so I had time to kill and read the studies you posted

Study 1 was only 16 participants and all were put on a crash diet. All did maintain ffm but also had severe downgrade in metabolism. Participants were on average 50% Bodyfat and close to 150kg over weight(300ish pounds) and lost and average of 125 lbs in 30 weeks. So yea no shite, if you average 4 lbs weightloss for 30 weeks....yea might have some problems with metabolism. 125lbs is a years worth of weight-loss. Also this was done at a ranch similar to biggest laser and we already know there are issues in these situations. As usual in these situations horrible programming from an exercise side too. 6 days a week of 90m of circuit training is retarded.


But the bigger question is how in the frick do you allow yourself to be 300lbs overweight to begin with? And that is not even close to 2% of population, not even 2% of obese population. 300lbs over weight means females are over 400 and males closer to 500. That's fricking insane and 100% you have to be almost trying to get that big period.

Study 2: is on the biggest loser stuff. We already know the issues that go on with people on those shows. 100% complete crash diet, hours of exercise, manipulation of weight to win etc.....all this shows is crash dieting combined with hours of very very shitty programming of exercise is not good for you and shown to cause issues. Not even gonna get into this as there are tons of papers going over the why and how.

Again these participants are losing on average 125lbs in about 12 weeks or something stupid like that....so yea we are going to have issues especially with the bullshite and horrible programming "trainers" like Jillian fricking michals put out.


Study 3

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At a mean follow-up of 3.2 ± 2.1 years after SG, WSSG patients of both sexes have a FM, FFM, and RMR comparable to that of healthy WSNO individuals within the same age and BMI interval. These findings further support bariatric surgery-induced weight loss as a physiologic process and indicate that young patients, in the setting of an adequate preoperative and postoperative specific diet and moderate physical activity, do not suffer from excessive FFM depletion after SG in the mid-term.

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So am I missing something? Rmr is same as those who didn't have surgery, Don't really understand why this was linked.


Study 4 Again using biggest loser stupid shite as a baseline when we know the issues there.



And just to clear things up, I'm not against gastric bypass surgery but in the studies you linked, most of the participants are having to lose 100+ lbs and many times are still in the overweight or obese category and certainly are if you go by body fat. That is the bigger issues, how the frick you let yourself get to the point where you need to lose 100+ lbs.

Hell I was bad enough when I got to 245 at 5'10. I couldn't tie my shoes without being out of breath. Another 40 or 50 lbs....yea I would have died

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I ask because there was a paper that Layne and Alan posted and Alan did a review in that shows this is not nearly as common as once thought.

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Did you look through the papers I linked? I'm talking about management of relapsing obesity in the milieu of other comorbidities.

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He is very much of the believe, as am I, that for 99% of obese people it's simply a matter of will power and staying vigilant. The problem with compliance long term is people look at diet as a short term thing, it can't be.

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That's all fine and well, but the management practices absolutely matter, which is why it was a big deal when the AACE and the AMA took out position statements that said you should regard obesity as a 'chronic' disease. The 2014 paper from the Journal of Endocrinology and other papers suggest upwards of 5 years of continued neuroendocrine dysfunction, which is a relatively new insight as far as I'm aware, and the 2018 paper on gut microbiota and the development of obesity suggested dysregulation of neurohormonal adaptations as a factor in relapsing obesity.

The compliance data isn't not yet robust in terms of how to handle chronic care with regard to obesity. While people have suggested alcoholism and drug use as useful corollaries, I actually think something like cancer can be a useful model, as adipose tissue itself has endocrine functions and thinking of it more like cancer can be a way of approaching treatment as something long-term. I'd argue treating it like cancer adds to the seriousness of the situation for those morbidly obese and is likely to yield better compliance results than coopting strategies from diabetes, for example.